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SPOILER Obi-Wan Kenobi Ep. 6 Discussion

Discussion in 'Obi-Wan Kenobi' started by Lord Phanatic, Jun 21, 2022.

  1. Darth Derringer

    Darth Derringer Rebel Official

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    And thank you for the post that initiated this exchange.

    IMHO, your post and the follow-up comments it generated illustrates what an entertaining place this place can be when SW fans with different perspectives engage in respectful discussions.
     
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  2. eeprom

    eeprom Prince of Bebers

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    No, not really. Lucas is certainly notorious as being a less than reliable narrator with respect to the details of the story’s origins, giving a lot of conflicting accounts of when he had which ideas dialed-in. But with respect to why he wrote it and who he wrote it for, he’s been astoundingly consistent all these decades.

    "Rather than do some angry, socially relevant film, I realized there was another relevance that is even more important—dreams and fantasies, getting children to believe there is more to life than garbage and killing and all that real stuff like stealing hubcaps—that you could still sit and dream about exotic lands and strange creatures. Once I got into Star Wars, it struck me that we had lost all that—a whole generation was growing up without fairy tales. You just don't get them any more, and that's the best stuff in the world—adventures in far-off lands. It's fun. I wanted to do a modern fairy tale, a myth."

    American Film, 1977

    "I realized a more destructive element in the culture would be a whole generation of kids growing up without that thing, because I had also done a study on, I don’t know what you call it, I call it the fairy tale or the myth. It is a children’s story in history and you go back to the Odyssey or the stories that are told for the kid in all of us."

    Rolling Stone, 1977

    "In the process of doing American Graffiti and getting so many letters from young people saying, 'Wow, this film really changed my life; I finally figured out what being a teenager is all about,' I realized that film had a far greater impact—and accomplished what I was trying to accomplish in my first film. I kept getting these letters saying, 'Gee, I was lost, but now I know what I'm doing.' And I thought, 'Great!' So after that, when American Graffiti became a hit, it renewed my faith in Star Wars.

    I said, 'This is the kind of movie we need. There needs to be a kind of film that expresses the mythological realities of life—the deeper psychological movements of the way we conduct our lives that are evident in fairy tales.' Nobody has been doing that. The more I researched it, the more I realized how important it was, and the more dedicated I became to actually pulling it off."

    Starlog, 1981

    "Star Wars came out of my desire to make a modern fairy tale. In college I became fascinated by how culture is transmitted through fairy tales and myths. Fairy tales are how people learn about good and evil, about how to conduct themselves in society."

    American Film, 1983

    "Knowing that the film was made for a young audience, I was trying to say, in a simple way, that there is a God and that there is both a good side and a bad side. You have a choice between them, but the world works better if you're on the good side."

    Skywalking, 1983

    "When I did Graffiti, I discovered that making a positive film is exhilarating...I thought, 'Maybe I should make a movie like this for even younger kids.' I realized that there are really no modern fairy tales.

    Rolling Stone, 1987

    "I'll show those guys. And then -- but then when I was started going to Star Wars, they said, 'why are you making a children's film?' I said, 'well, because I can have more of an influence on people.' I think I can have things to say that I can actually influence kids, you know, adolescents, 12-year olds and, you know, that are trying to make their way into the bigger world and that's basically what mythology was, was to say - - of saying this is what we believe in; these are our rules; these are -- this is what we are as a society. And we don't do that."

    Charlie Rose Interview, 2015

    Fascinating. Can you cite it? I love reading/listening to Lucas interviews.
    I’m not really sure what’s ambiguous about it. But certainly anyone can take away meaning and value from the messaging of this series. I’m in my 40s now and I’m still finding new ways to appreciate its morality. It’s not exclusively for children, no. But it is unquestionable that’s who it truly exists for.
    Sorry, I didn’t mean to imply that you were unaware. More to the point, I was saying that the writers (Joby Harold or whoever) were also definitely aware. It was a conscious decision on their part to have their protagonist make that conscious decision. They could have taken the easier way out if they wanted, but they chose not to.
     
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  3. Iotatheta

    Iotatheta Rebel Official

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    it’s a weird answer for sure….not that I expect Yoda in it anyway. Not entirely sure where or how he’d fit in.
     
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  4. Master_Farkaz

    Master_Farkaz Wolfmaster

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    The way I always saw it, Mace was not affraid to use "darker" techniques. Lightside sabers were [usually] blue (in the films) and Darkside sabers were red. Mix them together and you'll get purple. To me that always signified how Mace Windu managed to combine Light and Dark to accomplish certain tasks that would be challenging for a "Goody-two-shoes" Jedi.


