SPECULATION Do Rey's Parents Matter?

Oh sure, the conflict that could've arisen had they went that route. Think about Kylo Ren at the brink of victory. He's winning by a landslide. All he has to do now is kill this last Jedi and he wins. The FO wins. All of his aspirations come true. He fulfills his view of the legacy of Vader. All he has to do is kill this one Jedi and it's game over. And she's beaten down. We've got the Knights of Ren in the scene with Kylo. Rey's done for. And with her goes the Rebellion and the Jedi. Rey looks up at him as the Knights look on and she says "I'm [sister's name]." And this is his little sister who he loved more than anything. His greatest fear of loss. The growing fear that was the reason he was sent to Luke to try and help him overcome. The same fear Snoke played on and convinced him to turn to the dark side to "bring order and make the galaxy safe for your sister". Everything he did was to protect her and she died. But now, here she is, back from the "dead" - all that sentiment comes pouring back. At the edge of victory. Just kill this one Jedi. Just kill your little sister who was your world. The Knights of Ren are looking at him. They're ready to do the deed and win the war. Rey is looking at him. One of the Knights steps forward and raises his blade. Ben ignites his saber. Cue the dramatic Star Wars music.

Or what about from Rey's point of view? Suddenly the "monster" is her big brother bringing its own conflict in her. He was supposed to protect her but instead "You took everything from me!" Her anger at him for killing Han "the father you never knew". Her entire life a result of Ben's actions. The final trial is for Rey. Imagine after she would reveal the secret, now she's in a rage focused on her brother. Now Kylo is on the defensive, not wanting to fight but having to defend himself against Rey's rage directed against him as she full-tilt attacks him for all that he's done. As Kylo tips toward the light side, Rey tips toward the dark side unable to contain her anger. Kylo/Ben's just in a daze of sorrow. I'd have him finally just fall to his knees, throw his saber away and look up at Rey saying blankly "Kill me." I'd at least have him have a suicidal disposition upon learning the truth. Maybe have it all go down on Mustafar and after Rey screams about how he took her life from her and everything is hitting home, he just drops his saber and takes a step to throw himself into the lava. Rey pleads with him not to do it, something like, she needs him now, Snoke's back and yadda yadda. "We can fix this Ben. We can fix this you and me. Don't leave me againyou're all that's left you're all I have left."

That's where I would've went with it anyway. I guess we'll see what JJ et. al. come to.

Ah I'd have to go with Han being the father. It would give emphasis to Kylo's line "the father you never knew" in retrospect. It'd go a long way in connecting to why Han was out there smuggling and loitering around Jakku. Why he suddenly showed up right when Rey was leaving in the Falcon. It'd give emphasis to Kylo killing Han while Rey watched. Would connect with her mechanical skills and her knowledge of Wookie. To many connects to waste. But hey, that's just me. Obviously this isn't going to happen, so, no point in speculating about the 'could've beens'. I'm sure JJ can come up with something.

 

TEAM SUBTERFUGE! ASSEMBLE!

I wholeheartedly agree with the need for a good Skywalker/Amidala descendant in this generation.

I understand the appeal of Rey Nobody and the message that so many people liked about it. I just feel like there was such a missed opportunity if that's all there is to the ST.

Spot on, my friend. There was so much potential conflict and drama in exploring the manifestation of Anakin/Vader's duality expressed in one light and one dark grandchild, that if we do not end up with that scenario, the ST is a total swing and a miss for me. I would have absolutely LOVED if they would have brought to fruition the concept-art of Anakin/Vader vacillating between his two personaities as a Force ghost.

The question is, can these concepts and story beats about Rey's family still be salvaged from what TFA and TLJ have provided thus far? Supremely difficult, but I have a sliver of hope that it can. The ideas that this thread (and countless other posts) have provided just could be the spark that brings the ST to a satisfying conclusion... hopefully for everyone.

Oh, don't get me wrong... I was mostly joking, as I was always kind of irritated with how the PT created the immaculately-conceived-inverse-space-Jesus out of Anakin/Vader. Despite how ridiculous it may be, I was just trying to show how anything is possible (not probable) to help explain away some of the perceived roadblocks to "Rey Somebody Important to the History of the Saga."

 

Well, if you choose to be a Jedi (PT way), then you have to give up certain aspects of life.

Luke and Obi-Wan decided to focus their minds on the path of the Jedi.

Why don't you want to continue her legacy by the help of Ben and his (maybe) kids?

Who were the parents of Obi-Wan, Qui-Gon, Yoda, Mace Windu etc? Were they FS? I certainly don't think so. The Jedi were always looking for FS children/beings, so it's very likely that the force ISN'T inheritable. If it is though, then the Jedi are pretty stupid to not allow Jedi having kids.

