Great article about Luke

Interesting. Luke's greatest strengths, his idealism and compassion, become his greatest weakness when they're shattered. Only a person who expects so much of himself could be as disappointed in himself as the Luke of Acht-To.

 

there's something about the magnitude of Luke's responsibility with Ben and how he perceives that (not just the galactic implications, but the family ones as well), that seems to not sink in for some. Leia trusted him with her son. and he feels like he failed him in the worst way possible, giving rise to the monster he was afraid of all along.

and i've seen that people argue that he would have taken time off and regrouped and tried to fix the problem (and not waited 6+ years or chosen to just die), and yet even at the end of TLJ, while he acknowledges that he can make a great sacrifice for Leia and the galaxy, he still can't save Ben ~ which he probably knew all along.

Luke had two choices: go after and kill his nephew (who was never going to cede a fight), or go into exile.
he chose family over the galaxy ~ just as he did in ESB/RotJ.
and just as in RotJ, he came back in the end to find a way to serve both.

 

Great article. There have been some really great articles breaking down this film. To me, The Last Jedi is one of if not the best written Star Wars film. Enormous care and thought went into each decision. Rian Johnson was an inspired choice to steer this film. I can't wait to see what he comes up with not constrained by previous choices.

 

Its amazing how the critics and arts community have really embraced this movie. Not really unexpected for a movie which revolves around the issue of 'the heroes you meet in real life might not be the heroes you imagined: once you accept their humanity you'll understand their heroism', and which then has thousands of Star Wars fans fuming in anger over the fact that Luke is presented 'too much as a human' and for not being 'the kind of hero they imagined he would be' [apart from act III of course, that Luke is lol]

That is some deep stuff, especially when you consider that the man who had to perform that role reacted the same way when he first read the script, then loved it when he finally saw the result, and also really outdid himself by delivering a stellar acting performance

God, I love this movie.

 

more ammunition...

 

To have Luke as fallible is one thing but to have him consider and briefly give in to the urge to kill his student and nephew, Leia's son, with a lightsaber is too much. The character that seen the good nobody else did in one of cinema's worst villains and bought it out of him. Kylo appears far more sympathetic than Vader was, yet we are to believe that he has given up on him. Despite him having messed things up in the first place. To the point that he wants to dissuade others from trying to reach the good inside Kylo.

So it isn't just that he gave up afterwards, its the story of his fall which is too much for me. The thing that made Luke a hero wasn't just his physical bravery it was the strength of his character. When he turned on Ben, Luke became the bad guy. His moral culpability is masked by how pathetic he has become. If you want to make Luke bad have a damn good reason and story for doing so not just to make the point that heroes are people.

 

The man truly is an unguided projectile

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 7, 2018, Original Post Date: Jan 7, 2018 ---

But what did Luke see inside his mind. Luke very much did the same as he did in ROTJ. At the a moment he gave in to the darkside and considered killing Vader (for the briefest moment is crossed his mind), but he didn't. That's what Luke does in TLJ. It crosses his mind when he sees Ben's future, the destruction he would cause, the death of Luke's friends - Han - and many other horrors). He's a human being, not a saint, he considers ending it all for the briefest moment, as we would all do. But what makes Luke a hero is that despite knowing what will happen he doesn't strike.

Heroes are not pious saints, they're human, they have human emotions and make human decisions.

How can one ever appreciate Luke's action of throwing away the sabre on the deathstar II, if we hadn't seen that brief moment where he was prepared to strike and enthralled by the darkside.

IT IS HIS STRENGTH OF CHARACTER WHICH MAKES HIM OVERCOME THE URGE TO KILL

my view.

 

Completely agree, I can understand Luke's behavior after Ben turned on him because it was his fault, but for him to consider killing Ben is simply unbelievable bad writing. You have a character whose greatest strengths were believing in redemption against all odds and showing unbelievable compassion against his enemy, to the point of choosing self sacrifice and then you have him act in the complete opposite way...

 

Just got out of my third viewing. The sequence in question went like this:

1. Luke goes to to Kylo's hut NOT to kill him, but to look into his heart. He's worried about a growing darkness that he has sensed.
2. Luke looks into Kylo while he sleeps, and sees and hears the massacre that Kylo will commit.
3. He is horrified at what he sees and hears.
4. He thinks "OH MY GOD I HAVE TO END THIS! Wait, no......i can't do that." It lasts literally a couple of seconds.
5. Kylo wakes up and everything goes to s***.

