Star Wars Movie Updates - Taika Waititis Film is Next; Kathleen Kennedy Addresses Status of Rian Johnson Trilogy

I'm happy we have an update on RJ's trilogy, but I am NOT happy about its status. It makes absolute sense and that's more less to be expected, but I think Lucasfilm may regret letting RJ go, even despite of the distance like this. He's a brilliant filmmaker even if I don't like half of the films I've seen by him, and I think he has more brilliance to illuminate GFFA with.

Also, I disagree with Kathleen a little. I'm glad she and Lucasfilm have a roadmap now, but the problem isn't in the trilogy format, it's in the stories themselves. It's not about persistent storytelling something I feel Lucasfilm has been doing since the beginning, but about CONSISTENT storytelling, something the ST wasn't. You can have a consistent trilogy that allows for persistent storytelling, but the ST was not that. The problem isn't in erasing the format, though, simply putting in the prep work ahead of time.

Ultimately RIP RJ's trilogy. When Knives Out 2 does phenomenally well, I hope Lucasfilm opens up the door again.

 

It was a polite way for KK to tell Vanity Fair readers that Rian Johnson isn't going to be involved in making another SW movie.

 

I'm aware of the subtext, but I think this path of decision-making is a bad one. It was made to deflect blame off of KK and to promote (or rather, openly acknowledge) the change in focus, or else she would have already "indefinitely postponed" it or officially cancelled it. It was calculated, but not unexpected. Still, I think if Knives Out 2 and any other projects by RJ are successful, Disney will want him back, which in turn will make Lucasfilm look bad since they threw away this card.

 

I'm just happy LFL has finally acknowledged that they have no intentions of making a RJ trilogy. It was obvious, because of the Luke backlash of the toxic fans. RJ doesn't need Star Wars to be a successful director. I'm happy for him that he can now move along. Any director that works on a Star Wars project is brave and I give all respect to him or her. Star Wars fans are toxic if I was a director I would not want to work in this franchise. Simply, films are subjective... I enjoyed TBOF, but I understand that most disliked it and I'm fine with that. My favorite Star Wars film is ANH and I know most favorite is TESB.

 

SW fans are toxic? Nah, they just love the world that GL gave them and are protective of it.

 

Protective is one way of putting it...
I'm going to have to agree with @Rogues1138 on this one - Star Wars fans are absolutely toxic, or at least a small yet vocal and far too outspoken amount are. People under the name of "fans" - and those who probably believe themselves to be fans through their immersion in the material - have historically bullied multiple actors off of social media (Daisy Ridley, Kelly Marie Tran) and created traumatic memories for said actors. (Ahmed Best.) Fan debates and backlash has legitimately scared directors away from the franchise. (At least in 2018/2019 - see Christopher McQuarrie.)

The thing, to me, is - this isn't exclusive to Star Wars. Marvel fans can be toxic. DC fans are toxic. ALTA fans are toxic. Fire Emblem fans are toxic. Pokemon fans are toxic. The Dragon Prince fans are a step away from being toxic. Brandon Sanderson fans for the most part aren't as toxic, but we can be...dismissive. And obsessive. And braggadocious.
Any fandom or franchise, after a certain point of growth, multiple entries or waves of material, and/or time, will become toxic. This may be due to gatekeeping, shifts in quality (for better and for worse), cultural divides both within the franchise and within our own world, or a myriad of other reasons, but very few fandoms escape this inevitability. The only ways to avoid it are to stay small (which could mean the death of a franchise or fandom) or to find safe havens like this forum, where at least when you disagree with someone, you still respect them as a person and their views.

Now, do the good people in this franchise outweigh the bad? Absolutely! But, as is the case with many people and many things in life, it's easier to remember all of the negative emotions than the positive ones. It's easier to point out the failures than praise the successes. But that doesn't mean those successes should stop being praised. (But then comes the question of what counts as a success, and that gets into the divides mentioned above.) And that's how you counter the negativity. As Rose said, "that's how we're gonna win, not fighting what we hate, but saving what we love." In this case it means preserving people's experiences in the fandom, by giving them respect and praising the things the fact they may love an aspect we ourselves hate.

The other good thing about Star Wars s that time (and shiny new things to love/hate) will its wounds. The PT was hated for a generation, but now it's praised and beloved. The ST will no doubt fall into that category in time too.

 

Funny how you agree with a silly blanket statement -- and then hastily add 'at least a small' minority. You singled out SW fans but quite frankly, your toxic culture comments describe our modern-day culture in general.

The overwhelming success of the franchise -- despite occasional missteps by its content creators -- is testament to the passionate support of its fans. If, as you say, 'bullying' fans are 'scaring away' directors and creating 'traumatic memories' for its actors, you'd have never seen Hayden Christenson return to reprise his Anakin role or The Mandalorian immediately become the crown jewel of Disney's new streaming service in the immediate aftermath of the last two SW films.

It's speaks to the franchise's immense popularity that the worst-performing SW film at the box office is also acclaimed Oscar-winning director, Ron Howard's highest grossing film.

