1. Due to the increased amount of spam bots on the forum, we are strengthening our defenses. You may experience a CAPTCHA challenge from time to time.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Notification emails are working properly again. Please check your email spam folder and if you see any emails from the Cantina there, make sure to mark them as "Not Spam". This will help a lot to whitelist the emails and to stop them going to spam.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. IMPORTANT! To be able to create new threads and rate posts, you need to have at least 30 posts in The Cantina.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Before posting a new thread, check the list with similar threads that will appear when you start typing the thread's title.
    Dismiss Notice

SPECULATION Halo-style Factions in Star Wars

Discussion in 'General Movie Discussion' started by cawatrooper, Oct 14, 2021.

  1. cawatrooper

    cawatrooper Dungeon Master

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2016
    Posts:
    4,318
    Likes Received:
    19,312
    Trophy Points:
    146,667
    Credits:
    17,774
    Ratings:
    +23,666 / 64 / -37
    I've been thinking about Halo and Star Wars the last few days, and one thing that I think works so well for Halo is the interplay between the factions.

    For those not familiar, Halo starts off with humanity fighting a large alien force known as The Covenant, basically a huge alliance of many other alien species with a religious fascination with the Forerunners. The humans are also aware of the Forerunners via their technology, remnants of a long lost galactic civilization. Over the course of the conflict, the Forerunners re-emerge, as do their ancient enemy the parasite known as The Flood.

    With these four factions at play, everyone has their own goals and it does get somewhat complicated over the course of the series, with alliances made and broken at the drop of a hat. But basically, at the widest possible angle, it looks like this:

    Humanity- interested in using Forerunner technology to defeat the Covenant. Preyed upon by the Flood. Can work with the Forerunners, though their goals do not entirely align.

    The Covenant- At war with humanity. Has a religious fascination with the Forerunners, in a way that supersedes their own wellbeing. Preyed upon by the Flood. Contains many splinter factions and rebellions.

    The Forerunners- an almost entirely unified alliance of robotic remnants of a once prosperous civilization. They fulfill their goals, though it's questionable whether or not their programming is in line with their creators' intent.

    The Flood- Wants to devour everything- but, they're opposed to the arguably more dangerous Forerunners, and may be willing to make temporary alliances.



    I wouldn't say each of these factions get quite equal screen-time depending on the game, but I just love the interplay between factions. I feel like, largely, Star Wars misses this. Generally, the conflict in a Star Wars movie is between two factions- and if there are multiple factions (like the Rebels and Partisans in Rogue One) they at least tend to find alliances pretty quickly.


    Imagine a multi-sided battle. The Rebels fighting the Empire, when a Hutt strike team hacks into one of the Interdictors, locking both sides out of hyperspace while syndicate frigate pick off any ships on the perimeter. Or maybe a unified planetary force joins in, opposed to the Rebellion's principles but also wanting liberty from the Empire.

    There are a lot of really interesting ways to mix and match these fights that don't just boil down to a brawl between two fleets, and I really hope Star Wars starts doing this more.

    One thing that comes to mind from Legends was the fight at Xizor's palace in Shadows of the Empire. Even that was just a small Rebel force, but it stands out as pretty unique for Star Wars.

    I know the Hutts and Black Sun are sort of third factions, though they're often not particularly to independent from the other groups at play (Depending on the story). And I know we have Space Vikings and maybe plant people in High Republi (I've only read Into the Dark so far). Any other factions to throw into the mix that could work, or ideas for a new faction? How would the interplay work between these groups?
     
    • Great Post Great Post x 5
  2. Lock_S_Foils

    Lock_S_Foils Red Leader

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2017
    Posts:
    3,087
    Likes Received:
    71,476
    Trophy Points:
    175,157
    Credits:
    51,792
    Ratings:
    +75,997 / 48 / -43
    @cawatrooper Outstanding post. I get what you are saying here, and it brings to mind another Universe I have been spending a lot of time in recently. Mainly the grimdark of Warhammer 40K.....and the prob 40-50 different key "factions" or species or organizations that exist in that Universe. Warhammer is basically Earth going forward 40,000 years, and it is very brutal. Hard to distinguish the "good guys" from the "bad guys" but that is what attracts a lot of people to the lore.

    As far as Star Wars, have you thought about how one could "blur the line" between good and bad like Warhammer? Or is that a key feature of Star Wars that should not be messed with?
     
    • Cool Cool x 2
    • Original Original x 1
  3. cawatrooper

    cawatrooper Dungeon Master

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2016
    Posts:
    4,318
    Likes Received:
    19,312
    Trophy Points:
    146,667
    Credits:
    17,774
    Ratings:
    +23,666 / 64 / -37
    Very true! I don't know a ton about Warhammer, but it sounds like a fascinating and complex universe.

    I think Umbara and Rogue One show one way that Star Wars can blur the line between good and evil- soldiers being given orders that are ultimately negative, and having to grapple with following them and preserving their duty or disobeying them and saving their honor.

    A Star Wars trilogy where the "good guys" are led by a flawed or misguided leader could be an interesting start. I know we sort of had that in the prequels, but that was more of a deliberate deception- I'm thinking someone more like General Draven, but in a bigger position of power.