There is nothing evil about Luke's intentions at any point. His reactions are so relatable. He's always been a very human and relatable hero. I've gone into this issue much more in depth in other threads, so I don't want to get into it too much, but I love what Rian did with this portion of the film. I've been emotionally invested in it each of the three times I've seen the film. It still saddens me to see all the negativity surrounding this aspect of the film.

Also, great article.

 

Yes I know how the sequence went, I've seen it endless times, I also don't want to repeat myself by going into depth over this.
Let's just say what you find very human and relatable is to me completely unacceptable behavior, not only for a hero but for any human being. Considering killing someone because of what he "might" do is a terribly evil thing to do.

 

The parallels feel a little stretched. Part of me was with Luke when he was tempted while fighting Vader. I questioned whether Vader could be redeemed, feared for Leia. He was onboard a planet-crushing space station with no means of escape. Vader had made it clear he would kill Luke. Here, Ben was asleep and not yet turned. I appreciate that it can be argued that both could be seen as manifestations of Luke's instincts, but in the first case, I sympathised. The story isn't fleshed out so there is wiggle room, but with Ben, Luke's instincts appear to be simply morally wrong.

 

That's why he doesn't do it. You don't want him to consider it. Luke doesn't want to consider it. You don't want Luke to strike. Luke doesn't want to strike. And he doesn't strike.

If Hitler would be my nephew and I would see what he would do in the future, and more specifically, to my friends, loved ones and family, I would seriously consider killing him. Perhaps I would kill him. I'm not as strong as Luke.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 7, 2018, Original Post Date: Jan 7, 2018 ---

"Snoke had already turned his mind". Besides, everything Luke had seen, came true. Poetically.

Edit: Lucas always intended this sequel trilogy to make us question our morality. What is good, what is bad? How many shades of light and dark are there? Isn't it wonderful that this is exactly what we are doing? That we are discussing the morality of people's actions in the sequel trilogy? That we are having a conversation?

I think it is awesome and is exactly the reason why this movie is so strong. The people who think that Luke went too far are reacting exactly in the same manner as Rey did when she learned the truth. She was just as upset by Luke's intention, thoughts and actions as you are. Always remember that you are seeing the galaxy and the revealed truths always through eyes of Rey. She is us. The writers want you to react and feel like Rey does.

 

as someone who has held Luke to be the paradigm of goodness since i saw the OT in the theatres as a child, i legit struggle with the idea of him even thinking for a second to harm a hair on Ben's head.

but ultimately for me what he thinks in one split second and the shame of it after is more than well-balanced by the manner in which he takes action at the end.
the fact that he stared down his nephew (and the whole FO), and saved the Resistance without harming that proverbial hair on Ben's head more than demonstrates that he's still the Luke who does not believe in giving in to fear or anger. still the same Luke who saved Anakin. still the hero who was more than willing to make the ultimate sacrifice for the Resistance, for Leia, and for Ben.

 

I don't know if I agree Luke turning bad would have been for entirely selfish reasons. He was seduced by the dark side and gave into his anger as part of saving the ones he loved. With Ben, he gave into his fears at a moment when all options don't appear to be exhausted. I didn't connect with and understand that as the actions of a good man. Rather, it makes Luke appear weak and morally questionable. I am not sure how much somebody would have to do to justify that they considered killing their nephew in their sleep, to the point of drawing a weapon. That they only gave into the thought for a second wouldn't be enough.

 

You do realize that whether or not you deem something as morally acceptable, doesn't determine whether or not humans act/think that way, right? That seems to be a bit of a high horse to sit on and judge the film by...

I don't believe that one good act at the very end of a lifetime of murder and evil can redeem a person, but what kind of critic would I be if I slammed the ending of ROTJ, and held Vader's redemption against the film and filmmakers. How dare they not adhere to my personal moral code...? No...

 

Sorry if I have been unclear, I don't mean to say it doesn't make sense in the logical sense. Characters can feasibly change in all sorts of ways. This isn't like TLJ suddenly declaring that, actually, Luke was Vader's father. It is logically valid and can fit the rest of the story. I am trying to get across why I personally didn't like the direction the film took Luke down. Namely, that this departure is more to me than "our hero is human" and instead that "our hero is bordering on criminally bad". It followed this up with him hiding away and waiting for death. This sort of a change in Luke "works" but is not what I wanted to see, and the payoff for doing so isn't there for me. Luke is no longer the hero he was to me, in any recognisable form. I appreciate for others the story worked and that is great.