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George Lucass Star Wars Sequel Trilogy Treatments Also Had Luke Skywalker Dying in Episode VIII

Discussion in 'SWNN News Feed' started by SWNN Probe, Oct 13, 2020.

  1. SWNN Probe

    SWNN Probe Seeker

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    [​IMG]



    A highly criticized moment in the Star Wars sequel trilogy was the death of Luke Skywalker in Star Wars: The Last Jedi. Well, according to Lucasfilm Creative Executive Pablo Hidalgo's new book Star Wars: Fascinating Facts, George Lucas had Luke Skywalker die in the treatment of his Episode VIII as well.



    On page 140 of the book, Hidalgo reveals 'Luke Skywalker's Destiny', which was written years before production began on the actual Episode VIII. It confirms that George Lucas had Luke Skywalker die in the middle chapter of his sequel trilogy story too. Now, how he designed his death is unknown but it appears Luke was destined to become one with the Force in Episode VIII regardless of who was making the film. It is possible Kathleen Kennedy and Rian Johnson felt a higher sense of confidence in the decision to kill Luke knowing that the maker himself had made the decision first. Here is an image of the page posted by Twitter user @Oozer.



    [​IMG]



    George Lucas is on record that he gave his treatments to Kathleen Kennedy and Disney but that they chose not to use his stories. However, it appears that at least some things remained the same, including a big decision regarding the time Luke Skywalker would become one with the Force.



    The book is full of interesting anecdotes and facts about the history of Star Wars and what some could refer to as 'what could have been.' But either way, it appears to be a must own for fans of the franchise, especially the history of the franchise behind the scenes.



    [​IMG]



    Star Wars: Fascinating Facts by Pablo Hidalgo was released October 13 by Simon & Schuster.



    Click HERE to check out and comment on this topic on our main site
     
    #1 SWNN Probe, Oct 13, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2020
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  2. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    NO! It was all Ruin Johnson dammit!

    The StarWarz69 YouTube channel told me so!
     
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  3. deadmanwalkin009

    deadmanwalkin009 Rebel Official

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    So looks like TLJ used the most of George's ideas compared to the other 2 movies, interesting. I said this before and i'll stand by it but TLJ is closer to the type of film George would of made compared to TFA. Instead of "poop" jokes we got "your mama" jokes.
     
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  4. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    And yet the "George Lucas needs to save Star Wars" crowd almost unilaterally dislikes TLJ....
    Quite interesting indeed
     
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  5. deadmanwalkin009

    deadmanwalkin009 Rebel Official

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    Totally. I know this is an "what if" but I honestly think people wouldn't like George's version of the ST had he made it. However, they maybe little bit more forgiving since it came from the creator directly, not from a 3rd party so to speak.
     
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  6. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    I think you are right on the money.
    And a lot of it depends on which Lucas ST we got. He had several plans.
    The microscopic exploration of midichlorians? That gets a big yikes from most people I would think.

    Thought Osmosis Jones taught us people didn't want that
     
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  7. Andrew Waples

    Andrew Waples Jedi General

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    I think he would've further explored midichlorians, but it wouldn't have been the focus. I mean, it still would've been a popcorn Star Wars movie first: a lightsaber fight, space battles, the whole 9 yards. Personally, I'd love a main story where it actually uses midichlorians.
     
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  8. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    I'd agree except he's said in interviews it'd be the focus.
     
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  9. Andrew Waples

    Andrew Waples Jedi General

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    Literally or metaphorically? It could just simply be about "working together for mutual advantage."
     
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  10. MandoChip

    MandoChip Hate me later. Work now.
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    I like the TLJ, but I'd take George's version of episode 8 over it any day.
     
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  11. Jaimz the Jedi

    Jaimz the Jedi Rebel General

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    I’m surprised by how surprised people are by this?

    I though it was common knowledge George’s VII pitch was similar to The Last Jedi?

