For those who have seen the movie, do you like it or hate it?

The strangest thing to me about TLJ wasn’t the odd link between Kylo and Rey. Nor the glazed over lore that I was admittedly building too much of my own hype for. But the fact that they stuck the whole film into that contained 24-hour time frame. It stole the possibility of greater exploration and felt like it should have been a spinoff film or an episode of Rebels.
Now having seen two of the Sequel trilogy I’m starting to see what it is that I’m not grabbing onto with this new trilogy. It feels too constricted. As if they are using this trilogy to kill off the heart song of the story as we know it. The dying embers of the resistance, our Skywalker storyline coming to a close. Culminating in a 9th film that snuffs it all out for good.

And it’s all set up beautifully for Princess Leia to lead a finale we’ll never get to see. RIP Carrie Fisher

 

I feel like this movie was in many ways what TFA should have been, told the story of Luke, Rey, and Ben.

Johnson seems to have erased TFA away. Whose Snoke? No one! Why is Kylo obsessed with Vader? Snoke, the powerful nobody. Rey is nobody! Actually, I think either Snoke or Kylo lied.

Because as of right now, there’s no bug reveal waiting in 9.

Agreed! The parents thing was given too much attention to have that be the answer! There are no Skywalkers left. Unless in isolation Luke got him a little some something, Then

 

ok, so i watched TLJ last night.

My biggest wish for the film was for myself and the rest of the fan base to be challenged. I knew with 100% certainty that the fans would be split... they were split after TFA, and there was no story that RJ could have made that would have brought the fans back together again. Some people here were dead set on disliking the film if it didn't go a certain way.... 2 years of arguing for certain theories and character outcomes will do that to a person.

did i want Luke's story to go that way? absolutely not.
did i want Rey to be a nobody? no, i wanted her to be Luke's daughter.
did i want Kylo Ren to be in charge of the FO at the end of TLJ? no, i wanted Ben redeemed.
did i want Snoke to be a bit-part character that is now apparently of no importance whatsoever? absolutely not.

so i hated it right? no, absolutely not.

I LOVED IT !!

i wanted new, fresh and different... that's what RJ gave me.

This film will divide us, i have no doubts about that... but the passion we share for Star Wars will re-unite us for ep 9.


@master_shaitan after a couple of years of dueling about different topics, it's ironic that the film went the way it did.. and that we both loved it we wanted something new... something that went beyond the characters we've been tied to from the past.

 

Glad you liked it my friend. I was blown away. Hooked from start to finish.

Just get those credits to me when you can

 

I really understand why you may be unhappy, but I really don’t get why so many that didn’t like it keep trying to throw lines in like, “but right now I really don't see how a die hard fan of the original movies could walk away from TLJ anything but disappointed,”

You do see why die hard fans of OT like it, plenty of them here saying it. But it almost feels like you ready to relegate anyone who enjoyed this film into some kind sub fan. Maybe you didn’t meant it, but it feels that way.

I like the direction. I have issues, Rey parents, lack of meat about who Knights of Ren are. Kylo Ren became leader, or did he build it.

Whose Snoke! A long drawn out battle to save gas.

But those shortcomings pale in the things it did right, talked about the Jedi flaws, brought back Yoda, burned the past. And opened the way for something new.

KEYWORD, NEW. TFA was lazy and didn’t expand anything. TLJ did that.

He seemed to have mind read Ben Solo and searched his feelings, seen darkness and thought about stopping it. He failed to take action, like Anakin did, and it cost the Jedi Order Again.

 

Sensing the dark side (another potential darth vader acording to snoke) isn't just an assumption imo. History repeats itself and Luke thought for a brief moment he could do what Obi Wan couldn't, and end Kylo Ren before he became Kylo Ren. He knew imidiately after that it was wrong as well.

 

yup same.

i'm old enough to remember how badly ESB was received back in the day. it was fresh and new, and it took people time to come around to it.
TLJ won't be everyone's cup of tea, but i think it may grow on those that aren't sure.. i hope so anyway.

lol incoming... but are you absolutely sure that what Kylo said to her is the end of it? whilst i'm semi satisfied that she is a random... i'm not 100% convinced that will be the end of the subject on this forum. i suspect the topic of who she is will continue.

absolutely agree.

