1. Due to the increased amount of spam bots on the forum, we are strengthening our defenses. You may experience a CAPTCHA challenge from time to time.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Notification emails are working properly again. Please check your email spam folder and if you see any emails from the Cantina there, make sure to mark them as "Not Spam". This will help a lot to whitelist the emails and to stop them going to spam.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. IMPORTANT! To be able to create new threads and rate posts, you need to have at least 30 posts in The Cantina.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Before posting a new thread, check the list with similar threads that will appear when you start typing the thread's title.
    Dismiss Notice

SPOILER Obi-Wan Kenobi Ep. 6 Discussion

Discussion in 'Obi-Wan Kenobi' started by Lord Phanatic, Jun 21, 2022.

  1. eeprom

    eeprom Prince of Bebers

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2016
    Posts:
    2,768
    Likes Received:
    6,959
    Trophy Points:
    87,467
    Credits:
    6,860
    Ratings:
    +10,323 / 40 / -11
    In other words: “He was too dangerous to be kept alive.” Hmm, sounds familiar. Now where . . . where have I heard that before? Meh, probably not important.
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Wise Wise x 1
  2. Lord of the Rens

    Lord of the Rens Gatekeeper & Avatar Maker

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2015
    Posts:
    2,878
    Likes Received:
    28,288
    Trophy Points:
    154,367
    Credits:
    18,268
    Ratings:
    +32,050 / 130 / -50
    (pwned)Alderaan has legitimate umbrage with the writer's; as long as they recognize that their hands were tied 40 years before they started.(pwned)
     
  3. Madmartigan

    Madmartigan Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Posts:
    926
    Likes Received:
    2,652
    Trophy Points:
    10,667
    Credits:
    7,754
    Ratings:
    +3,678 / 17 / -5
    OW episode VI screenshots, second part

    ow06010.png

    ow06011.png

    ow06012.png

    ow06013.png

    ow06014.png

    ow06015.png

    ow06016.png

    ow06017.png

    ow06018.png

    ow06019.png

    ow06020.png

    ow06021.png

    ow06022.png

    ow06023.png

    ow06024.png

    ow06025.png

    ow06027.png

    ow06030.png

    Cya in Andor for more screenshots. Cause it looks promising and astonishing
     
    • Great Post Great Post x 3
    • Like Like x 2
  4. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

    Credits:
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    There are complaints of too-dark lighting. I don't think that's a mistake. It must be an artistic decision to show the dark conditions of the galaxy at that point in the saga. Just a small amount of light, before the sun (luke)moves into action in ANH. Same with the lack of familiar music in the series. The name Leia chooses in episode 3, when she's lying to Freck, is Luma. Luma is also a word that refers to the brightness setting in a video, according to Wikipedia.

    The funny thing is, if you adjusted the light settings on your tv to watch it, you're participating in the meaning of the saga. Because, it's the light you bring to the world that lights it.
     
    #124 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 24, 2022
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 24, 2022
    • Like Like x 2
    • Wise Wise x 1
  5. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

    Credits:
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Just to add to that, although it happened in ep. 3, the name Orden came into the story at the same time. It's the name Leia gave to Freck for Kenobi. It means order. The stormtroopers were just following their order, and allowing the vehicle to be driven by Freck-- lower animal consciousness. The stormtrooper cut in half at the gate is their consciousness cut off from the temple-- higher consciousness inside of them.
     
    #125 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 25, 2022
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 25, 2022
    • Informative Informative x 1
  6. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

    Credits:
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    I didn't think I would like this story in the beginning. Now it's one of the best, rich in symbolism. Look how the buildings on Alderaan are repeated in the tall, slender rock formations at the Kenobi-Vader confrontation. The material world in low illumination. "Your strength has returned, but the weakness still remains." Kenobi is the mind with the blue sword, climbing back up from the fall in consciousness. Alderaan will be the world that is destroyed by the dark new moon, the material world in darkness. (death star)
     
    • Like Like x 2
  7. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

    Credits:
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    The sun, Luke, is sort of already racing to get to Alderaan. This show revealed a lot of information about the Star Wars myth. Remember what I wrote about the lotus flower represented both in Padme, and in the dead lotus throne of Palpatine in TROS? On Alderaan, the buildings are artistically presented like a garden. It's the civilization that has grown from the light being in the world. When I first saw it, it reminded me of the rocket garden at Kennedy Space Center. Bail is a fertility god figure. In mythology, Baal is like Hadad or Thor. That adds a lot of meaning to Leia's request in ANH, that it's her father who needs help, because everything's dying in winter and darkness. The dark new moon, (death star) the material world in darkness that has turned into a machine and a system of death and destruction, destroys the whole world in ANH. In comes the new hope, Luke the sun, to bring light back to the galaxy.

