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Anakin was supposed to ask for help in the original script of Revenge of the Sith

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Josh, Nov 15, 2017.

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  1. Martoto

    Martoto Force Sensitive

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    I found the plotting of Anakin's story to fall short of emotional credibility and emotional logic. It was not suitable for the tragic picture it was meant to portray. The skewing of Anakin's moral compass didn't make sense. Slaughtering the sand people did not bring his mother back nor did it give him an insight into the potential for the darkside to have restorative or life preserving powers. Only destructive powers are displayed by the Sith he encounters and when he is consumed by the darkside himself. His instant credulity when Palpatine starts to tempt him with the supposed path to immortality has no basis in anything he's experienced regarding the darkside prior to this. Nevertheless, he buys Palpatine's rather thin yarn.

    The moral ambiguity of the Jedi order and its culture is present. But I didn't think the films successfully conveyed Anakin's struggles with it in a meaningful way. I found the immature, "life's unfair" petulance to be trite and convenient but didn't fit Anakin's background and the almost lifelong training he received.
     
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  2. Xeven

    Xeven Rebel Official

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    For Kylo to finish what Vader started, he will have to save Pademe. That was entire reason Vader existed.
     
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  3. Martoto

    Martoto Force Sensitive

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    Kylo is misguided about what initially motivated his grandfather. The darkside and being all powerful was a means to an end for Anakin. But Kylo sees being all powerful as the end itself. The people that Anakin might have wanted to save with his power became an obstacle to achieving the power he sought to save them with.
     
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  4. CTrent29

    CTrent29 Rebel Official

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    Of course Anakin slaughtering the Tuskens did not bring his mother back! Good grief! That's why he was wrong to do it in the first place. That's why Padme was wrong to support his act and pretend that the Tuskens had deserved their fate, despite the awful thing they did. That is why Anakin spent three years wallowing in guilt over his killing of the Tuskens (if you don't believe me, re-watch the first 30 minutes of "Revenge of the Sith" again). That is what made this situation ambiguous and complex to me in the first place.

    There is NOTHING in Kylo Ren's character arc that strikes me as this ambiguous, let alone interesting. If you want to worship this moron as "Anakin Skywalker portrayed right", go ahead. If Kylo Ren's arc is your idea of "good writing" . . . fine. DO NOT expect me to agree with you. I cannot lower myself to that level.
     
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  5. Martoto

    Martoto Force Sensitive

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    "Of course". Then why did Anakin entertain the notion that he could gain the power to stop people from dying and the path to immortality by turning to the dark side, which from his own experience only brings destruction and death? Why, if he felt such guilt, was he so easliy convinced that using the dark side was permissible and a feasible means to an end which is completely at odds with what he already knows about the dark side. Anakin is portrayed as totally credulous and suggestible beyond reason and at ods with his own experience.

    Padme never supported his act of revenge nor did she pretend that the Tuskens deserved their fate. She could tell that Anakin was remorseful and told him that his feelings of anger and his feelings of remorse were understandable and just but did not endorse the action he took. Having witnessed his distress and the conflict he faced prior to going to Tatooine and being proved right about his mother being in danger, she couldn't bring herself to condemn him. If it ever was her place to condemn him in the first place.

    There's a difference between ambiguity and counterintuitive and counterfactual motivations.

    I think you need to tone it down a bit. There's no need to get upset about other people's perferences and paint them as "worship"ping a character because they feel the logic of their emotional journey was conveyed more successfully.

    I never mentioned ambiguity regarding Kylo. He's clearly and obviously misguided. Which is entirely credible since the true nature of his family's history is cluded in mystery and full of enigmas. He believes that his grandfather almost achieved something of worth by being the Emperor's servant but was robbed of his rightful place of being all powerful by Luke's influence, which has been conveyed to him by Snoke as Luke's on lust for power.

    As @Xeven said, for Kylo to truly want to finish what his grandfather started, his aim would be to save the ones he loves. But he only wants the power for its own sake in the mistaken belief that it is his right and that this was the prime motivation of his grandfather and everyone else who might compete with him for it.

    There's also no need to get indignant at the assumption that I need or expect you to agree with me. As is normal in a discussion, we state our points of view regardless.
     
    #25 Martoto, Aug 26, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2019
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