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Guest Post: The Alien Issue in the Star Wars Sequels

Discussion in 'SWNN News Feed' started by SWNN Probe, Jan 24, 2018.

  1. SWNN Probe

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    [​IMG]

    There are many many alien species we have come to associate with Star Wars. In the original trilogy we had Rodians, Twi’Leks, Duros, Bith, Aqualish, Ithorians - the list goes on and on. Hardcore fans can name even the most obscure. These were the aliens we as an audience and a fandom came to know and love. The prequels (love ‘em or hate ‘em) brought back many of the familiar species of the original trilogy and introduced us to new ones such as the Neimoidians, Toydarians, Gungans, Dugs, Zabraks, Kel Dors (who doesn’t love Plo Koon?), Togrutas, Pauans, Kaminoans, and others. The Clone Wars and Rebels series added a few more. The galaxy far, far away was growing, but where are all the familiar species now? Now, it feels like a different galaxy altogether (sort of).





    [​IMG] Author’s doodle of a Rodian, Twi’Lek, Bith, Aqualish and Ithorian.



    When the news came that Star Wars was coming back and the sequels were upon us I was excited to be introduced to new aliens and re-familiarize myself with aliens we knew from previous films. When the first photos of Maz’s Castle were released I was blown away, until I realized there wasn't one single familiar alien in the photo aside from an old guy that resembled someone from the Mos Eisley Cantina. To me, that seemed strange. Surely there would be a Twi’lek or Rodian somewhere in this seemingly shady place on the outskirts of civilized space. Sadly, when the film came out and we saw more, I was disappointed by the lack of species we knew from the past. Aside from Admiral Ackbar, a few of his fellow Mon Calamari, and Nien Nunb, we really had nothing else.



    In The Last Jedi we got even more new alien faces at Canto Bight and as members of The Resistance, but once again no aliens from the George Lucas years. This really started to bother me, and I’ve spoken to a few people who feel the same. Aside from a few legacy alien side-characters we had no others to help ground us to the galaxy set up by Lucas, which was one populated by many different, already established species. They should pop up in the background, but we have yet to see this done in the sequels. Rogue One, while not a sequel, just barely gave us enough to wet our whistles. The argument that different regions of space would have different species is somewhat valid, but that wouldn’t limit other species from also visiting these regions of space given most of them have the luxury of hyperspace travel.



    [​IMG]



    George Lucas was quite adept at world-building. When he made the prequels he knew that he had to blend new and old to maintain the world he set up previously. Although one might argue that much of the technology in the prequels appeared fresh and sleek in comparison to the original’s more “lived in” look, that can easily be explained by the state of the galaxy in those respective eras. The aliens however were balanced perfectly and that balance is currently lacking in the new films.


    We know that the Story Group is very involved in maintaining the overall canon so one can assume that they have some input towards things of this nature in the new films. It surprises me that the production of the sequels cast aside more familiar aliens in settings such as Maz’s Castle and Canto Bight. There is concept art of Canto Bight that involve original and prequel species, so where are they in the film? Speaking of Canto Bight, I found the designs for these aliens very beige and non “Star Wars”. To me they all look like they stepped off the set of Doctor Who, which only further disconnects us from the Star Wars galaxy. 



    [​IMG] Canto Bight Concept Art

    [​IMG] Denizens of Canto Bight in The Last Jedi



    The numerous new canon stories in books, comics, and more recently the Battlefront 2 video game, feature many familiar alien species which are often main characters in these stories. In fact there are species from both the previous eras at Maz’s castle during the events of the game. There is even a portrait of my favorite space pirate Hondo Ohnaka hung up on the wall in one of the rooms. Shriv Surgaav, a Duros, has some of the best lines in Battlefront 2. His sarcasm and wit are endless. Having an alien character like this would do so much for the films. In fact they should put Shriv in Episode IX. Please do it!



