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Failure of the Rebels/Resistance

Discussion in 'General Sequel Trilogy Discussion' started by Kato Sai, Oct 20, 2019.

  1. Kato Sai

    Kato Sai Jedi Commander

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    I stumbled upon a great critique of the Rebellion:

    “If you think about it, the Rebellion from the original trilogy didn't do a very good job of things.

    They bring down the Empire and yet within a generation they go down in flames and the even worse "1st Order" rises to power.

    Maybe they should have just let Vader and the Empire run things and call it a day.” (ELS, Yahoo).

    The remarks of ELS makes a point. The Empire is reborn rather quickly as the First Order and it is obvious the FO has major revenues and tech.

    The Rebels/Resistance are fighting a hopless battle. The Empire/First Order brings order to the Galaxy, and the Resistance simply brings suffering and death (they call it sacrifice, I call it “self slaughter”). The truth is before Luke appears at the end of TLJ, when Leia says “the spark is out, hope has run out,” (paraphrase), that is how it needs to be. All this revolting against the Empire is in vain. Eventually the gaalaxy will see the romantic rebellion is bankrupt when the heroism wears off, and the reality sets in that the rebels can’t even maintain a Republic for long.

    Feel free to disagree with me, but the Rebellion is a dream, and in the end the galaxy will take Han’s old disposition and just focus on making s living and tolerating the imperial inspections.
     
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  2. Martoto

    Martoto Rebel Official

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    The Rebel Alliance was not intened to reconquer the former Republic. It's aim was to decapitate the current regime and the restore the senate that defined the former republic. The fate of the former galactic empire was then in the hands of all its former member systems. The Alliance itself was still only a "small band of rebels" at the time of the battle of Endor and could not conceivably represent all the systems of the former Empire/Old Reublic.

    The rebel alliance did acheive its aim of restoring freedom to the galaxy. But that necessarily included the freedom for some systems to decline membership of the new republic, to retain their identification with the former imperial system, for the New Republic to elect to use appeasement and agree to separation from those former systems, and for the First Order to rise from thes "ashes".

    The First Order is not the fault of the Rebels. It is a product of the settlement to the GCW that all the former Republic/Empire member systems agreed to.
     
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  3. Kato Sai

    Kato Sai Jedi Commander

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    I like how you delved into not all planetary systems would want to join the New Republic/Rebellion, and would instead be content with Imperial rule. I would have loved to see planets in total willful submission to the Empire (perhaps TROS will feature one?)

    Your concept that the rebels achieved freedom for the galaxy by offering a choice, Empire or Republic, oppose to eliminating the Empire/First Order is very intriguing. Having s choicr is freedom, not eliminating the Empire. I want to revist this.
     
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  4. FastestKnight

    FastestKnight Force Sensitive

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    I'm very curious to see how the whole Rebellion v. Empire ends. Because I'm 100% sure it will end on a happy note (Rebels winning against 50 million Star Destroyers/Empire surrending because they weren't that evil after all, just Palps) but after seeing the end of Return of the Jedi and Force Awakens, I wonder how they'll convince us that the same thing (New New Republic destroyed, Second Order rises to fight the "Revolution"/"Uprising" formed by 12 people) won't happen again.

    JJ wants to "tie everything" but he didn't care about the prequels, which were 70% politics and 10% different worlds. He focused on the original trilogy, which tied perfectly with Sith, and focused on giving us another Empire vs Rebels, skipping 30 years, without giving us the Galaxy's status quo beyond a line in the opening crawl. Now it feels disjointed (in my opinion) as we haven't seen a city or a planet with more than 200 inhabitants.

    But yeah, I don't think the ending will make the Rebels/Resistance look incompetent.
     
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  5. Kato Sai

    Kato Sai Jedi Commander

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    A happy note for me is the First Order annhilates, obliterates, and destroys the Rebellion once and for all! :D My hope is that it ends in darkness, with the Empire prevailing and civilizing the galaxy. I suspect however that JJ will go ROTJ and have the Rebels/Resistance win as you say.

    But how it should end is that the whole story flips and you discover the Sith are good (see Book of Sith) and the Jedi are the villians.

    The truth is Rey will join Kylo as Supreme Mistress and Dark Lady!

    45ADC86A-57D0-447B-BFC0-806F8699B7DB.png

    On a more serious note you brought up revolution and the Second Order rising to quell it. History shows us revolutions/rebellions are like bonefires that burn out; often the end result is the revolutionaries settle into tepid hierarchy and end up becoming “the very thing they swore to destroy.” (Kenobi). Its the whole we tear it down and for lack of ideas or vision for the aftermath we rebuild what we tore down.

    That is why I say the Rebellion is romantic, not realistic. It plays on the notions of self righteousness, self determination, and self protection. The rebel feels their cause is just and all sacrifices are seen as heroism, when they are tragedy, because sooner or later the rebels will fail and the empire will rise again.
     
    #5 Kato Sai, Oct 20, 2019
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  6. FastestKnight

    FastestKnight Force Sensitive

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    I see what you are saying. Without having witnessed how the New Republic worked, I think it is safe to say that the Galaxy ran better with the Empire at the helm. The problem, of course, is that they are the bad guys, no way, literally, no way, they would win. Also, the Sequel trilogy is doing everything it can to make them look as incompetent and salty as possible (which is funny because the original Empire was calm, cold and a force not to be messed with).

    I will be funny to see how things work with Kylo at the helm though.
     
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  7. Kato Sai

    Kato Sai Jedi Commander

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    The Rebellion is like Visigoths, Ostogoths, and Vandals who sacked Rome (Western Empire) and when they are done they end up coming under Rome reborn (Roman Catholic Church) and apply imperial law under their Medieval system (The Inquistions). The fact is the Republic only works if each individual wants to take responsibility as a citizen, know the laws and obey them; most sentients would rather be told what to do and leave the responsbility to a governing power (Emperor and Imperial aristocracy). The fact of the matter is the rebels enjoy rebellion, but have no clue how much disicipline and hardwork it will be to help systems move from submission to autocracy to democracy. The rebels are “trying to fly when they haven’t learned to walk.”

    To your point the ST is depicting The First Order/Empire as incompetent and lacking calculated precision. We need a New Vader to put them “back on schedule.” Kylo needs to allow Hux to fill in on a administrational role, and leave himself to being like Snoke, The Puppet Master.
     
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