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Has Rian 'forced' the destiny's of Rey and Kylo

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker' started by Darth Chewie, Mar 10, 2018.

  1. Trev

    Trev Rebel Official

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    I like this mentality. I don’t like to think of it as a superpower because I think there’s a lot more depth to it than that. In some ways, I think the new canon is expanding on that idea a lot, which I really like, especially because casual Star Wars fans pretty much do see it as nothing more than some mystical power.
     
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  2. Finn_McCool

    Finn_McCool Jedi Commander

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    If they kill eachother that won't solve the problem, cuz broomboy or some other person will be right there to take their place.
    My understanding of the force is a lot like Zen Buddhism practiced by the Samurai. Interestingly enough the buddha was "awakened", through a process called Zazen, a form of meditation, which explains Rey's sudden awakening to the force. She didn't learn from a Jedi how to use her powers they came naturally. Which is ideal, because it is neither light or dark.
    The real solution would be to be balanced within themselves. Like eastern medicine. They use hot and cold herbs to balance themselves and become well. Basically they become grey. Rey has a dark side and Kylo has a light side. They can embrace that within themselves and keep a balance.
     
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  3. Mosley909

    Mosley909 Rebel Official

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    Its a really interesting theory this, kind of go the Akira route that they are both to strong to exist in the in the world/galaxy, this would certainly be a different an interesting route to take, if done correctly.

    Their are still the issues that both were weaker the Snoke so making them out to be that powerful that they can't be allowed to exist in the galaxy doesn't quite make sense, but if they could find away to make that makes sense i'd be on board with this idea.
     
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  4. master_shaitan

    master_shaitan Jedi General

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    I think this is one of the most exciting things about IX: what will happen between Rey and Ren. Personally, I feel that they will both die in a joint show of Force to save the galaxy. Or at the very least, Ren will give up his life to save Rey and the galaxy. Does the "powerful light vs powerful dark" mean that Rey's existence will essentially bring about another powerful dark side warrior? Possibly. And @FN-3263827 does make an interesting suggestion with the idea of a "cold war" between Rey's light and Ren's dark side.

    However, I'm not so sure it has to work that way.

    What I mean by that is that "powerful dark" resulting in powerful light might not work the other way round. I say that because the Dark Side in its nature is domineering and desires power. Therefore, this could be why the Force reacts to create someone (Anakin/Rey) to fight against it and restore balance. I don't think there being a powerful light sider means that the opposite has to occur. Why? Because this powerful light sider doesn't have to exert her power (like the PT Jedi did). It could even be that Rey does a Luke and withdraws from the galaxy when it is at peace (but is there to return should evil rise again).

    My view on Snoke's "darkness rises and light to meet it", in conjunction with Luke's "powerful light, powerful dark" is that they're related but don't mean the exact same things. The Force desires balance. That is its will and it is essentially the will of the collective consciousness of the galaxy. The light, when truly adhered to and governed by, as a true Jedi should be, seeks to maintain this balance of light & dark (unlike the PT Jedi that feared the Dark Side and tried to annihilate it). Therefore, the existence of a powerful being who follows the light, shouldn't mean that a powerful bad person will rise.

    What I believe Luke is talking about there, is what is natural. He isn't talking about the conflict of good vs evil or what an individual choses to do and the consequences of that. Snoke on the other hand is talking very much of that. He has warned Ren that his growing dark side power (choices) will create a reaction by the Force itself. So again, Luke is speaking about nature and balance whilst Snoke talks about unnatural behaviour and conflict. It was the same with Anakin's likely creation. The Force struck back against either Sidious & Plagueis' meddling with midichlorians or reacted to the growing imbalance.

    So for me, a true Jedi can stop this cycle of conflict from continuing, regardless of their own power. It is only those who serve the Dark Side (willingly or otherwise) that cause the Force to "strike back" in some way. So Rey can live and the conflict can end at the same time.

    Perhaps a more interesting question though is: how did the Force know Rey was going to be good? I mean, if we believe in free will, making Rey powerful didn't necessarily mean she would be good and fight the evil one. So does that mean that Rey was destined to be good or that she was "imbued" with the Force when she made good choices and these choices and her "belief" lead her to being Ren's equal? So in a sense she wasn’t born powerful but the light chose her?
     
    #24 master_shaitan, Mar 22, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2018
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  5. FN-3263827

    FN-3263827 First Order CPS
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    @master_shaitan : i'm not opposed to cold (or warm--or even hot) peace either ~ hahahaha
     
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  6. ScumAndVillainy

    ScumAndVillainy Rebelscum

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    The title of this thread really threw me. I was like.. wow... is Reylo and 'the Force' going allude to something particularly nasty? Just how effective IS 'Force' projection anyways? Sex across light-years?

