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Dear LucasFilm: Don't make Star Wars "small"

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Last Jedi' started by Buddapalm, Mar 7, 2016.

  1. Buddapalm

    Buddapalm Rebelscum

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    I wanted to write this to get something off my chest. I'm a pretty big Star Wars fan: have been since the OT, I enjoyed the PT mostly (esp. Ep. III), and Clone Wars / Rebels are cool. I enjoyed watching Episode VII and felt a sense of relief/joy watching this epic space opera we all love come back to life on the big screen.

    That said, Ep. VII was "safe". The goal was clear after the PT: this movie needed to appeal to the broadest base of fans, and attempt to let almost nobody down. That's pretty impossible to accomplish in any fandom today... but by-and-large, $2 billion in global box office sales and a bunch of heartbreak from EU fans all over, Lucasfilm largely accomplished that goal.

    So we're off to a good start with VII. I just feel like Star Wars got smaller with Ep. VII. It's hard for me to pin point why I feel that way, but I think it's because VII followed IV so closely that it constrained itself from being big as the entire franchise. It's simple things really... just naming a few:
    • There's no mention of the Senate and number of people on the Hosnian system before they blow it up, and we get Leia sitting down like she has heartburn.. even in IV there's was little more depth: Leia is labeled as a spy, the Senate is disbanded, Leia remarks how Alderan is a peaceful place without weapons and begged Tarkin not to destroy it.. Obiwan feels a disturbance in the force.
    • Rey speaks an alien language and there's no subtitles... The magic of alien languages throughout the series was showing the context / intent of what they were saying...
    • Most of the major interactions in VII are among humans, on extremely earth-like planets, with background alien characters in very minor rolls for the most part... Star Wars has shown us more incredible worlds, and wildly different beings throughout the story. (to be fair, Maz's Cantina makes a difference, but quickly centers around the humans)

    Here's my appeal to LucasFilm as a lifelong fan of Star Wars: don't let the franchise get small.

    What I think I mean is don't shy away from the simple things that has given Star Wars depth: tragedy, politics, grave decisions, eclectic characters, mythology, spiritualism and cultural references are part of the mix. They don't need to be the main course, but they give our Space Opera depth. It's easier for the non-stop super hero movies of late to play it safe: they are fun, exciting and quality entertainment. But they are ultimately stories told at a small scale, through generally safe stories (good defeats evil) and safe visions of what-could-be. Star Wars and it's endless possibilities is a gift that can be easily lost in the unconscious act of blockbuster film making.

    Anyway, hope there are others out there that might feel the same way, and interested if you too feel Ep. VII was too safe / the ST can be much grander than what we've seen so far.
     
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  2. Darth Daigo

    Darth Daigo Rebel Official

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    I think that they have intentionally made TFA smaller, so the next movies can be bigger again. We will explore new worlds in the next movie, and, with every subsequent movie, the Galaxy will become larger and larger and the stakes will become higher and higher too.
     
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  3. BespinMinersUnion1138

    BespinMinersUnion1138 Force Sensitive

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    I have a different approach to this thought. To me, Star Wars always worked best when it dealt with character and relationships set against the backdrop of larger galaxy problems. I felt TFA did this quite well and set the rest of the trilogy up on a solid foundation. I'm in no hurry to force the trilogy into some larger backdrop to the detriment of the character development. Character should always come first, not the other way around.

    In TFA audiences met four new worlds, a host of new characters and new problems for our heroes to overcome, as well as new ways to look at the Force. That's plenty big. Sequels typically do worse when they focus to broadly at the expense of character development - i.e. Pirates of Caribbean sequels, Star Trek 5, Age of Ultron, The Dark Night Rises etc... where the best sequels focus on character development: Superman 2, Spiderman 2, TESB, The Dark Knight.
     
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  4. Darth Spocktor

    Darth Spocktor Rebelscum

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    I feel like in TFA, JJ and co were focused on getting the new characters right. And they succeeded - I care about Rey, Finn, Poe and Kylo's stories and their struggles. But that came at the expense of the wider galaxy and the planets we see on screen. We get a new Tatooine and a new Death Star. Not very original - it feels very penciled in. The Resistance and First Order were also a little bland, and the entire situation with the Republic was not well explained. The only planet I really liked in TFA was Ahch-to; it felt different and unusual.

    That said, now that these main characters have been established, maybe Rian Johnson can think/has thought more about the surrounding universe. And I think we're seeing that with the set from Dubrovnik.
     
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  5. Aras Volodka

    Aras Volodka Rebel General

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    • I don't think that makes it feel small... if anything I really enjoy not knowing exactly what's being said. I believe the original *original* ANH version had no subtitles for the Greedo/ Han exchange.
     
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  6. Darth Chewie

    Darth Chewie Rebel Official

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    I agree. Plus the context when Rey was talking to Teedo, was pretty obvious. It didn't take a rocket scientist to figure out the gist of what was being said.

