CONTEST And the Jar Jar for Worst Movie goes to

I predict that PT fans are going to be the most critical of this new series; which is strangely ironic. But, there is a feeling that the PT is being pushed aside and in effect the fans feel marginalized and so some of them are kind of taking out their frustrations out by slamming JJ, his previous work, and the new film before it's even out. I think it kind of got heated up when the filmmakers were talking practical effects in the summer. Some people felt that was a slight to the way the PT was made and they got upset.

That is the vibe I'm picking up so far. Not so much from the internet but in conversations I've had. But here's hoping the actual film will unite the fanbase somewhat. I think it's going to be fantastic.

 

I honestly didn't quite get the deeper meaning of this overemphasis on "practical effects" for the ST. Effects are a tool to tell the story, so I could't care less whether ist CGI or "PE", just choose the one that works best for the particular application. Frankly, I'm more concerned that the cinematography will be substantially different from what we got in both OT and PT.

Other than that the story is set so far in the future - from a PT point of view - that PT fans shouldn't be that much concerned. For the OT fans on the other hand, that's somewhat different, and I predict that OT fans like myself will rather be the critical ones, because the ST builds upon the OT.

 

What's really interesting to me is that most of the arguments for liking the PT involves some kind of rationalisation. To me a movie is only good if it engages me on an emotional level. This never happened to me while watching the PT. It's sad to me that I feel more of an emotional connection with the scene in ROTJ, where Obi-Wan tells Luke about the history of his father, than the entirety of the PT. I think GL commited the cardinal sin of letting the story drive the characters, rather than the characters drive the story. This is why the Jedi were such complete idiots. I mean Palpatine could have worn a sign, that said "I'm an evil Sith Lord", and they still would have missed it. They were acting like idiots, because the story required them to be idiots to work.

To me the PT fails on some very fundamental levels. The most important of these is that it fails to properly set up the character of Anakin Skywalker. He's written as such an unsympathetic character, that it completely undermines the drama of his turning to the Dark Side, which in itself is a convoluted mess. We're supposed to believe, that his main motivation is a fear of loss, that starts with the death of his mother, but the films conviently step over the fact that Anakin and the Jedi left his mother to rot in slavery for a decade. What GL failed to grasp IMO is that the story of Anakin was much more interesting, when he was just one of many talented prospects, rather than Space Jesus. We can relate to Luke, a simple farm boy, but how do you relate to the Messiah?

Additionaly, GL fails to properly set up the lure of the Dark Side in the PT. TESB did a very good job of explaining the danger of having such power to the one who wields the Force. The PT doesn't get any further than, fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering. In the OT joining the Dark Side is not just a question of being a Jedi or a Sith or turning a switch. It is represented as an internal struggle, that each prospective Jedi has to go through, before becoming a Jedi Knight. You deal with your negative emotions or you get consumed by them. In the PT the Dark Side is some ancient cult that is believed to have been wiped out ages ago. The danger of the Dark Side is apparently non existent, as Jedi almost never leave the order (only twenty have done so in it's entire history). In the PT, rather than dealing with your emotions, you simply don't have them, period. Jedi are not allowed to have attachments, because putting your head in the sand is the best way to keep out of danger. This is the best advice the Master Jedi has for young Anakin. Just put your head in the sands of Tatooine, and all will be well. Worst of all, we are supposed to believe that this rediculous philosophy has sustained the Jedi for over a thousand generations...

Horrible, just horrible...

 

Not a lot you post, but when you do...

I will never forget the shock back in 1999 when Qui-Gonn said "I didn't come here to free slaves" and I wondered what had happened to the "guardians of peace and justice" according to Ben Kenobi in ANH.

Darth Vader didn't betray and murder the Jedi, sad to say, but George Lucas did by attempting to create the basis for Anakin's later betrayal and Sith conversion.

 

...and how about that line from Obi-Wan, where he says: "Why do I sense that we've picked up another pathetic life form?". With Jedi like those, who needs the Sith?

 

To be fair. Obiwan was a jerk in the OT as well.

 

Now you got my unidivided attention. Could you please elaborate unless it's limited to the awful "from a certain point of view" line (which fortunately follows a better and straightforward explanation of Yoda - I could almost sympathize with Ben being annoyed because Yoda explained it first, so that should have been sufficient for Luke, but no, Luke now also wants to hear it from Ben, too)?

 

Haha. Maybe jerk is too strong a word...But of course there is the "lying" about Anakin. I know, I know. Luke wasn't ready...but I think it was more about Obiwan not wanting to say "After I failed to raise your dad right, I left him to burn in a river of Lava after cutting him to peices, and instead of finishing him off and putting him out of his misery, I just stole his lightsaber and walked away...Letting him become Darth Vader and inadvertently causing who knows how many deaths. And then, I just chilled out on Tatooine for 20 years, waiting for...." Who knows what he was waiting for. Vader and the Emporer to die of old age? He waits three years to tell Luke about Yoda. One minute he's telling Luke not to face Vader (doesn't want Luke to find out the truth) then after Luke finds out, he tells Luke he has to kill his father....The Luke say's "I can't kill my own father," because he believes there is good in him. But Obiwan just guilts him even more, "Then the Emporer has already won." Obiwan is manipulative! I don't think he's evil...he's just underhanded and deceptive.

I don't dislike Obiwan. He's one of my favorites. But it's fun to talk about his (maybe) character defects. He's a very interesting character. Who know's what he's really thinking. Yoda seems to trust him.

 

But then he was a jerk in the PT who was aware of his shortcomings by the time of the OT and did understandably not feel too comfortable talking about the sins of his youth?

Yes, his aforementioned behaviour in RotS isn't exactly what I believe qualifies as Jedi code and had a smack of retribution to what Anakin / Vader did to the Jedi kids. I almost wish the scene would have rather ended like this (warning: some VFX blood)

 

I'm also wondering why Obi-wan never says, "dude...you killed all those kids"
I don't really like that Anakin killed the Padawans...I was just like "too far, dude. Too far."
But I guess he didn't really kill them on screen, so who knows. Well, I guess Obiwan told Padme that he saw them get slaughtered. Also we know from the clone wars that Palpatine was looking for kids strong in the Force...why not just capture them?

Overall, I thought that whole scene with Ani and Obi at the end of RotS was pretty good. There was some rare emotion happening. Only surpassed by the Father reveal and Vaders final moments (IMO)

 

They are both not particular stellar Movies, but i always liked AOTC more than TPM.
Still Star Wars, still Magic to me.

 

I wonder wich is the least loved movie now (or the more hated) after the 5 movies released by Disney?

Still AOTC?

In my opinion yes.

 

According to Rotten Tomatoes the worst rated SW movies in regard of audience are:
'The Clone Wars' (18%) and 'The Last Jedi' (43%)

And if we look at the ratings of critics:
'The Rise of Skywalker' (52%) and 'The Phantom Menace' (53%)

So, AOTC is more loved as some one might think.


IMO the worst SW movie is 'Solo'.