 

Oh, you mean like when Luke looked down at his prosthetic hand and saw the extent to which Vader was a machine (and a prisoner of the Emperor), realizing that giving into such feelings would only perpetuate a cycle of hatred and suffering that only serves those who cultivate it in others? Do you see why I believe this trilogy is contrived in its narrative construction and genuinely feels kind of pointless? Especially when only one character seems to get any decent characterization but solely at the expense of another character?

 

The point is Luke momentarily reacted emotionally but it was fleeting and he controlled himself. It wasn’t like he actually went through with anything after giving it some thought.

 

It's pretty anticlimactic to build an entire trilogy off of that when considering the timespan and themes of the two prior trilogies.

 

Again, for the ST to have a story, Luke had to mess up somewhere. What would you have written?

 

How is that relevant?

 

Because you’re complaining about what they did with Luke without suggesting an alternative.

 

Why must I suggest an alternative in order to point out the flaws with what already exists?

 

Then you must be of he view that the ST was flawed before it started - that there was no good direction for it to go in. With that being the case, why bother discussing it at all?

 

On the contrary, I was rather optimistic of The Force Awakens prior to it coming out. I was excited to see what an alternative take on the Star Wars universe may look like now that a new continuity existed. However, it left me somewhat jaded with some hopes that Rian would shrug off some of the problems only to realize that the structural issues that originated from TFA were going to affect The Last Jedi, no matter what. I don't go into the experience of watching films hoping to dislike them.

 

Even before TFA was conceived, Luke was a problem. They had to have him fail in some way. They had to deplete him as a hero. They had to get him out the way. They needed to have a reason for a new hero.

Rian just did it in the best way he could and I think it worked very well. ROTJ was an ending to the story and in deciding to continue it, there were always going to be compromises. Luke brought peace with his father and rejected the dark side. They had to break that in some way to enable them to continue the story. A momentary dark thought by Luke that e immediately regretted and didn’t follow through on but that was unfortunately seen by Ben, was in my view a master stroke. As was the scene with Yoda that didn’t undo anything we saw in the OT but allowed the story to go further.

 

Listen, I think we're talking in circles here. I understand that something had to give. Unfortunately, the thing that had to give was what made Luke such a great character in the first place and the payoff was not worth the sacrifice. I've given articulate reasons as to why that is and you just seem to keep telling me the same thing over and over again and saying that it was masterful with no real reasons as to why you think that.

 

It was masterful because it didn’t ruin Luke’s character whilst enabling the story to go forward. I’m hearing complaints from you but no idea how you would’ve continued the story.

 

Having slept on the movie for a night I have to admit I’m even more frustrated than when I left the theater. There were many things about the movie the let me down, but these 3 really stand out:

1. The lightsaber shoulder toss by Luke. Rian took one of the all-time cinematic cliffhangers that we all spent 2 years debating and wondering what was next and turned it into an SNL skit moment. It made no sense for the the character of Luke or any person. No one reacts like that except in a bad movie or a comedy skit. An all-time missed opportunity.

2. Mary Poppins Leia. This completely took me out of the movie at the time. I realize it’s silly to say this, but even for a space fantasy SW is always best with some sort of grounding in reality. When the explosion happened and Leia was gone my first reaction was “WOW! What a controversial and gutsy move by RJ to kill Leia so unceremoniously - SW meets Game of Thrones.” But then...awful, fake looking special effects take over and somehow and for some reason suddenly The Force makes her something not even Darth Vadar could be - impervious to injury and death! Just mind boggling.

3. The slowest space “battle” of all-time. The massive First Order fleet follows the Resistance until it runs out of gas! What?? Contrast that with the visceral energy and adrenaline rushes of the Empire pursuing the Falcon into an asteroid field or the chaotic beauty of the battle of Scarif in RO. This was like the Seinfeld scene with the old people chasing George Costanza in their motorized walkers. Just awful.

And these don’t even touch on the uselessness of the entire Canto Bight scene or even the “Rebel decoder rings”.

I really hate to be so negative. The Snoke throne room scene was great. I loved that Rey’s parents are seemingly “nobodies” and I thought Mark Hamill was really great with what he had to work with with. But in the end, TLJ erased an enormous amount of the goodwill and love TFA and RO had built back for me in the SW saga.