    I’m sure I read an article about it years ago. It basically said George pitched his idea but JJ & Kasdan threw it out. Then Rian came in to do VIII and picked up some of the ideas that had been originally intended for VII...

    George’s reaction to the films would serve as some proof of this. He was critical of TFA (which didn’t use his pitch) and was very complimentary about TLJ and Rian (which used his initial pitch as inspiration).
     
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  12. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    Well....

     
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  13. Veronica

    Veronica Rebel General

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    Well, well. I wonder what TFM has to say about this?
    --- Double Post Merged, Oct 14, 2020, Original Post Date: Oct 14, 2020 ---
    They might be a bit more forgviing if it was a straight up pop corn film a la Michael Bay/Clone Wars. But not if George had attempted to make it as cerebral and nuanced as Rian did (which I suspect he would have attempted).
     
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  14. Pobody's Nerfect

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    Osmosis Jones was the greatest movie ever! "Drix! Stop dancing!"
     
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  15. p03

    p03 Human/Cyborg Relations

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    I always expected Luke to die. Mark is not getting any younger and fully expected a limited force ghost. Even when TLJ was in production he shared an image of his cape hung up and I was like, here we go. Some where suggesting it was Rey's poncho when it was clearly a lot longer, different materials and a different colour. I think I even posted that on here. We also had a poster on the forum who had personal snaps and went to Ireland herself. She was the biggest Mark Hamill / Luke fan and she already new Luke was dead even back then. But fans couldn't accept that. For me this was never the big problem for me. It was how he died and how Luke was portrayed. Drinking animal breast milk and the throwing the lightsaber was unfunny and trying to kill 'Ben'? How? when Luke was the most compassionate character that saved his father from darkness, the very darkness he nearly succumbed to? One who would walked that path and understood that journey? It's out of character he would not have gone creeping into his nephew's bedroom. Besides he could have sensed and looked into his mind without even been in the hut. So that also doesn't make sense either. Luke been depressed could have worked but the TLJ arc? I didn't like his trajectory and then he died. I would have preferred a better death and story arc. The criticism that people wanted god tier Luke and have him hijack the plot was also bothersome. So am in the middle. Yes I wanted better for Luke but I fully understand and expected his death. Rian & Lucas were right but am pretty sure George would have had a better story.
     
    #15 p03, Oct 18, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2020
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  16. The Birdwatcher

    The Birdwatcher Rebel Official

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    But fans couldn't accept that. For me this was never the big problem for me. It was how he died and how Luke was portrayed. Drinking animal breast milk and the throwing the lightsaber was unfunny and trying to kill 'Ben'? How? when Luke was the most compassionate character that saved his father from darkness, the very darkness he nearly succumbed to?

    .....
    I don't know how many times that I have to answer this question.

    Luke was the most compassionate character

    upload_2021-2-2_15-37-42.png

    Tell me, is Hamill's expression here compassionate? (Head nods.). "Then, my father is truly dead.". He doesn't really act sad or even dismayed here as the read line suggests- if he does it's difficult to observe. There is no sense of pity from Luke from what I know, either. He might be angry or disappointed, but even that's unclear. The head nodding suggests- "So, that's how it is.". But Luke saying that Vader's dead is a stab in the gut for Vader from Luke. While Luke might be waking up Vader through that sentence, (and I was thinking this over, so) he's basically saying- "Oh yeah, if you're on the dark side, then you're dead.". Luke's trying to forcefully make Vader to come out to the light side with force and without much rationale (i.e. arguing that the rebels aren't a source of conflict or are worth the conflict), besides saying that the light side is your true self. He acts with force and arrogance, combined with a robotic sense of stuff. I know that Obi-Wan told Luke to bury his feelings deep down (a contradiction from Star Wars where he was asked to "stretch out with his feelings"); however, before and during Jabba's palace, Luke acts with arrogance, "I know what's right", combined with stoicism, with relapses of fear. That is most of his expressions throughout the film itself.