    The civilization on Alderaan is presented again as the tall rock formations where Vader and Kenobi fight. A dying and crumbling civilization in darkness and uconsciousness. Kenobi as the mind, with the blue lightsaber, is buried and left for dead in a dying world. But the mind breaks free. The heart and sun, Luke, does not make it in time. He's a long way from bringing the heart and salvation into the story.

    Here's an interesting thought. In winter, the crocus pops up as an early sign of spring. Getting back to the possibility that the name Grogu comes from the Greek pronunciation of crocus, some are saying that they thought they saw something belonging to Grogu in episode 5. Is he a resilient little sprout popping up in the darkness there? Kenobi is a hermetic figure. In Greek myth, Crocus was a friend of Hermes. Kenobi season 2, with Grogu?
     
    #127 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 25, 2022
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 25, 2022
    • Like Like x 2
  8. Madmartigan

    Madmartigan Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Posts:
    926
    Likes Received:
    2,652
    Trophy Points:
    10,667
    Credits:
    7,754
    Ratings:
    +3,678 / 17 / -5
    I loved the dark in this episode.
    Was more artistic, cinematic and meaningful, something last episodes missed almost all the time. It's important to "play" with the light and shadow, shots and images sometimes express and tell much more with them.

    Btw, the amount of information, symbolism, knowledge, thoughts, meanings... you @Sheddai_Lightkeeper have is outstanding :)

    I can't explain that good in english cause is not my first language but I understand all the points. As a writer (only published in my mother language) I also use the classic light and dark fight, and also in the fantasy world I created an inside us, to express and elaborate the story and characters, giving symbolism and meanings through them,, plus the internal fights we have to follow and learn to grow up and follow our paths.
    And of course I have been influenced by SW too.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

    Credits:
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Thank you @Madmartigan . I love the screenshots.

    Do you think that Alderaan in the daytime there is like the back side of the moon or earth, where the moonlight/sunlight is when it's not illuminating the side we see? Or the hemisphere that's experiencing summer when we are experiencing winter. That's where the moon goddess is living after the world goes dark.

    We saw the end of this series at the summer solstice when Alderaan is doing well in daylight, but beginning its decline now. Mountains in the back, they're at their peak. Bail needs help because the moon/light goddess (Leia) is starting to be captured. We saw TROS at the winter solstice, when the longest hours of darkness end.

    In ANH, Bail sends for help again from General Kenobi, because the darkness and death has reached them in their planet's seasonal cycle. He's desperate, and he needs a warrior, because he's overtaken by the darkness, just as his daughter is fully imprisoned by the dark new moon. Light gone from Alderaan.
     
    #129 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 25, 2022
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 25, 2022
    • Like Like x 3
  10. Madmartigan

    Madmartigan Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Posts:
    926
    Likes Received:
    2,652
    Trophy Points:
    10,667
    Credits:
    7,754
    Ratings:
    +3,678 / 17 / -5
    Definetly the white buildings, the green trees and the little princess are the hope. But also represents the dark cause always is coming back. Alderaan is powerful for bringing hope, as its destiny is completly dark. As you said, is beginning its declive.
    I think is the visible side, but the light always hides dark. Without light, would be no shadows.
    All balance but the cost of darkness ruling its time will always be there.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  11. GotTheSilver

    GotTheSilver Rebel Official

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2016
    Posts:
    539
    Likes Received:
    963
    Trophy Points:
    6,692
    Credits:
    1,784
    Ratings:
    +1,839 / 22 / -4
    So, when a Jedi has the opportunity to kill a Sith Lord that has spent the last 10 years hunting down and killing Jedi, he just decides not to???


    To me, this moment basically ruins the character of Obi Wan Kenobi. It achieves the exact opposite of what it is supposed to achieve. It is supposed to show Obi Wan’s emotional growth, as he realizes he did not create Vader and this force of evil is not his fault. But once he has that realization, his very next decision is to allow this evil monster to continue to exist and terrorize the galaxy. With this decision, Obi Wan actually DOES become responsible for this evil from that point forward. It’s as though Obi Wan was thinking, “This guy killed younglings and murdered Jedi, but I didn’t create him so it is not my problem.” This is the exact opposite of what I would expect from a Jedi. It should have been easy for Obi Wan to kill Vader once he realized (and even said!) that Vader is no longer Anakin.