 

I think it works better this way, not only would it be exploration of Anakin's duality, but it's also a thematic inversion of Anakin and Padme. If Ben's fall was related to a love and fear of loss leading to a desire to protect, he's Anakin reborn in theme. His Padme is Rey in theme. Obviously it's not a romantic relationship but the theme is the same. It inverts in allowing "Padme" to save "Anakin" in this finale of the story. Then the brother/sister relationship becomes a thematic Luke/Leia motif where instead of "Luke" saving the day, he turns to the dark side and "Leia" (there is another) gets to shine in the finale. So it's a triple thread inversion tying everything nicely together across three trilogies.

I think TFA laid a good foundation. Planted a bunch of seeds which can easily come to fruition in IX. TLJ I'd argue did a nice job of shutting down the theorizing. It "quashed" any theories on Rey's parents and subverted what people were talking about. For IX to work properly, I think TLJ did what it had to do. A diversion tactic to get everyone to look elsewhere. It's the only way to allow the surprises to have a real impact. When what people expect is true, you have to first give them a reason to no longer expect it. TLJ did that in spades.

As for difficulty, I should think it would be easy enough. The seeds are all over VII just waiting to grow. I think there's some stuff in VIII as well (e.g. Luke asking the question "Why you?" "But why did they send YOU?" is easily forgotten, but it's never answered - but if this is the way they go, then it's easy to understand why Leia sent Rey specifically) Also I think it would be the easiest way to go. From my point of view, there can only be three potential outcomes. One: Rey continues to try with Kylo because, hey, she's just super nice and won't give up. Two: A love story between Rey and Kylo flourishes. Three: He's her brother. One and two seem really difficult. The way Rey shut that door on Kylo at the end of VII? Man it would be really tough to write a believable, "Rey continues to try" or "Rey falls in love with Kylo" scenario.

But if force ghost Luke drops the exposition that "He's your brother. Everything that's happened to him was because of his love for you. His desire to keep you safe from harm. When you died, Ben died. The only way for Ben to come back from the dead, is if his sister comes back from the dead." So, now it's suddenly easy to understand why Rey would want to face him again. If Leia goes in IX, then Ben's now all she has left of a real family. Now Rey is all he has left. So now it's pretty easy to bring Ben back.

The only "roadblock" I've seen mentioned is something about a book "Bloodlines" or something. I heard it wasn't possible for Rey and Ben to be related because something about timing. But I asked the question a little while back and it seems to me that roadblock is based on a bunch of assumption and nothing really substantial.

But is this were JJ et. al. are going? I have no idea. About a month after I saw TFA I was pretty convinced this is where it was going. To my mind, it's the perfect way to go and I can't imagine the road isn't obvious to JJ since it was his movie and his seeds that directed my attention to this. But hey, who knows.

I do wonder if it were to happen, how many people would accuse JJ of "fan-service" or "retconning Rian" or "JJ agrees TLJ was bad that's why he retconned everything" when it was all a part of the plan since the start.

 

I want JJ to write a great story first, don’t destroy everything from the past, don’t think “fan service” is bad for $$ and SW future.

RJ either intentionally tried to make TLJ his for selfish reasons or intentionally created misdirection to allow IX to excite and surprise. We shall see.

 

1. An overabundance of Fan Service is bad for money and the future. It creates limited stories and has diminishing returns. Fans should be among the last things considered when making a movie. Even a Star War. Hell, ESPECIALLY a Star War.

2. There's nothing selfish about TLJ from a story or film making standpoint. There's no intentional misdirection in it and it would all be coincidental if JJ were to go full JJ and mystery box the Blast out of it. It's okay to not like the story in TLJ. But there's no reason to falsely attribute things like "selfishness" to Rian over it. That's when it goes beyond not liking something to a weird bad place.

 

I'm not entirely sure what you're wanting to say with that statement, but just to clarify my own point I wasn't meaning that JJ would be guilty of fan service if IX turns out in the manner I was conveying, but that people would mistakenly think he was, and use that mistaken conclusion in a way contrary to the true intent. Look, something like this:

If JJ wrote TFA with no idea of what was going to come of the story, then Rian wrote TLJ and some people were vocal about "I don't like that Snoke died" "I don't like that Rey's parents are nobodies", and then JJ comes in and reverses everything Rian did and suddenly, Snoke is back and he's Plagueis and here's what he's up to, and suddenly, Rey is the child of someone and she's not a "nobody" - if this happened then JJ would be writing fan service. Just out to cater to a small vocal group of fans displeased with TLJ. Now that, to me, is not good. Fan service in the sense of catering to the wants of fans is, from my point of view, the last thing any writer should ever do. It's the last thing any artist should ever do.

