Thread for those who loved the movie

Hummmm...I didnt realise that, excellent point.
That's why TLJ is so amazing, we notice subtles aspects and details every time we rematch the movie or dicuss about it.

 

Definitely. From the story, to the visuals to the acting - the attention to detail is remarkable. Hamill, Fisher and Driver in particular put so much into their performances. Driver is so authentic and the little subtle things he does - an eye twitch here and a sharp in take of breath there, are remarkable little nuances that really give further insight into his character. Same with Hamill, he really put a lot into this role, whether he agreed with the direction or not. And I'm blown away by his performance.

But just going back to the narrative, that people seem to complain about most (be it the time given to the Porgs or Phasma's "underuse"), I really think people need to look again. I think the problem is people are putting too much stock in plot. Does Finn actually do anything that changes the plot? Not really. Is Phasma the villain she was talked up to be that drives the plot in some way? Again, no. The Porgs - do they impact upon anything significant? Nope. But that isn't what RJ was doing with TLJ. It wasn't about any of the characters really pushing the plot along. It was about their personal development. Phasma for example, was the bogeywoman to Finn "The Resistance Hero". Him confronting and defeating her was a strong metaphor for his development as a character. Stormtrooper - Deserter - "Coward", Loyal Friend - Resistance Hero. It's also worth noting DJ's impact upon Finn and how that will shape his character choices going forward in regards to trust and how best to end the war) The Porgs, as I mentioned, were there for Chewie. Poe gets very little done in the film (he causes a lot of Resistance deaths) but by the end of the film, he is ready to lead the Resistance (which is quite beautiful, sad and incredible when you consider that IX would've needed a replacement for Leia and it's almost as if his story was written with her death in mind). It's very much like TESB in that way. Very little happens in that film other than Luke confronting his father. The equilibrium at the beginning is pretty much the same as at the end. And it is the same with TLJ.


Another subtle thing is in how the FO are kept in line by fear and brainwashing. Clearly, Snoke was the power behind that and when he confronts and abuses Hux on the bridge at the beginning, that kind of thing must ensure that the officers and stormtroopers do as they're told. And then in contrast to this, once Snoke is dead and Ren is the leader, Luke makes a mockery out of him in front of "the entire FO". This then emphasises the importance of Luke's "hope". He removes the fear of the leadership from the FO. With Snoke dead and Ren shown up by Luke, it paves the way for the Resistance to make a resurgence and hopefully match the FO in IX (with the FO crumbling from within).

I also like how Luke Skywalker is really the same Luke, deep down, he has always been. What's funny is how people "despise" TLJ because of how Luke's character has changed. But he hasn't really changed. And that is revealed in the amazing scene between him and Yoda. The 23yr old Luke is visible, once again looking to the future instead of being in the moment. Desperately trying to be the wise old Jedi he thought he should be. I've said it before, but it strikes me how he doesn't really think the Jedi should end nor would he ever have actually ended it or died without restoring the Jedi. He's just wearing a mask (because of his failures)...and Yoda shows him the folly of his actions.

So to conclude, I bloody love this film.

 

One of the cool little details in TLJ is the fact that space is slowly starting to become 3D. When Finn, Rose, BB-8 and DJ jump out of hyperspace near The Supremacy, they find themselves under the ship, being able to see its bottom. Also, when Rey goes to meet Kylo, Millennium Falcon is clearly above the Mega Destroyer and her escape pod has to clearly descend to land in a hangar. This happens surprisingly rarely in sci-fi films.

 

I agree with all of this. There are so many small moments that are only caught after multiple viewings. Yoda's speech is wonderful - like its his last lesson to Luke, showing that you are never too old for a lesson.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 22, 2018, Original Post Date: Mar 22, 2018 ---

I would argue that Finn does push the plot along. If he doesn't go on that trip, then the FO would not find out about the Resistance's plan to go to Crait's surface. Remember, that entire plot line is meant to show that haphazard action can directly endanger those you are trying to save. It takes the tropes of crazy plans working out and turns them on their heads. His story also moves forward because he's still trying to flee - and this plan forces him to stay, which gives Rose someone to fight for after she loses her sister and thus gives us the idea that rebellions are built on not just hope but love.

 

@JCooper1995 Mega +1 from me!!! 53 yr old boy here that last scene was me in 1977!!! RJ did awesome job

 

It's really awesome to see Yoda again. I suspect that this might be the last time time we see him in a saga film? If it is it's a fitting tribute to a legendary character.