    As I undertand it, the colour of the saber is determined by how the user and the Kyber-crystal inside are in tune with the Force.

    Red is not a natural Kyber-colour. A saber only turns red when evil deeds are "Forced" onto it. When it's wielder is mainly using the Darkside and thereby overpowers the "will-of-the-Force" working throught the Kyber-crystal inside.

    Aren't Ahsoka's sabers she "rescued" from their previous Sith owners and by bringing them back into the light, she cleanses them, which is thereason why they are now
    white!
     
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  5. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

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    That's a good thought. In the visible spectrum, red at the bottom 1st rung, paired with blue at the 5th and 6th rung of the ladder, makes purple. To add to that, purple is the color of royalty and spirituality, enlightenment. The clue for him is in his name "Mace." A mace is a kind of rod with a crown on top that symbolizes authority. The crown chakra tops a kind of staff with six lower chakras below. The crown chakra is transcendent, and non-dual, wholeness or the all. There's no separation between light and dark, good and bad, therefore he would be able to wield everything from blue down to red. We all have that red inside of us. There is only one purple sword because it's unity, or non-duality. When it falls, the temple falls, and the connection is lost, Padme dies, light turns to dark, Anakin is consumed by darkness, republic turns to empire, and the sun and moon, Luke and Leia, are sent in different directions, symbolizing a loss of light in the world. The green and blue light saber go different ways-- Kenobi and Yoda. The lower chakras are dual, and in the world of illusion, Maya. Asian philosophy. The rainbow spectrum for the chakras is a westernized version.

    In ROTS, Anakin's blue sword, the mind, lops off Mace's hand and his purple sword, spirituality, symbolizing the loss of the ability to connect to this level of consciousness. Kyber crystals, I'm thinking comes from the same place we get the word cybernetics-- the Greek kybernetes, or steersman. So wielding the sword, a symbol for mind in the occult, with a kyber crystal, represents the different aspects of our psychology that we can steer in different directions.

    The top 4 chakras are inside the spiritual temple within us, and the bottom 3 are are our material-world animal qualities, where if we live only, Freck, animal consciousness, drives the vehicle. Down here, we're driven only by survival, sex, power and domination, fear, animal instincts and impulses, more like the consciousness of a machine than a human being. The Empire has shut off the higher aspects of consciousness, and set up a roadblock on the path to enlightenment and liberation.

    White is not a color, but the presence of all colors, or visible light itself. The name Ahsoka was probably inspired from Emperor Ashoka, credited with helping spread Buddhist enlightenment. I'm not too familiar with Ahsoka because I'm mostly a movies fan.

    The crown chakra is also at the back of the temple of Solomon, behind the veil- the holy of holies. If you connect there, I think you have found the lost ark of the covenant.
     
    #145 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 27, 2022
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  6. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

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    If we dig deep into the meaning of Tala and the holster, if my interpretation of her name is accurate, she could be the tick of time. Kenobi is saved just in time after he breaks through the barrier. Tala gives Kenobi a way to rescue Leia, the moon light, in time, from the tomb for consciousness, but Tala is still a ticking time bomb on the path, and time is running out for everyone. Or, we have come to the end of a cycle in time, and when she sacrifices herself, the holster is passed to young Leia to continue receiving the light in the course of time as the young crescent moon. They're trying to kill time waiting for Vader. The loading droid is a real time saver. What else?

    Tala is a rhythmic beat and repeating pattern, and it means to clap, in Sanskrit.

    When they are inside the fortress and the beat of time is cut off from Kenobi when he enters the fortress, do you think we're dealing with something eternal in here? The communicator sitting on the surface in ep. 4 isn't dumb at all now, is it?

    (obi-wan 2)(blue)
     
    #146 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 27, 2022
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  7. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

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    In ep 4, Time heals Kenobi's wounds. Reva is called away just at the right time. "I was told it cannot wait." Time waits for nobody. She clocks the stormtrooper to escape. You may have to sacrifice some time to stay on the path.
    Anything else? Could be, huh?
     
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  8. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

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    It's always amazing what you can uncover about SW by looking at world cultures. It appears the idea of Tala and time is correct. There are videos explaining relationship of laya and tala in eastern music. They are in fact talking about the cycles of time, the cycle of Leia the moon goddess, and the cycle of the seasons.



    So, Tala is the cycle there coming to an end when she sacrifices herself. The new crescent moon is rising-- Leia.