    Plus I loved the fact that after watching her for 5 minutes or so, not saying a word, her first spoken words on screen are not even English.
     
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  7. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

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    I've said his many times in the terms of:

    "Star Wars - Lite"
     
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  8. Duke Groundrunner

    Duke Groundrunner Rebel Official

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    I'd like some visually stunning new worlds.
     
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  9. Talon Karrde

    Talon Karrde Rebel Official

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    Small galaxy, virtually no politics, people talking with very few aliens:
    [​IMG]
    Big galaxy, politics present but on the side as @Buddapalm prefers, and people talking with a lot of aliens:
    [​IMG]
    Small galaxy, minimal politics, minor yet significant interactions with aliens:
    [​IMG]
    The numbers on the right are the ones I want to convey, btw.
     
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  10. Darth Spocktor

    Darth Spocktor Rebelscum

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    The problem you're always going to face is, how weird can a planet be? I think it can be difficult to find a balance between it being too Earth-like and too much CGI. While many of the planets in the PT are cool in concept, they were often poorly executed and clearly weren't much more than a green screen.

    This is what I like about the Dubrovnik set; RJ is doing something new but also something that is mostly practical.

    In my opinion it is important to have an at least partially physical set - it is not only more convincing visually but it also makes the actors feel more comfortable and immersed in the imaginary world they are working in.
     
    #10 Darth Spocktor, Mar 7, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2016
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  11. thetophus

    thetophus Rebelscum

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    Seconded! I do like that in VII JJ and Lucasfilm added new alien characters. The Crimson Corsair, Maz Kanata, and Ello Asty are very cool. However, I really wish we'd seen more of the already-established aliens. I love Ithorians and Duros and Twi'leks and especially Zabrak. Let's see more of those! We're counting on you, Rian and Lucasfilm.
     
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  12. Ganon136

    Ganon136 Intelligence Officer

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    I can count on seeing similar alien species in the Dubrovnik sets as well as others, but also expect the new creatures to show up as well. Remember guys, the Sequel Trilogy is a new beast on its own. Give it some time for Episode VII to marinate on top of Episode VI and also consider how Rogue One may have some potential changes to the overall saga that could cause changes for the good or bad of the gap bridging that could potentially cause changes in the future of the Sequel Trilogy.
     
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  13. Buddapalm

    Buddapalm Rebelscum

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    Thanks for the perspectives everyone. Agree with the various folks who mention getting a stronger connection with the characters, which is an important foundation for the trilogy. To be sure, I'm really hopeful 8 and 9 will push boundaries again. Recognizing their commercial success is important, a little more depth will go a long way.
     
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  14. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

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    TFA was "safe" enough to set the stage. VIII is expected to be more experimental. Maybe a hybrid of stuff from Pt/OT would be slightly optimistic .
     
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  15. Aras Volodka

    Aras Volodka Rebel General

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    I wasn't a big fan of the PT planets tbh... the only ones which I thought were really cool was the planet with the big pit in ROTS & the planet where the dude with the penis shaped head dies. The Plo'koon guy or whatever his name was... that planet looked very cool too, but we only saw like 3 seconds of it.

    The water planet in AOTC was based on McQuarrie concepts... so I'd say that's more OT-ish. Nothing beats the ingenuity of cloud city IMO.
     
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  16. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

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    Coruscant is technically OT ;) .
     
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  17. Aras Volodka

    Aras Volodka Rebel General

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    True, though the Mcquarrie concepts look more gothic-ish than what we got in PT :) I did like Coruscant though... I forgot about that planet (LOL)
     
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  18. Darth Sidious

    Darth Sidious Rebel Official

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    I definitely hope they expand on the Church of The Force, the Knights of Ren, who Snoke and Maz are, the First Jedi Temple, and the New Republic.
     
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  19. Jedi77-83

    Jedi77-83 Force Sensitive

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    My only plea is for the movies to not take themselves too seriously. What makes the OT & TFA great is they never tried to be something they're not.

    SW movies are serials and supposed to be fun adventure movies that have alittle humor, alittle drama, alittle mythology.

    The PT tried to be this character study and took itself way too seriously as it just doesn't work for serial type movies.

    You can't make this Greek tragedy that tries to tell an adult story but then have kids as one of your core audiences. That's the why PT is uneven.

    Stick to keeping a sense of adventure to the movies as you can still tell a serious story, just not too serious. You can tell a funny story, just not too over the top. You can get political, just not too political.

    Keep it simple.
     
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  20. General_Tarkin

    General_Tarkin Rebel General

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    What made the originals so good was the story, the feeling and the characters. You can make enormous CGI worlds, but if the film fails to connect with the audience its worth nothing.
    TFA was all about the characters, not very much about the world/lore building. We have two more episodes to that. I never thought for a second that TFA was ,,small". No CGI planets thats true, but we had characters we cared about. And that made it a lot ,,bigger" than some other particular movies...
     
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