 

Good point. I guess I was just alluding to what some people say about Finn because they expected him to be a Jedi Knight and be the main character. But you're right, the plot is moved along by his role. But like I say, the entire film itself is mostly about personal development rather than having a tangible change to the state of the galaxy (though of course Luke's act brings much needed hope that will have a tremendous impact). It's very much a middle movie in that respect, just like TESB. And criticisms of the narrative relating to this are in my view unfair and missing the point.

 

Any unlike the other films it takes place directly after TFA. So for all of these characters where we left them in TFA was only half-way to their full character development. It gave the movie a very different vibe than any other SW film. We didn't have any exposition to explain the changes to our leads - all the exposition could be kept to explain Luke's exile.

I'm very excited for the next film as I gather time will pass and we will get some exposition to explain Leia's death (I still believe it will be from natural causes due to the injuries suffered from exposure to space) and how the Resistance has been rebuilt into a Rebellion. I would LOVE for the film to go back to Tatooine one more time or even Endor or Bespin and give us some new planets.

I suspect Rey will go away searching for something Jedi related to finish her training. Luke as Force Ghost will help her. Ren will cull together the KOR from the corners of the galaxy and aim to take down the Rey. The FO will push hard to continue to conquer the galaxy. And I think the Rebellion will win not by an overwhelming battle, but by encouraging the FO to implode between those loyal to Hux and those loyal to Ren.

 

I really want to see my hero Luke go on an adventure. This really bummed me out at first, but that time has passed for Luke. Hamill struggled with this as well during production. He's not really cut out to be a super hero anymore. Hamill's confidence needed some boosting in that area.

I love that we were given that moment of heroism at the end. Luke doubles down on that final confrontation he had with his father. Now with his nephew he doesn't attack. It rhymes, but not the way we expected.

 

I totally agree, and I'd say it's the biggest problem of TLJ by far. Interestingly, the crawl reveals almost nothing we don't already know this time, also a first.

Well yeah, they blew up the seat of the Republic like ten minutes ago.

Yep, that's what the First Order was preparing to do at the end of the last movie...

Yep, that's what the Resistance was preparing to do at the end of the last movie...

Yep, we know that the First Order knows the location of the Resistance base.

Really, the only thing that is arguably new information is that the Resistance is mobilizing for an escape, and that's something that the very first few shots of the film make clear anyway.

Typically the crawls have set the scene. This was more like a "Last Week On..." segment.

Kind of a strange thing and I agree, hopefully IX will give us a bigger time jump.

 

I'm not sure how the next film can start without a time jump. First off all the actors are 4-5 years older than they were when they started filming TFA. It makes sense to make a jump around that amount of time. This will also be useful in how to deal with Leia.

The weird thing is Leia/Luke aren't that old. They were 53 (canon age) when this trilogy started. So it's not like Leia is going to die of old age. I think they should have just recast her for the last film. Seems like the entire story had to change since they decided not to recast her.

 

I think re casting leia would just piss off the fans

 

For the sake of the story I would recast her too. I'm sure the relationship between mother and son was a big theme in IX and I hope it still is. Somehow...

 

I think you're both right. If Leia was going to have a small part in the last episode I'd get it, but it seems pretty clear the original intent was for her to have a major confrontation with her son in the last film. It's my assumption that's what CT could never resolve after Fisher's passing. If Lucasfilm decided not to recast then the entire movie had to be reworked.

 

i still think they can (maybe even should) do it, but in a limited way.
if she's retired to the outer rim and all we get from her is scrappy holos and her voice, while Poe has the leadership etc.
then, even if we may not get a full-blown reconciliation between her and Ben, they can either interact painfully from afar or we can end the film with him on his way to join her.

 

I don't really want to see Poe as a leader. Make it right this time and send Finn and Poe on an adventure. Yeah, technically Poe can still be the leader then...

I say: everything or nothing.

 

my very short wish list for IX:

more Hux and Ren together (and let's leave the moustache twirling in a closet where it belongs).
more Finn and Poe together.
Ben lives, Leia lives (somehow!); they reconcile. : 'o (

if i get two out of three, i'll be happy. hahahaha

 

I agree with that list, but now I have to imagine Hux or Kylo with a moustache. Haha!

 

i wish they'd dirty Hux up. i want to see a time break that has the FO in power, but constantly fighting to hold it and it's taken its toll.
but then i always wanted a finale with Hux guarding some last citadel (the Finalizer), holding against impossible odds, disheveled but somehow dignified, refusing to the last to give up out of sheer stubborn misguidedness.

that's the tragedy i'd like to see.
just the waste of it all.
which Ben finally accepts but Hux never can. : o (