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OFFICIAL NEWS Disney didn’t Use George Lucas’ Ideas for The Force Awakens.

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens' started by Viral Hide, Jan 20, 2015.

  1. MagnarTheGreat

    MagnarTheGreat Jedi General

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  2. SegNerd

    SegNerd Rebel Official

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    What I would really like to know is how GL would have handled the fundamental contradiction in making an ST.

    I think it’s reasonable to say that episodes 1-6 asserted that:
    1) The Sith are the one ultimate evil in the universe, and
    2) The Sith received their final defeat in ROTJ.

    It seems to me that if you accept both of these assertions, then it is clear that the story is over, and making a sequel makes about as much sense as making “Romeo and Juliet 2.”

    The ST first tried to throw out (1) in a way that was completely unexplained and unsatisfying, but then switched gears and tried to throw out (2) in a way that was even more unexplained and unsatisfying. I guess this worked for some people, but I see the ST as an insult to what I call the “real” movies.

    I wonder if GL had a better idea up his sleeve how the story could not be over after ROTJ.
     
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  3. Stormagadon

    Stormagadon Cantina Court Jester
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    Maybe it's my head canon, but I think the contradiction in the Sith being destroyed and having sequels can be resolved by looking at the Chosen One prophecy this way: It doesn't mean the One will destroy all evil, simply the Sith*.
    Evil will always exist, so the prophecy restores balance by eliminating an entity that goes beyond a natural evil. If you were to put good and evil on a scale, evil will always outweigh good, and only a Jedi can balance it out, however a Sith still over powers the Jedi when you toss them in the mix. That's why the prophecy is necessary.

    With that in mind, or something akin to it, the Sequels would have to deal with the idea that evil will always exist, and we must always fight it.
    I think that could have been a cool struggle to see our old heroes having to deal with, especially Luke. Did he not save his father so that the prophecy could be fulfilled, only to have Ben turn to the Dark Side and evil to rear its ugly head and terrorize the galaxy? And then our new heroes deal with the reality of needing to stand up and fight while looking at their mentors who are dismayed and now feel like their achievements were all for naught (it's not, what they did was right, good, and necessary). The old heroes learn some new lessons, the new characters learn the old lessons afresh and the new ones at the same time... the cycle repeats, much like real life. We learn the lessons are parents teach us, and yet there are things and situations where we stand side by side our parents or mentors and we all learn from it.

    And yeah, I do feel like the ST kinda dropped the ball on that. Maybe some people see that the ST actually did it, but I don't think the issue stems from the idea that destroying the Sith was the end. I just wish the FO was more fully realized, and was but a mere shadow of the Empire's might.

    *Also to add, the prophecy seems to make more sense if the Sith were an ultimate evil, or something of a grand scale and spiritual malevolence, because it doesn't make much sense to me if some evil can just come back on a similar psychical scale. We're talking about the Force, so it has to be in that frame of mind in regards to Good/Evil, balance, yadi yada.
     
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  4. oldbert

    oldbert Guardian of Coffee Breaks

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    Don't know how you feel about it, but the more lifetime passes by the more I wonder about repeating patterns.
    Especially the pandemic situation lights up a lot of themes where we can see how human society gets in trouble, confronted by a crisis. All over the world people wish to forget about their own responsibility for their personal situations and look for enemies from outside instead. It's so much easier to pick a common escape goat and follow a charismatic so called leadership, that is screaming around about the enemies around us, instead of looking inside ourselves.

    Star Wars as one of the stories about heroism always sticks to the one hero our group of heroes that step up and start acting while following their personal ethic believings.
    Thinking ourselves as the harder way of life.

    Therefore it is no wonder that the ST can't surprise the grown-up fandom that much.
    We have seen stories that ate woven around a group of heroes multiple times in multiple settings. The "new" things about it could be how the sets, spaceships and costumes are designed or some surprising story telling elements or "fresh" characters.
    If someone is daring to change the SW set, spaceship and costume design "dramatically" , te reaction would be... (PT)
    If someone has the guts to bring a "very uncommon character", the reaction would be.. (PT, ST)..
    If someone goes hard against the SW storytelling we would expect, the reaction would be.. (TLJ)
    If someone would a story about the micro cosmos of "the living force", the reaction would be..(don't want to image) :D
     
    #324 oldbert, Feb 26, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2021
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  5. MagnarTheGreat

    MagnarTheGreat Jedi General

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    George Lucas: “I don’t know [how the fight for racial justice impacts the Star Wars universe going forward because] I’ve kind of lost control of Star Wars so it’s going off on a different path than what I intended. But the first six [Star Wars movies] are very much mine and my philosophy sort of goes beyond any particular time. It’s based on history, it’s based on philosophy, it’s based on a lot of things, and the first three basically tell you how a democracy turns into a dictatorship and you end up with a tyrant – the Emperor. It’s very important where we are now in our political history. The other part was that in there it’s like…I purposefully – all the various colors and [[ed: video lags here]] aliens that live in that world – it’s a normal situation, there’s no real discrimination and the only discrimination is against robots. And we haven’t really reached that period yet. And I’m sure the robots will be able to overcome it because they don’t have the same feelings.” (October 16, 2020 marked private video / Melody Hobson and George Lucas – Virtual Speaker Series at The East Harlem School At Exodus House)
     
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  6. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett Force Attuned

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    I think no matter what they did the sequels would have been controversial. You just can’t please everyone. Also look how the PT was received. George’s ideas would be received no better.
     
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  7. Martoto

    Martoto Rebel Official

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    Solo: A Star Wars Story dropped more overt droid discrimination/droidphobia references than the PT/OT combined. But some fans didn't like it. Like really, really vocally didn't like the idea.
     
  8. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett Force Attuned

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    I do think that Solo had the most overt references to that
     
  9. Martoto

    Martoto Rebel Official

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    There's a droid in that movie who talks about little else but droid rights and droid mistreatment, and who teases the non-droids about droid/non-droid relationships then starts a droid rebellion.
     
  10. Martoto

    Martoto Rebel Official

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    If you are looking for an evolution in droid-human relations in the sequel trilogy then there's the scene where 3-P0 is about to have his system rebooted in order to translate the Sith dagger. This moment seems to attract a lot of criticism for being a redundant plot point. To me it was always about 3-P0's friends offering him the choice to accept the danger. Rather than it being a significant plot obstacle.
     
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  11. risastór

    risastór Clone

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    not a fan of the prequels or sequels, but to be fair I loather prequels, origin stories in general as their not suspenseful because you know no matter how precarious the situation the guys who make it into the original movies will get through it.
    The Force awakens to me was new hope with boobies, idealistic young person w/o family (yes luke had owen and beru but like 5 minutes) living on a abrren sandbox of a planet yearning for something more, gets mixed up with a doid with a secret plan/map, meets up with a daring hot headed rogue, fights a guy with a mask and dressed in black who wants to destroy the rebellion, all eerily similar.
    Am a big fan of Daisy Ridley, but do not like the character of rey, she is the ultimate mary sue, she would be far more compelling if she failed, had flaws, things that we can relate to, luke had to grow, rey came pre packaged perfect. I love that she is a strong female lead, strong does not mean flawless, let her lose, pick herself up learn from the failing and get stronger, like sarah connor, she was a damsel in distress in 1st movie, then in 2, totall bad ass, but you learned that after the events of 1st movie, she became obsessed with getting stronger,

    there endeth the rant
     
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  12. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett Force Attuned

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    Oh I know hence my overt
     
  13. Martoto

    Martoto Rebel Official

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    You can't get more overt than a droid shouting "droid rights" and starting a droid revolt.
     
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