    Sorry.. my brain is in the dump today. Might make an interesting porn parody though.
     
  7. KyloRen1981

    KyloRen1981 Rebel Commander

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    I hope JJ retcons that whole "as one rises, so does the other" thing. Cuz, if that's true, then there's no point to ANY of this and Force-users should probably be killed immediately because it can only lead to war and death. =P
     
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  8. Darth Basin The Greatest

    Darth Basin The Greatest Rebel Official

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    Witch i think would make an interesting trilogy 1 day. Sum group comes 2 power, blames all the GFFA's problems on the Force & starts a genocide agaist all Force sensitives. Light, dark & grey.
     
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  9. Pomojema

    Pomojema Ayatollah Of Rock-&-Rolla
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    Background lore suggests that this is a big reason why Luke didn't want to return following his self-imposed exile - in his studies, he noticed that there was a cyclical nature to the Force that the Jedi, the Sith, and the others all contributed to, and he felt that after raising a Dark Side user that destroyed everything he had built, trying to fix the situation himself would just create more problems for his friends.

    Shame they didn't make more explicit note of this idea during the second lesson. I feel like it would have lessened the backlash to the way that Luke's story developed.
     
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  10. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    I agree it could have lessened it but at the same time...I am so sick of people needing their hand held through movies.
    Even Star Wars
     
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  11. KyloRen1981

    KyloRen1981 Rebel Commander

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    Except that Luke's actions betray that notion. If Luke felt that way, why would he help at the end and say Rey would continue the Jedi?
     
  12. cassidy

    cassidy Rebel Official

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    Everyone's theories in this thread are amazing! loved reading through them. But I suggest that everyone simplify their expectations. We'll most likely get a very watered down finale to this trilogy.

    The resistance will probably regroup and destroy The First Order but Rey and Kylo will remain alive and go separate ways. This trilogy is very simple.
     
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  13. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    Because he realized he's wrong.
    He realized it isn't about him. He can end the Jedi but that wouldn't stop Kylo. That won't stop Snoke. That won't stop the next in that line.

    The guilt that haunted him and drove him there was just that...HIS GUILT. The universe needs heroes and there will always be villains.
     
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  14. KyloRen1981

    KyloRen1981 Rebel Commander

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    mmm, I disagree. If the whole light rises to meet dark thing is true, then the way to bring peace would be to let the Jedi end. Kylo and Snoke would live for a few more decades (or minutes in Snoke's case) and then die and there would be peace (since there would be no light left, no new dark could rise to meet it). Reigniting the Jedi only ensures at least another full generation of bloodshed with no end in sight.

    This is why that premise doesn't work. If the premise is that good can never win, and evil can never win, then it makes the conflict nothing but pointless violence. In which case, Luke is right, it just needs to end.

    I would love to be wrong about this so, please feel free to point out anything I might be missing. Until then, I hope JJ retcons this as nothing more than Snoke's mindless rambling and Luke's further failure to understand the Jedi. (man, that hurts to type that last phrase).
     
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  15. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    But this implies the force would die off. The force wouldn't die off. It is endless. It exists outside of sentient life.
    Luke cut himself off from the force yet Rey still existed when the Jedi were for all intents and purpose GONE, proves that he was wrong.

    If Luke ended the Jedi, the force would just find it's way into another junker, moisture farmer or Princess.

    That's the whole point of the Yoda scene. Luke is just mad and angry he failed because he was the great Luke Skywalker with that mighty Skywalker blood.
    Yoda tells him that they will grow beyond us.

    The idea that ending the Jedi ends this war is simply disproved by the sheer existence of Rey.
     
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  16. KyloRen1981

    KyloRen1981 Rebel Commander

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    oohhhhh, OK. I get it now. That all makes sense now. That even makes it OK to fight forever because it's not like there is an alternative now. And actually, it is true to life that there will always be good and bad and not really much we can do about it. I think I am almost entirely OK with this premise now. I guess the one thing left is, then what were the previous two trilogies talking about in terms of "balance"? If the force always balances itself, what's to worry about?

    ... I'm a bit tired now so maybe the answer is before me and I just can't quite see it. I should reach out. *raises arm*
     
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  17. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    The force isn't omnipotent. Don't stoop to this.
     
  18. KyloRen1981

    KyloRen1981 Rebel Commander

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    Wait, wha?
     
  19. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    You're trying to imply that the force is omnipotent.
    Stooping to this, which we know isn't true it's explicitly stated in films, is a sign of just troll baiting.
     
  20. KyloRen1981

    KyloRen1981 Rebel Commander

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    I wasn't trying to do anything other than have a conversation with you. I thought it was going really well until just then. I honestly don't even know what you're upset over right now.
     
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