    [​IMG] Shriv Surgaav - Battlefront 2 (Image by Cinematic Captures @BFCaptures on Twitter)



    In addition to bringing back some more familiar established species, instead of limiting them to the background, it'd be cool if they had small but important action and speaking roles. This is something George Lucas did that I think the new regime can learn from. Maz Kanata and Snoke are arguably the only two aliens that really have dialogue of any importance. Give more time to the aliens of The Resistance for example. Larger roles for our favorite aliens should not be reserved for non-film canon. Many actors would gladly get under the prosthetics and or animatronic creature masks to play a non-human character (Silas Carson as Nute Gunray and Ki Adi Mundi for example). The motion capture route is also always an option too. The technology has advanced greatly since Lucas made the prequels and he managed just fine with what was available then.



    With Solo: A Star Wars Story coming soon, we can only hope that we get back to the basics of Star Wars aliens and not just because of the timeline in which the film takes place. It appears we may see the Pyke Syndicate involved in that film. Even still, we need more examples of this in the sequels. These species do not only exist in the past! Without them, the films lack balance and the galaxy starts to feel out of place from what we’ve already come to know. I am not sure what Lucasfilm’s reasoning for this is but I would love to find out. The lack of discussion I have seen on this particular criticism is surprising. Maybe myself and the other passionate Star Wars alien fans are being nitpicky, but I really think it should be addressed. I hope what I have said here today inspires more of you to think and talk about this issue. Do you think that we will/should see more classic Star Wars species? What do you think Lucasfilm’s reasoning is for their under-utilization? 





    Author: Austin D. (Dark-Porkins)





    Click HERE to check out and comment on this topic on our main site
     
    #1 SWNN Probe, Jan 24, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2018
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  2. Lazarus Dei

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    Great post... I've certainly missed the alien presence in the recent films. As a kid, it was the appearance of all the aliens that made a GFFA really feel like it was far, far away... the whole Tatooine segment of ANH managed to give us the indelible image of the Jawas, the Tuskens and all those races in the Cantina and Mos Eisley (Garindan and Greedo being particular favourites for me) - but so many of them got screentime and were part of the story.

    I can't help but feel that with the recent movies, while we've been presented with a slew of new creatures and races, they're largely set dressing (think Jedha marketplace and Maz's castle) - meaning the only aliens who are part of the story for more than a fleeting glimpse have been Chewie, Ackbar and more recently Yoda.
     
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  3. Darth Malkovich

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    This is a fair criticism. Though I think Canto Bight gets a pass on the basis that it's the kind of place we aren't familiar with so it is plausible the species there would be unfamiliar too.

    Would like to see OT and PT alien species in episode IX
     
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  4. SegNerd

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    In my (possibly unpopular) opinion, this is just one example of a problem that affects almost every aspect of the ST: It just doesn’t “fit” with the other movies, and at least in my opinion, it doesn’t fit with GL’s overall vision.

    So far, I see Rogue One as the only Disney movie that “fits.” It just feels like it was made by someone who loves and understands Star Wars.
     
    #4 SegNerd, Jan 24, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2018
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  5. Lazarus Dei

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    I think some is the the key - it doesn’t need to be a carbon copy bestiary on every world, but a nod here and there - like Easter Eggs - would have fans lapping it up. I mean, just look at the concept pic with the Ree Yees in it - that would have been awesome!
     
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  6. Ammianus Marcellinus

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    I love the OP's post, however it is based on a serious misinterpretation of the depiction of aliens in George Lucas' Star Wars movies.

    Let me explain it from the perspective of the visual storyteller. You want to make the galaxy feel big. You also want to be creative. Recycling alien designs from the other movies wouldn't really make sense in that respect. A strange place needs to have aliens and people with which the audience is unfamilar: otherwise it would familiar. The use of familiar aliens was fun in Rogue but: 1. it made everything feel small and familiar 2. it was critiqued by critics for being overreliant on established aesthetics and the familiar.