    Now. Do you want to get really crazy? You came to the right place. Let's take a look at Reva's inquisitor weapon. The O with the double blade is taken apart into the one sword the end, the handle broken into a half circle, and Vader, darkness, has stopped it from turning. I thought from the start that her weapon looked like O and 1.... O as off, and 1 as on. We are in the interval between nothing and something in this story. The interval and the beat. The pitch darkness before the light. When the light comes in, boom. This is maybe also why we get no familiar music in the series until the end. Get it? Do you think her saber is a symbol of that?
     
    #148 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 27, 2022
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  9. Meister Yoda

    Meister Yoda Your Little Green Friend
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    After this duel I tend to think even more, that during their duel on the death star Darth Vader wouldn't necessarily would have beaten Obi-Wan, but that Obi-Wan winning could have been a possible/likely outcome and they just haven't really started fighting seriously at that point.
     
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  10. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

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    Because of what we learned in ep. 4, maybe we learn that Vader loses strength in ep 6 because Kenobi lures him out away from his energy source, into the darkness he created, where he has no energy to feed on except that small sliver of light in the fight scene. His energy source is the light. They can't even catch or destroy the escaping ship, their weapons are so weak. The dark needs to consume the light side for its power. No tie fighters because they feed on the light like vampire bats.

    Time has blown up. Light is weak because the dark side drained it all. The dark side is weakened because it has now drained what's left of the light. Kenobi lures Vader out into the void, the darkness that is Vader, and Vader says, "Have you come to destroy me, Obi-Wan?" Kenobi cracks him open and lets in that little bit of light he has now, after he's buried and escapes the grave.

    There's ridicule on YT for the time it takes Kenobi to get back to Reva, and the time it takes Reva to get to Tatooine. Time blew up in the previous episode. They are at the end of a cycle, and start of another.
     
    #150 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 27, 2022
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  11. DeeRush

    DeeRush Rebelscum

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    Actually, purple symbolizes royalty.
    --- Double Post Merged, Jun 27, 2022, Original Post Date: Jun 27, 2022 ---

    I think Anakin could have defeated Obi-Wan aboard the Death Star if the latter had not sacrificed himself. Unlike on Mustafar or that unnamed planet in Episode 6, Anakin seemed to have his anger under control aboard the Death Star. Obi-Wan isn't the better swordsman. If he was, he could have been the one to defeat Dooku, not Anakin. But Anakin's emotions had been spiraling out of control the two times Obi-Wan had defeated him. Yet, it didn't seem to be the case when he defeated Dooku in "Revenge of the Sith" or when he defeated Obi-Wan in Episode 3.

    And yes, even Obi-Wan had allowed his emotions to spiral out of control sometimes. Look at how he had almost lost to Maul in "The Phantom Menace". Maul's arrogance and Obi-Wan's ability to control his emotions in the face of eminent death saved him in the end.
     
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  12. Lord of the Rens

    Lord of the Rens Gatekeeper & Avatar Maker

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    THIS.

    Copious amounts of gloom.... +1 for setting the perfect tone.
     
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  13. Lord of the Rens

    Lord of the Rens Gatekeeper & Avatar Maker

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    Ironic. The color of Vader's skin after Kenobi cracked open his black dome.
     
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  14. Master_Farkaz

    Master_Farkaz Wolfmaster

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    Yes, that's fairly common knowledge... @Sheddai_Lightkeeper has also stated that already in a comment above, but that's quite beside the point.
    I was merely sharing my thoughts on Master Windu's Lightsaber colour!

    Could it be possible that there is more than one reason it's purple?
    Other than the fact that SLJ specifically asked for it when he got the part, because "the colour purple" is very significant the the black community... and I don't think it's because it symbolizes royalty...
     
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  15. Rogues1138

    Rogues1138 Jedi Sentinel - Army of Light
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    She's only 10 years old... :confused:
     
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  16. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

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    This turned out to be a good story. Maybe they'll announce Wednesday what the plans are for second season.
    Yes, that's the poor taste part, Kenobi's comment.
    I'm thinking of Lola as maybe an ancient Egyptian scarab beetle shaped like a disk, and the name may mean the lady of sorrows, or virgin Mary. So we're talking about a virgin birth, or regeneration. In episode 4, that is part of the symbolism of the baptism. In chakra 4, Joseph Campbell equated this chakra with the cross of Jesus and the virgin birth.

    The male phallus and female parts are important symbols that the ancients did not shy away from. It's in the Washington Memorial in DC. If you look at the view from above, it's the phallus in the middle of the vesica piscis. In cathedrals, you'll see the light of the world, Jesus, coming in through a vesica piscis- vessel of the fish.