    And you can’t say that its “not the Jedi way” as Anakin did when he did not want to kill Dooku after defeating him. Anakin wanted Dooku to stand trial for his crimes and be held accountable. Obi Wan did nothing to have Vader held accountable. He just let him live to continue on being a monster. Even though Vader was injured, it was clear that Vader was not about to die, so Obi Wan clearly did not leave him to die (which would have been its own huge mistake to do that again!).


    From the moment I heard that Obi Wan and Vader were going to have the “rematch of the century,” I was worried about this series. Knowing that both characters survive, the best outcome to hope for would be that something came between them and prevented them from finishing the fight. This is already a very cliché mechanism in Star Wars (Rey and Kylo on Starkiller Base, Obi Wan and Vader in episode 3 of “Obi Wan Kenobi”) and other movies/TV series, thus would have been a disappointment. But having Obi Wan willingly choose to let the Jedi-murdering monster survive without consequence is even more upsetting.


    It's even more disappointing considering they had the perfect mechanism right there to interrupt the fight! Not to try to get into fan fiction, but the Grand Inquisitor could easily have felt Vader’s distress and taken a group of troopers to the surface to interrupt right before Obi Wan killed Vader.


    The character of Obi Wan has always stood for defending good in the galaxy. Now we have to live with knowing he allowed a grand evil to exist.


    Star Wars really needs to get away from the Skywalker Era and stop creating traps for themselves with legacy characters.
     
  12. eeprom

    eeprom Prince of Bebers

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2016
    Posts:
    2,768
    Likes Received:
    6,959
    Trophy Points:
    87,467
    Credits:
    6,860
    Ratings:
    +10,323 / 40 / -11
    What you’re describing is the very definition of “hack writing”. Taking the agency of choice away from the character and giving them a cheap way out so they don’t have to make that difficult decision. If nothing else, this series at least took a stance. It had its main character make a principled judgement.

    People often forget, even though George Lucas had been saying it before the first movie ever came out, Star Wars is a fairytale for children. It’s a morality play. It’s an allegory meant to impart ethical life lessons to impressionable youths. The differences between ‘right’ and ‘wrong’ as personified by the ideology of the Jedi.

    The Jedi are guardians, defenders, protectors. They are not judge, jury, and executioner. They aren’t vigilantes. They exist to preserve life and only take it as a last resort if they absolutely have no other choice. That’s the lofty level they stive to hold themselves accountable to. And that’s what Obi-Wan demonstrated in the finale.

    Could that scene perhaps have been constructed differently to better communicate the ethical crisis of the situation and expressly articulate why he decided what he did? Yeah, probably. But the message itself it’s attempting to convey is totally reflective of the greater value system Star Wars promotes. And THAT’S the important part. HOW we fight matters just as much as WHY we fight.
     
    • Like Like x 7
    • Great Post Great Post x 2
    • Wise Wise x 1
  13. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

    Credits:
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    The gift of the holster is a symbol of the vagina. The goddess is a feminine receptacle for the masculine light, that is represented as fully received on Alderaan, by the phallic buildings. If you look closely, you can see it in some of the buildings. The holster there maybe could be thought of as a sort of fertility rite, saying she is ready to receive the light. The joke there was maybe in poor taste, but that's occult humor similar to the sex-toy-like ceremonial dagger that's placed into the death star in TROS.
     
    #133 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 26, 2022
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 26, 2022
    • Like Like x 2
    • Funny Funny x 1
  14. Iotatheta

    Iotatheta Rebel Official

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2018
    Posts:
    198
    Likes Received:
    540
    Trophy Points:
    6,057
    Credits:
    890
    Ratings:
    +646 / 2 / -0
    i agree with what eeprom said, with the fantasy elements of Star Wars. But I’ll add how I viewed the sequence, which was the while he says he’s prepared to do what he must, the two times that he has seen Anakin’s face when he should/could finish him, he can’t do it. It’s one thing to say that you would do it, and another to actually finish it, especially when you could’ve actually done it when Vader’s armor wasn’t broken, but then you end up seeing the person inside. That, plus any remaining responsibility/guilt he may still be feeling for Anakin’s state.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

    Credits:
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    At the moment, I interpret the name Tala Durith to maybe mean, the beat goes on, or the rhythm or cycle endures. Does anyone else have a different view?
     