    As for making "bad guys" good... one of the biggest missed opportunities of the sequel trilogy is how in ROTS, the crawl mentions "there are heroes on both sides", then proceeds to paint the separatists as moustache-twirling villains that are mostly just robots. I would love to see a Star Wars movie where we get things from a villains' perspective, and it's arguable they're right. As long as enemies are like the Empire or First Order (fascists, that is) we shouldn't have that... because we don't need to sympathize with fascists. But with the Seperatists I think there was more flexibility in how they were seen. So, I think the clear cut good vs evil thing is actually antithetical to much of Star Wars' worldbuilding, but an alternative should only be applied when appropriate. Making the Empire relatable (like in the Squadrons trailers) just feels gross.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Wise Wise x 1
  4. Lock_S_Foils

    Lock_S_Foils Red Leader

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2017
    Posts:
    3,087
    Likes Received:
    71,476
    Trophy Points:
    175,157
    Credits:
    51,792
    Ratings:
    +75,997 / 48 / -43
    @cawatrooper I've gotta go out for a bit, will be back tonight to discuss this more.....here is a list of SW Factions (canon-Disney)

    Capture-SW factions.JPG
     
    • Great Post Great Post x 2
    • Cool Cool x 1
  5. cawatrooper

    cawatrooper Dungeon Master

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2016
    Posts:
    4,318
    Likes Received:
    19,312
    Trophy Points:
    146,667
    Credits:
    17,774
    Ratings:
    +23,666 / 64 / -37

    Thanks, Lock!

    Yeah, there are definitely multiple factions (though I'd argue that we're talking multiple eras of SW with many of these locked to one or two specific eras).

    I guess what I'm looking for is a movie where we have multiple factions at play. So, not just the bounty hunter's guild working alongside the Empire to capture Rebel targets, and not Tusken Raiders randomly encountering our hero on their territory, but a big multi-faction cluster bomb of a mess.

    Looking forward to hear your thoughts on this more later!
     
    • Great Post Great Post x 2
    • Hopeful Hopeful x 1
  6. Use the Falchion

    Use the Falchion Jedi Contrarian

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2015
    Posts:
    2,104
    Likes Received:
    8,776
    Trophy Points:
    87,867
    Credits:
    9,859
    Ratings:
    +10,143 / 25 / -10
    "But no I don't want politics in my Star Wars again!"
    -Someone, some time, but definitely NOT me.

    @cawatrooper I definitely agree with the factions! It'd be a great way to add nuance and creativity to a pretty dichotomized world. And honestly, in the Post-TFA but and Pre-TLJ timeframe, I thought that was where the story was going:
    We had Rey and Luke reviving the Jedi (again), and Ahsoka representing Light Side justice without the Jedi restrictions.
    We had the Inquisitors, who couldn't be the Sith, and the Knights of Ren, who were also something different.
    ...and then TLJ and TROS doubled down on the dichotomy of things...

    All of that said, I still think it's possible to achieve that faction era, and the Mandalorian may indeed be building towards something like that. (I just think it would be more interesting for different Force Groups based around specific schools of thought or ideologies.*) But I guess tracking all of that information, especially the behind-the-scenes politicking and whatnot would make it a little difficult...for those not up to the challenge!

    *My idea of a Future Trilogy is called the Force Wars, in which Jedi and other force groups would battle throughout the galaxy, not unlike the Sengoku Era/Warring States Period in Japan. There are a lot of cool fictional movies set during this time as well, so drawing examples from them would kind of retie the Japanese samurai themes back into the franchise.
     
    • Cool Cool x 2
    • Original Original x 1
  7. Lock_S_Foils

    Lock_S_Foils Red Leader

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2017
    Posts:
    3,087
    Likes Received:
    71,476
    Trophy Points:
    175,157
    Credits:
    51,792
    Ratings:
    +75,997 / 48 / -43
    So @cawatrooper , I would be down for some "multiple faction action" in future SW projects. If you remember the original Battlestar Galactica in 1978 got really interesting IMO at the end of the series, when they introduced the "Eastern Alliance" and the "Western Nationalists", two new factions.

    But you are right about the multiple eras....not sure how to get around this in SW other than maybe taking the next trilogy into an entirely new direction i.e. the future, with new factions, new alliances, new enemies, etc.

    I do think that one thing that the Star Trek universe has gotten right is the use of multiple factions, and multiple ways the factions interact, ally, and turn on each other......
     
    • Great Post Great Post x 2
  8. Embo and His Pet Anooba

    Embo and His Pet Anooba Force Attuned

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2020
    Posts:
    1,008
    Likes Received:
    8,935
    Trophy Points:
    16,117
    Credits:
    8,583
    Ratings:
    +9,829 / 7 / -5
    all the gangs really, like when maul was recruting pykes, hutts and black sun
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Cool Cool x 1
  9. cawatrooper

    cawatrooper Dungeon Master

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2016
    Posts:
    4,318
    Likes Received:
    19,312
    Trophy Points:
    146,667
    Credits:
    17,774
    Ratings:
    +23,666 / 64 / -37
    I like how gangsters have (in the films) served as the seedy underbelly of the universe. Really, I think a lot of the worldbuilding in Star Wars is thanks to depictions of the criminals and mercenaries, rather than the Empire, Rebels, or civilians.

    That said, I'd love for a film to show one of these criminal empires going toe to toe with the powers of the galaxy. Give us Black Sun at the height of its power, using its own technological terrors against the Empire. Imagine the interesting moral conundrums the heroes of a movie could have, when gangsters are using Death Star tech against Imperial targets. Do they stop them? Do they stay out of the conflict? Do they... do they help?
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Great Post Great Post x 1
  10. The dinh

    The dinh Rebelscum

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2019
    Posts:
    170
    Likes Received:
    339
    Trophy Points:
    1,577
    Credits:
    973
    Ratings:
    +501 / 0 / -0
    (gamorrean)Gakfedd tribe vs Klagg tribe(gamorrean).
     
Loading...

Share This Page