But if JJ wrote TFA knowing that, say, Snoke is Plagueis and Rey is Ben's sister, then Rian subverted everyone's expectations on purpose in order to misdirect the audience, so that JJ comes in to IX and finishes the story as intended; then that's not fan service. BUT I think it's really possible that after seeing everything "turn around" in IX, a vocal group of people would accuse JJ of "fan service" and "retconning Rian" though their accusations would be completely wrong. I've seen it happen too many times before.

I can't agree that any artist creating according to his vision can be called "selfish" since that is what art is. Any selfishness from my point of view would be on the side of the table of people saying "He's selfish because he didn't do what I wanted him to do". It's like, if a musician is writing a song, and there are some people saying "I want you to write the song the way I want it to sound", and the musician ignores them and writes the song that is the song he feels, he is not selfish, he is an artist creating art. If people then said "He is selfish for not writing his song the way a certain group of people wanted him to write it" then those people are the selfish ones in this scenario.

The thing is, I don't know that we'll ever be able to really know Rian's real goal with TLJ in the sense of its connection to the overall sequel trilogy. If JJ comes out with Snoke is Plagueis, and, Rey the sister of Ben, then I could easily conclude that was JJ's intention; because of what is in TFA. TFA and IX would be a perfect match. But where does TLJ fit in to this? Did Rian know the plan, or, did he not? It would be impossible to tell. The only thing that could happen would be Rian says "I knew the plan and purposely misdirected with my own self-contained story" but then it becomes a matter of, whether you believe his words or not. That's what it would come down to in the end. Personally, I'd believe him because that seems to me to be the perfect way to go with this trilogy in the sense of, creating the most potential to surprise the audience with "twists" that, prior to TLJ, a good number of the audience had already figured out.

 

I really loved this idea, but it also was so obvious from the night TFA came out my sons and I came up with the same basic storyline for the end of EP9. Rey and Kylo are siblings and in the end that is what causes the turn of Kylo. This is also why I think it wouldnt happen it was just too obvious.

 

Yeah but that's the thing about obvious: it's only obvious to whom it's obvious. It's like, why is that? What makes it obvious to one and not another? Why does one understand and another doesn't? It's like, you can't understand unless you understand, you know? But however obvious it may have been I think TLJ has made it less so by a long shot. Which, to me, makes it even more obvious. That's because one day I was in a thread on a message forum and someone was talking about the "surprise twist of Rey's parents" that a large number of people were expecting in VIII. This person (who was theorizing Luke as the father) was asking, "If Luke is the father, then how can it be a surprise since so many people already suspect it? I don't see how Luke being the father can come as a twist like the twist in TESB."

My reply was, "It would be easy to do, just misdirect the audience with false information first. Something like, first have Snoke reveal that he is Rey's father. Once the audience has bought the misdirection, you later reveal that Luke is actually the father. Then everyone is surprised because they bought the misdirection." So when we got to VIII with the film emphatically informing us that Rey's parents are "nobodies" I just said to myself, "And there it is." Then I look online and?



But I think it's rather brilliant in presentation because the misdirection isn't just misdirection for sake of misdirection, it actually has meaning relevant to the story itself. Rey thinking she really is nobody, the whole cave sequence showing her only herself, these are what Rey needed to see and hear at this point in the story. Rian said something about being nobody being the thing that would be hardest for Rey to hear. But she had to hear it. It's like in The Matrix when Neo is told, what he needs to hear at that moment in time in order to bring about that ultimate truth revealed in the end. Everything in VIII had to happen and was necessary to the story, and "overturning" them in IX doesn't really take away anything that happened in VIII, which things would remain true from VIII's "point of view".

 

jj Abrams gave the last Jedi producer a page of stuff that had all the stuff that was set up in the force awakens in it. the last Jedi producer wanted to do his own thing so he through it out probably with who reys parent were originally suppose to be.

i would have done the same thing if i was in his shoes but my ideas are actually good. and personally i don't care who reys parents are but at the same time i don't care for the new star wars movies either so my opinion probably wont reflect yours

 

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 29, 2018, Original Post Date: Oct 29, 2018 ---

It's obvious because the Solo twins story has been written before many times. With many twists and spins along the way. Having a truly unique character with a non-legacy background hasn't been a thing in Star Wars since 1979, before Lucas made Vader into Anakin.
That's objectively less "obvious" but since there are BILLIONS of people on the planet, someone is bound to make it sound obvious.
For 40 years we have been fed stories about legacy characters and how important Skywalkers and Solos are. Now here's Rey. From nowhere. With no last name. That's not obvious. Especially off the heels of everyone saying TFA was safe and a rehash.