    #135 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 26, 2022
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 26, 2022
  16. DeeRush

    DeeRush Rebelscum

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2022
    Posts:
    240
    Likes Received:
    209
    Trophy Points:
    642
    Credits:
    437
    Ratings:
    +284 / 13 / -6
    Lucas kept giving different interpretations on what Star Wars is. I just saw an interview he had done 10 years ago in which his description of the saga bore little or no resemblance to a "fairytale or morality play" for children. I suspect his morality play, which is very ambiguous, was for adults as well.
     
  17. Darth Derringer

    Darth Derringer Rebel Official

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2021
    Posts:
    1,268
    Likes Received:
    2,233
    Trophy Points:
    8,117
    Credits:
    2,722
    Ratings:
    +3,090 / 50 / -13
    As eeprom eloquently said, the writer could've taken the choice away from Obi-wan and given him an easy way out. And GotTheSliver is right. This was indeed Obi-wan's opportunity to rid the galaxy of Darth Vader forever. But guess what? This story didn't give us a cartoon character.

    Thankfully, we were blessed as viewers to see Obi-wan as a flesh and blood human being. On the surface, this was a classic "good guy" versus "bad guy" duel. But what makes every duel between these two different is that Obi-wan and Anakin are like brothers. Remembering his little brother's young face as he gazes at the scarred visage that now stares at him behind the mask had to have been The Emotional Gut-Punch for the Ages.

    I applaud the writers for giving us this moment -- and for showing us that even a brave, heroic, and wise Jedi master is still a human, thus capable of making a big mistake.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  18. Madmartigan

    Madmartigan Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Posts:
    926
    Likes Received:
    2,652
    Trophy Points:
    10,667
    Credits:
    7,754
    Ratings:
    +3,678 / 17 / -5
    https://www.indiewire.com/2022/06/obi-wan-kenobi-ewan-mcgregor-yoda-1234736647/

    Ewan explains briefly why Yoda is not in the show.

    "If a Jedi uses the Force in this period of time, the Inquisitors are going to be able to sense that, and they’re going to know where you are. It’s like using your phone or something, I guess. It’ll ping off a tower somewhere if you use the Force.”

    Don't know but someone else finds this response quite cheap, low and very lax? (I guess I've used the right terms in english)
     
    • Like Like x 2
  19. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

    Credits:
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Yes.
    I will guess that there is an exoteric reason they give to actors, and an esoteric meaning that viewers are meant to find on their own. I guess Yoda is not in the story because he has a green light saber, symbolizing the heart. This series was about the mind, and centered on the blue light saber against red. In this story, Kenobi is like Hermes, Mercury, or Odin/Woden. We were hinted by the show released on Obi-Wan Woden's Day, Wednesday. Also, I think it's special, after the rise of the Empire, to have Yoda in hiding revealed to Luke in the Empire Strikes Back. After Luke fails with his father's blue light saber in TESB, he will return a Jedi with the same color sword as Yoda in ROTJ. Luke takes over just in time as the heart of the Jedi stops beating. Yoda was sort of the heart of all the Jedi as their grandmaster.

    Same goes for Mace Windu's purple light saber in the prequel trilogy. We were told that it's just his favorite color. Violet's esoteric meaning is that it represents the crown chakra, and the polar opposite of red in the visible spectrum of light. Spiritual versus material.
     
    #139 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 26, 2022
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 26, 2022
    • Like Like x 3
  20. GotTheSilver

    GotTheSilver Rebel Official

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2016
    Posts:
    539
    Likes Received:
    963
    Trophy Points:
    6,692
    Credits:
    1,784
    Ratings:
    +1,839 / 22 / -4
    Thank you guys for these responses. I wrote my post hoping that others would be able to change my mind on this. I had just watched the finale and was quite emotional about it. The points I quoted really helped me view this a bit differently, especially the part about Obi Wan being human and not being able to bring himself to kill the person that was once like a brother to him. I am going to rewatch the episode with these thoughts in mind.

    @eeprom - I agree with your comment about "hack writing". As I stated in my post, having the fight be interrupted by an outside force would have been a disappointing cliche. I just meant that if they had chosen to go with this cliche, they could have used the Grand Inquisitor to do it.
     
    • Like Like x 4
    • Friendly Friendly x 2
Loading...

Share This Page