 

You're not wrong, this describes modern day culture for a lot of properties in general. We're in a polarized culture, and it's really annoying and not conductive to conversation or engagement. I went into specifics for Star Wars because that's the topic of the conversation, but I made sure to note that what has happened and is happening here is far from exclusive. Finding examples for DC, Pokemon, and Wheel of Time should be pretty easy to do too.

@DarthSnow touched on this, as did I earlier, so I'm not going to repeat myself too much, but this comment I think proves both of my points - Toxicity drove these people away from Star Wars, and time, perspective, and positivity can and have healed wounds. Hayden Christiansen and Ahmed Best both distanced themselves from Star Wars for nearly two decades after the PT. But now, time and positivity have healed those wounds enough for both to return. Daisy Ridley shut down her social media for years due to cyberbullying and constant negativity due to Star Wars, but enough time and distance has passed that she feels safe restarting some of her old accounts.
In 2018 Christopher McQuarrie had a Star Wars idea they would have loved to work on, but Christopher McQuarrie openly criticized the Star Wars fandom for scaring him away from ever wanting to make a movie in GFFA. Maybe that's changed since then, though, as time heals wounds.

BTW, The Mandalorian became a darling in Fall 2019, so before TROS, but after most of the backlash of TLJ died down, so it's more accurate to say it weathered the storm of TROS, added to the value of Star Wars in addition to TROS, or put the team on its back, depending on how you view it rather than to say "immediate aftermath."

When did I say anything about Star Wars not being popular? Star Wars is popular. I'm not sure if it's as popular as it once was, or rather, it has the same prestige as it once held* but it's certainly popular. But like I said before, once any franchise or fandom becomes large enough (or in some cases, popular enough) and you have separate "eras," iterations, or installments, negativity and toxicity is inevitable. This is true for Star Wars, Star Trek, DC, Marvel, Pokemon, Fire Emblem, Final Fantasy, Avatar: The Last Airbender, The Wheel of Time nowadays, and nearly every long-runner out there. I won't go so far as to say popularity has nothing to do with this, since popularity can absolutely lead to gatekeeping, but it has less to do with the conversation at hand than I think you're assuming.
Pokemon is the highest grossing franchise OF ALL TIME. (Star Wars is fifth on the list!) It's beloved around the world, and yet there's an air of negativity surrounding conversations about it, depending on where you go, for a myriad of reasons. Popularity does not equate to positivity. Love does not equate to positivity. Passion does not equate to positivity.


*This happens with time. Star Trek, despite having 3-4 shows going on right now, no longer holds the prestige it once held. Star Wars, despite being one of Disney's Golden Geese, doesn't really have the prestige it used to. Marvel's prestige has been pretty precarious these past few years as well, but even that will ultimately fade with time. Every generation or era has a new "thing." This doesn't mean that the older things are now useless or dead or devalued; they have simply aged, like we all do. It's like sports. Larry Bird makes leeway for Michael Jordan. A little while later, Shaq and Kobe Bryant come along. Then comes Lebron James and Steph Curry. Maybe Luka Doncic will be next in line. But the old legends are still important and impactful, maybe just not active. So to with franchises.

 

Given the popularity of Star Wars, one's involvement in the franchise -- be it as a director, writer, or actor -- is always going to be approached as a high risk / high reward kind of a deal. Some SW content has worked for the masses of SW fans -- and some hasn't. I just resist the kneejerk urge to call other fans 'toxic' when they dislike something that you do.

Which speaks to the resilence of this fan base. Through all of the ups and downs, when we get good Star Wars, we enthustiastically celebrate it with our praise and our pocketbooks.

How DARE you speak such hearsay!!!!

 

That's to be expected. That's just a sign of a long-running franchise - some things are bound to work better than others.

It's not just disliking, it's the disrespect, harassment of real-life people who have worked on the thing you dislike (such as hate mail and/or death threats), cyberbullying, name-calling of others, and shutting down conversations - THAT is what I call toxic.
It's one thing to say "I don't like this book/story/ship/movie/etc for XYZ reason" and for other fans to say at the end of the conversation (or throughout it) "I disagree, but your response is understandable, have a nice day."
It's a COMPLETELY separate thing for someone to hate a character, find that actor's social media, and start spewing explicative at them; to find an animator's home address and send them death threats if they don't make XYZ thing happen on a show; to call fans of that thing a hater/shill/sycophant/"not a real fan" because they like or dislike something different. We're talking completely different ballgames here.

Going against the mainstream isn't toxic. Controversial within a fandom maybe, but not toxic. You should still be able to have conversations, however limited, while still going against the mainstream. It becomes toxic when those alternative or controversial perspectives can't be discussed in good faith.

 

I agree. But when you're dealing with a mega-popular franchise like Star Wars, there's bound to be a few bad apples around that sour social media. I consider that a societal thing, not something that's unique in any way, shape, or from to Star Wars fandom.

 

So do I, which is what I've been saying.

But at least we're on the same page now!