    For me, subject to interpretation, the red circle with the white middle is related to the symbol of Leia on the torture table, placed inside of the octagon in episode 4. But in this case, the light is in the center of a circle- a sacred space. I'm thinking of Lola as the ovum, the female reproductive cell. At the end, we see the vagina, all the female parts, fallopian tubes, the holster and belt, with the female reproductive cell inside, ready to go. Fertility. Now rethink what it means for Lola to turn evil, follow around and pester Leia on a time cycle. Menses. The light is ready to be reborn into the world through the union of the male and female, the sun and moon-- Luke and Leia.

    Reva is also tracking her moon cycle, and is ready to give rebirth to the light in her, as she carries the light of the world in from the dark, where the fierce protectors of the light, the Lars call out for the light to return. They call out "Light! Light!" (leuk-)
     
    #156 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 28, 2022
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  17. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

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    Lola is the same as the name Lolita or Dolores. It means sorrows or pain. But Dolores is associated with Mary of the 7 sorrows.
    In the Obi-Wan Kenobi series, the moon goddess, Leia is a nymph moon goddess in in her first crescent period. Maybe they want us to get the Lolita reference there with Kenobi's comment about the blaster. But, I don't know if it was needed given how people could react to that in a Disney production and toy.

    Now we know why she was so moody when Kenobi wanted to leave, and it makes more sense as a symbol, why the kidnappers broke Lola. You have to be careful with the eggs.

    Here is another ancient symbol of the male and female parts in union. hexagram.jpg
    It's the hexagram, the star of David, or the seal of Solomon. Sun and moon.

    The blaster-holster symbolism used in Kenobi sure makes ya a little nervous about this. :eek:

    Could be a clue about that joining of opposites into one person I posted about, if she's learning to use a phallic symbol there. I never thought of it like that before. Did Rey supply her own holster? I do not remember. Did the blaster belong to Ben Solo?
     
    #157 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 28, 2022
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  18. madcatwoman17

    madcatwoman17 Rebel General

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    I had this headcanon prior to TROS that Rey would eventually become a similar kind of Jedi to Mace, and would wield a purple sabre staff. As I also believed Ben Solo would live, I thought he'd end up with a purple light sabre as well. The poem at the beginning of the novel of TFA seemed to hint at that...the 'Resolving of Grey'.

    Honestly thought that the ST would end with the replacing of the old fashioned 'white Jedi' with a new order that would combine light and dark the way Mace did, hence ending the constant Sith/Jedi conflict. Pipe dreams, I guess.:(
     
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  19. Sheddai_Lightkeeper

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    The second chakra is sexual and Freudian. With the understanding that Lola is the female ovum, and the ovum was torn apart by the kidnappers in the seedy place they took her, ep. 2. You can figure out what they are saying there. We're in the lower three chakras-- driven by animal consciousness-- Freck (ep 3). In the first three chakras, we're in the horrors of the world, cut off (the roadblock in ep. 3) from the upper 4 qualities of our psychology. The goddess is abused. She's taken from the light world on Alderaan, into the dark world, separated from the light.

    We saw more symbolism in ep. 2 from the Wizard of Oz, with the puff of red smoke that took out the kidnappers. That's wickedness disappearing back down to hell where it came from.

    In the end, there is a division from her reproductive cell she gives it to Kenobi. She is overjoyed to see her cycle complete and her ovum returned, ready for another cycle. Anyone else want to describe that part why she's so happy to see Lola back before anything else?
     
    #159 Sheddai_Lightkeeper, Jun 28, 2022
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  20. Martoto

    Martoto Force Sensitive

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    For keeping droids in?

    The holster without the weapon made me think of the scabbard without a sword worn by The Ghost Of Christmas Present (from Dickens A Christmas Carol, of course).

    Seems to me like Ewan doesn't really know nor particularly care about what Yoda is reallyt up to at this moment. He was just trying to appease fans and not sound like he doesn't care. Only Harrison Ford can get away with that. As an exec producer on his titular show, Ewan has to appear more engaged and involved in the wider story. But I don't really think that's his responsibility.

    Most likely, Yoda's absence and inactivity, if it is ever explained, will be described with similar personal crises to the ones that we have seen afflict Obi Wan Kenobi and Luke Skywalker. And not by the trite plot armour implied by McGregor here. (e.g. You can't use the force without being detected, so Yoda was forced to hide and do nothing........Dagobah is so strong with the force that it was best to just hide there and be able to use the force undetected as the empire would assume it's just the planet..... and so on. )
     
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