    upload_2021-2-2_15-41-36.png

    "I know, father." Either he's cutting back on his emotions like crazy or Hamill (is more likely) being lazy. I have no idea what directing that they gave Hamill here- he seems to be stuck in a sort of limbo between this "wise, Obi-Wan"- type character with some arrogance (cockiness?) and utter stoic. Again, this might not even be a character problem, if anything it stems from trying to reverse/inverse lines from TESB, which makes Luke the dominant or the assertive one over/equal to Vader in this scene, whereas Luke, while holding his ground, was getting his butt kicked from Vader, and Vader was making all these attempting appeals to Luke. Inverting the appeals from Vader to Luke ["Come with me", etc.] not only makes Luke appear immature (since Luke is trying to be more mature like Vader as opposed to when he got his butt kicked in Empire just a year ago), Vader-esque (out of character, since Luke is more compassionate and empathetic, despite his recklessness and uncaring attitude at times), and is pathetic since Luke is trying to put Vader in his place by arguing to him that he should come with him. By what authority or force? (Besides taking the moral ground/righteousness.) In terms of roles or positions, Luke just handed himself in as a prisoner to talk with Vader, but here he's acting as if he's in control or a master over Vader. Vader is this nightmarish force of evil in ANH and TESB and even some in ROTJ.

    upload_2021-2-2_15-42-51.png

    "I will not turn, and you'll be forced to kill me."

    It's super robotic and presumptuous.

    One who would walked that path and understood that journey? It's out of character he would not have gone creeping into his nephew's bedroom.

    Third phase of the throne room fight is "Kill Vader". It's based on that. Considering how afraid Luke gets even over Vader knowing that he's on the shuttle to Endor, shows how he gets cold feet in Return. If one has to reconcile his fears from his character in ROTJ with his TLJ character, then it makes sense.

    Drinking animal breast milk

    Blue milk reference, as well as Rian's sense of adult/gross humor, perhaps. When I watched it in the theater, I was reminded of Jar Jar saying, "Peeyousa" to the camel shaking its butt at the camera after all the podracers get out their flags in the The Phantom Menace. The difference being that Rey is horrified and disgusted while Luke acts like this gross milk is great; he's trying to get her off the island, even to gross her out. The fact that Rey was outright disgusted rather than saying "icky" I think shows the comedy of the scene better.

    he throwing the lightsaber was unfunny

    I felt relief because TFA was taking the lightsaber too seriously in TFA. IT'S JUST A LIGHTSABER even if it is symbol of peace and justice. And it shows Luke rejecting the call. Is the scene a bit too dramatic about it, which makes it unfunny? The thing is, Rey and the others are deluded that Luke the hero will save all of their problems, but the truth of the matter isn't that simple- Luke is a flawed human being.

    If I may be so blunt here, but I think that this "Luke the hero" arises from not looking at the OT scripts carefully enough. Luke is flawed and whiny in ANH, but even he receives help from Han to help explode the Death Star. In Empire, Luke is uncaring, impolite, uncontrolled, reckless, and hasty, but he still has a good heart and the willingness to make hard decisions in light of opposition, anyways.

    ROTJ Luke is where the heroism starts getting stale. Luke's expressions are severely cut down in whininess, the green lightsaber, the black clothes. He looks cool, right? Well, he looks cool, but WHAT the character actually does both in terms of realism, logic, and a strong moral character is contradicted. And I don't think that it was necessarily intentional besides Lucas and Kasdan not paying enough attention to areas that were of concern.

    Besides he could have sensed and looked into his mind without even been in the hut.

    Depends. Vader still needs to be in close proximity to sense Luke's feelings in Return. And it's unclear if it's a light side or dark side Force power.

    The criticism that people wanted god tier Luke and have him hijack the plot was also bothersome.

    They wanted Return's Luke. They wanted a Luke without drama, who was ontop, who could put even Vader into his place. They wanted a Luke who was cool, I think.
     
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