    What would make sense however, is when our heroes in the sequels do visit a planet we've seen before in the previous movies, we see familiar aliens. That's what Lucas did in the originals. You also see familiar aliens when the space represented is defined by cosmopolitanism (political centres):

    Here is the familiar/ unfamiliar aliens - planet/spaces representation and distribution in Lucas' SW movies:

    1. Naboo = only new alien species
    2. Geonosis = only new alien Species - including separatist council
    3. Utapau = only new aliens Species
    4. Mustafar = only new alien species
    5. Tatooine (ANH) = only new aliens species (subsequent consistancy in IV, VI, I and II)
    6. Bespin = only new aliens species
    7. Rebel Alliance fleet (ROTJ) = only new alien species
    8. Endor = only new alien species

    If we were to take this to the sequels you'll see the same:

    1. Jakku = only new alien species
    2. Takodana = new alien species
    3. Resistance/ D'Qar = new alien species + old alien species you could find in the Rebel Alliance Fleet in ROTJ
    4. Canto Bight = new alien species

    The only exception are:

    Lucas' Star Wars
    Coruscant: introduces new species but also recycles species seen on other planets. Coruscant is a metropolis-space defined by cosmopolitanism . However, the Jedi Temple is yet another different space. In the council in episode I, apart from Windu and Yoda, we only see new species. The council is a strange place for Anakin, hence it is logical that we see unfamiliar and strange beings.

    Disney's Star Wars
    Hosnian Prime: recycles species seen on Jakku, Takodana and D'Qar. Again, Hosnian Prime is a metropolis-space defined by cosmopolitanism.

    So there's basically only one inconsistancy which holds, namely: "why don't we see any of the old alien species in the Hosnian Prime shots?".

    Displacement is characterized by the depiction of alien species. That's how aliens operate in the visual narrative.

    Cheers!
     
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  7. Dark-Porkins

    Dark-Porkins Rebel Trooper

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    I think the opposite. Its a casino city in the corporate sector where the highest rollers go to gamble and chill. Seems unrealistic that none of them would be say a greedy Neimoidian, Muun, or Hutt for instance. But im the author so im biased in the discussion haha
     
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  8. Darth Malkovich

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    I don't agree. I mean there isn't an overall look where everything fits neatly together. The look of the prequels was significantly different to the look of the OT. Where were the Neimodians or Muun in the OT? Where were the Mon Cala in the PT? Those eras looked very different and that's fine because the galaxy is a big place and some species had power in one era and didn't in another.

    Max's castle and Jakku are the main places we probably should have seen some well known species, and maybe among the slave kids on Canto.
     
  9. StoneRiver

    StoneRiver Rebel General

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    "The argument that different regions of space would have different species is somewhat valid, but that wouldn’t limit other species from also visiting these regions of space given most of them have the luxury of hyperspace travel."

    I just took this from the OP as I agree with everything said however, to further the above statement in the new Disney SW it's only alien species that are limited in their travel to other regions of space. Humans get a free pass and travel all over, while all the other space faring species stick to their own regions. So even within the films themselves they actually destroy their defense to only use new species as "different regions of space would have different species" by having humans everywhere, but nothing else.

    (I hope that makes sense, I'm rushing this post)
     
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  10. Dark-Porkins

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    Neimoidians and Muun werent in the OT because The OT came first and they hadn't been invented yet. In THAT case we can simply assume we just didnt see them. Though George did include a Dug at Jabbas palace in his last release. When George made the prequels he did include species from the OT trilogy. There are Mon Cala in the PT. The Eras only look different because A. Film Budget in 1977-1983 wasnt what it is today and the Tech Didnt Exist and B. The PT was a time of the Republic when most of the galaxy had $$$. In the OT, The Empire was an Iron Fist throughout the galaxy.
    --- Double Post Merged, Jan 25, 2018, Original Post Date: Jan 25, 2018 ---
    One of the best counter-arguments yet. Thanks for the informative response. I am now going to try and counter this counter.


    1. Naboo = only new alien species -- * It is a new planet that is predominantly human (colonized) happens to have a second sentient race on it. Visually we only see Humans and Gungans and Neimoidians because those are the focus during these scenes.
    2. Geonosis = only new alien Species - including separatist council --* Nute Gunray and Rune Hako are members of the council. There is also a 4 eyed Aqualish (Po Nudo) and Quarren (Tikkes) as for Geonosis itself, why would anyone visit this planet otherwise?
    3. Utapau = only new aliens Specie--* True but there wouldnt need to be old aliens here.
    4. Mustafar = only new alien species --* Same as above.
    5. Tatooine (ANH) = only new aliens species (subsequent consistancy in IV, VI, I and II) - * exactly the point im trying to make, but these aliens arent native to Tatooine they just happen to frequent it for whatever reason. Podraces, Crime, Business etc.
    6. Bespin = only new aliens species --* Cloud City we can assume is a mostly human city where Ugnauts just happen to work.
    7. Rebel Alliance fleet (ROTJ) = only new alien species --* True, but we only see Mon Calamari and Nien Nunb involved. As we know now in Canon there were other aliens involved in the Rebel Alliance at this time, just not seen on film due to them just not having been invented yet
    8. Endor = only new alien species --* It is a primitive world where no other aliens would frequent. Ewoks.