 

I've been thinking more and more about this and I feel that there are further revelations to come regarding her parents. I don't think that it has to do with "who they are" but rather, what happened to them. The reason I believe this needs exploring is because Rey needs something to pull her towards the Dark Side and it seems that she now has the strength to resist Kylo and so the story requires another pulling point. I am wondering whether an old idea that I and others have suggested a while back, might indeed be the way to go. What if Rey did kill her own parents? What if she has such a raw power that it is a danger to even those that she loves? It might cross over into X-Men/Dark Pheonix territory, but it might even go some way to explain why she wasn't just abandoned on Jakku - but why she was on that specific planet.

Perhaps she was taken there as it masked her abilities? Reduced them even? Perhaps her parents knew of Lor San Tekka and sought out his help? But *something* happened where Rey uncontrollably used her powers and killed her parents? The ship leaving and the drunk deadbeat parents were simply false memories that she subconsciously invented to protect herself from the truth...

This might also be helpful in explaining why Kylo Ren believed her parents were deadbeats and how Rey accepted it. That's what he saw in her head. The fake memory. This might get complicated, there being so many levels to the truth of what happened, but there is a sense to it. Rey's 'awakening' since leaving Jakku and connecting to the Force, her incredibly quick ascension in learning about the Force and vague memories of the past (who she is) begins to add up. Otherwise, we're left with a lot of coincidences and loose ends: why was she on Jakku (along with everyone else who turns up there and everything else that happens there)? How did she truly become so powerful so quickly (were her powers held back)?

This might all be overcomplicated. There might already be enough conflict in play. But I do think it an interesting angle and I think it's this king of familial intrigue & revelation that interests a lot of fans (and JJ). I also believe it will add some extra interest onto Rey's character that has perhaps been a little on the overly virtuous side at times.

 

Was just watching TLJ last night and caught a line I hadn’t seen anyone mention, Kylo talking about Rey’s parents: “they’re dead in a paupers’ grave in the jakku dessert.” Now, he’s sure implying that with a lot of certainty, but as far as we know, the last Rey saw of her parents was them flying away in a ship (if that WAS her parents in that ship and not someone else)... how does Kylo know that they are dead?Well, maybe one of the big twists in episode IX is that Rey pulled that ship down with the force (a theory I have seen elsewhere, not my original idea) she blocked it out, but now that she has met Kylo, she realizes she also killed her parents and is not so different than him, this is part of what brings them closer in TLJ, but we are not made privy to this detail of their memory exchange.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 13, 2018, Original Post Date: Nov 13, 2018 ---

Well, maybe one of the big twists in episode IX is that Rey pulled that ship down with the force (a theory I have seen elsewhere, not my original idea) she blocked it out, but now that she has met Kylo, she realizes she also killed her parents and is not so different than him, this is part of what brings them closer in TLJ, but we are not made privy to this detail of their memory exchange.

 

Of course her parents matter... I’ve always thought her truly being a “nobody” was a bit of a cop-out

And it’s something I do hope JJ remedies in E9

 

How is that a cop out?

 

You didn't love hearing how he was obviously Lando's or Mace's kid because he's black so he all but HAD to be....

I honestly hope that's a reveal just to highlight how boring family reveals are when they are expected/wildly unearned
*stares menacingly at JK Rowling*

 

It is possible that Rey could be "no one" and be off spring of a powerful family. She was "no one" and by the end of TLJ, she was "someone" as evidence by Poe's "I know" who you are line at the end. Rey became someone without the pressure that Ben Solo probably felt being the son of Solo/Leia and Grandson of Vader, Nephew of Luke. Imagine the pressure? Rey did it alone. Now imagine after you made yourself into who you are, you find out you are the offspring of a powerful family. Does it really change who you are?

I still think Finn is related to that Zare Leonis Character from Star Wars Rebels .

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 19, 2018, Original Post Date: Nov 19, 2018 ---

My personal head canon prior to TLJ was that Rey almost kills her parents. She's does things that freak them out, especially if they are simple minded junk traders with no knowledge of the force. Maybe one day she got angry and almost kills them. They decide to sell her to Unkar as their ticket off the planet. It doesn't explain Kylo's comments, but I would trust her vision (everything else came true or happened) over Kylo. The dude isn't that great at the whole reading minds thing anyway. lol.

 

Then what would be the narrative reason for her to have that lineage other than fan service?
If it doesn't change who you are and she arrived at the right decisions and actions without it...it's superfluous. It's fluff there to assuage those who had built elaborate theories on who she is.