    If we were to take this to the sequels you'll see the same:

    1. Jakku = only new alien species --* Jakku doesnt bother me so much.
    2. Takodana = new alien species --* Why? It is basically a cantina that anyone could visit. They don;t have to be all new. It Would make more sense for visual storytelling to include something familiar among the old here.
    3. Resistance/ D'Qar = new alien species + old alien species you could find in the Rebel Alliance Fleet in ROTJ --* Ackbar ad Nien Nunb don't really count as they are considered lesser Legacy Characters. We know from Canon that familiar races are also members of the resistance, such as Shriv.
    4. Canto Bight = new alien species --* To me Canto-Bight is a place that may not be a political hub but it is definitely a place that you would expect to find a familiar race. It is in the Corporate Sector which means business and in the case of Canto-Bight, pleasure as well. Business is akin to politics in this case.

    And yes your points about Coruscant and Hosnian Prime are solid.
     
  11. Ammianus Marcellinus

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    Thanks for your reply:

    Oh poodooh, I overlooked the separatist council critters :p

    But note that I only argue from an in-movie universe explanation. I don't take the EU into account because I assume that normal audiences don't really know anything about it in the first place. I'm just following Lucas' ground rule: 'unfamiliar place = unfamiliar beings' // 'familiar place = familiar beings'. In essence aliens and monsters are there only to characterize space.

    You only see consistancy when a space has been used before or when it is defined by its cosmopolitan character. So, only Hosnian Prime stands out as a place where we've could have seen some of the older and familiar species. Looking at the Starkiller destroys Hosnian Prime again, I would depict some of the older species in that scene. It is the only space where the inclusion of old aliens would have been functional. Functional characterization of space trumps in universe-logic (which is subjective) always.

    However, from what I have picked up, I now have a feeling we're going to see some of the older species in the final act of the Star Wars story now that the Rebellion is going to be 'rebuilt'. Ever played Mass Effect 3?;)
     
  12. Dark-Porkins

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    I hope so. And I appreciate your point of view from the visual storytelling perspective, in that it sort of makes sense, but I cant buy that. I don't believe that was Lucas sole intention for those scenes. The audience has seen Star Wars before we know what to expect now. An Unfamiliar place does not need to equal unfamiliar beings and that isnt always the case but I do understand your point about characterizing space, and I do believe that is correct...from a certain point of view :p. Thanks for being so collected in your response :)
     
  13. SegNerd

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    I wasn't really talking about the look of the movies. If anything, the superficial aspects of the ST are the things that match the OT the most closely.

    What I mean by "It doesn't fit" is things like the Empire basically just popping back up after what we all thought was its final demise, or Maz finding Luke's lightsaber, or a copy of the Sith just showing up out of nowhere, or yet another giant destruct-o-sphere, or Luke going into hiding. Things that just make me want to scream "That would never happen in the Star Wars universe that I know and love!"
     
    #13 SegNerd, Jan 25, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2018
  14. singlern05

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    OP makes excellent points (especially Shriv in IX... YES PLEASE!) and I get the counter argument that each new movie and location introduces new species. But it would be nice to see familiar aliens sprinkled in more so than they have been. The lack of them doesn’t ruin the movies for me in the slightest but it just makes me feel like the story group either isn’t on their game or doesn’t care about issues like this.
     
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  15. Darth Malkovich

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    Well if you didn't have darksiders, you would have no sequel trilogy. I've no problem with Empire wannabes still existing, it happens in real life. Didn't like Starkiller so no argument here. Luke going into hiding was the most Star Wars thing that has ever happened though.
     
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