OFFICIAL NEWS Hungarian magazine releases new photo of Luke in TLJ

To me, Han seemed nostalgic when talking about Luke. As if he was missing the man that Luke once was, before he decided to go into hiding. And when he talks about Luke feeling responsible for what happened, he sounds (to me at least) like he disagrees. The way I see it, Han avoids all responsibility and tries to convince himself that Kylo Ren was a bad seed right from the start. He turns it all around near the end, but by then the damage is done.

 

Yeah I think that was a good sign we were not going to see a Luke we could associate with from the OT. That Luke would not have hid away. That's why this current marketing for him is not surprising me. I doubt Luke will become dark, or Vader, but he's not exactly purely light anymore either.

 

That certainly is possible but we don't have anything more than tid bits to rely on. I have met many parents who bend over backwards for their kids trying to keep them from bad choices. Not sure absent the details if Luke is the one to blame.

 

I didn't notice that when I watched the movie, but you're right. Right there it's obvious that Luke has changed a lot. I didn't think of that at all, and when information about Luke in ep 8 started to emerge i was somewhat disappointed because ROTJ had such a beautiful ending. Luke throwing away the lightsaber, proving that he's 100% committed to the light side and the Jedi order was, to me, the most powerful moment in the OT. And the fact that part of his commitment came from knowing that his father was once a Jedi too made it even better. Not only did he prove that he's a true Jedi, but he proved that he had faith in his father even after being tormented by him. It doesn't get better than that. That scene is so great that it almost makes you forget that the Jedi philosophy is severely flawed. And that's just the problem. Luke was the perfect Jedi, but the Jedi are not exactly great. Sure, when the only other option is the Sith, they seem like the ultimate heroes, but the Jedi rules backfired so badly that the order got wiped off twice, both times by young Jedi. That's the ultimate irony right there. Luke seemed awesome, but he was like the best surgeon in a time when there was no anesthetic or antibiotics. He got the job done and everyone applauded (and he did deserve applause), but the patient died in the end. This is probably something that Luke understood as time passed by, and now he's seriously evaluating everything he knows about the force. I like it, and I hope this trilogy will explore the force in ways we haven't seen before. Who knows, maybe Luke will be the first to achieve true balance and eventually guide both Rey and Kylo Ren.

 

People change.
I draw a parallel with real life. Young people often are 100% sure they will end up their life with the same opinion, political allegiance and tastes they have being young.
In 30 years, Luke has evolved. HOW? We will find out next December.

 

Again all true. I think J.J had a vague idea of Luke's backstory, but Rian took it to another level. A level that had Mark completely against it, until he saw it made sense. Now I am really curious to what Rian did, and why the guy at Disney said this is Mark's best performance ever.

 

You're right, people can turn bad even with the best guidance. Those are true bad seeds. But in this case, we know for a fact that Han, Leia and Luke made very serious mistakes. I'm not saying that Kylo Ren is not responsible for his own choices, of course he is, but let's be honest, his entire family contributed to him becoming what he is.
Unless you're saying that Kylo Ren would have turned out bad regardless of his upbringing? Assuming that's the case, the behavior of his family is still inexcusable. It was their DUTY to do their best, and they didn't. Parents of mass murderers don't get to say "Well, even we did our best he still would have turned out like this because he's a sociopath, so don't blame us". And neither do Han, Leia or Luke. And as far as we know, Ben Solo was once a "band of light". Does that sound like a bad seed?

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 3, 2017, Original Post Date: Sep 3, 2017 ---

I hope Luke does something that seems completely out of character until a higher purpose is revealed. Something shocking that makes him look like a villain but turns out to be the best, wisest choice in the end.

 

Yep! That's what I want to see happen too. I think it would make for a perfect twist!

 

Trying to understand things here. What facts? Han doesn't seem to blame Luke. Leia is silent about it in TFA about the cause. In Bloodline Ben is training with Luke. Now Leia worries that news will negatively effect Ben. So you could make a case that everyone hiding that Vader is his grand father negatively effected him. Other than that we hear Kylo suggest Han was a disappointment. That's not something you can hold against Luke.

I honestly don't dislike your idea. I am trying to understand it is fact.

 

No, I blame Luke. And Han and Leia too, but I blame Luke most because he was supposed to be the wise one. Leia puts the blame on Snoke (although she admits that she shouldn't have sent Ben Solo away...to Luke), and Han puts all the blame on his son, but all 3 of them made bad choices. Choices that don't need to be spelled out by the characters themselves.

Yes, finding out that they've been lied to by their entire family (from strangers), and on a topic that is very sensitive in more than one way, would affect a person negatively. There is no debate there.

I don't. I blame all 3 of them, and for different things of course.

The fact is Han, Leia and Luke made great mistakes that contributed to Ben Solo's downfall. He wasn't born "evil", therefore his environment shaped him (in part) into who he is now. Here are the mistakes:

1. Leia realizes that her kid is strong with the force AND surrounded by the dark side, while in the womb. This is where it should have dawned on her that he'll need protection, in other words that he'll need training as early as possible. She does nothing because she's focused on politics. Ben Solo goes without training until it's too late.

2. Luke realizes that Ben Solo is strong with the force at the same time as Leia. This is when he should have decided that he'll train that kid and watch over him since birth. Not only was he unusually gifted, but he was his nephew. If his sister wasn't wise enough to realize just how serious the situation was, he should have set her straight. But he didn't, and chose to focus on rebuilding the Jedi order instead.

3. Han didn't know what to do with Ben Solo, and not only because he was force sensitive. He didn't know what to do with a kid, period. He really didn't think the decision of bringing a life into the world through. Neither did Leia, obviously, but Han was worse. Leia lost track of him while she was pregnant, that's how helpful he was as a husband and father.

4. Luke got Ben Solo and came to the conclusion that he was the chosen one. That must have been a horrible day for Luke. Realizing that he spent years finding random kids instead of training "the one" must have been quite a revelation. But this was just another mistake, which put even more pressure on his nephew.

5. Han, Luke and Leia hid the dark history of the family from Ben Solo. Even Luke did it, despite the fact that he believed that Ben Solo was the chosen one. All of them showed mistrust is his ability to "walk the right path", and naturally, it backfired.

6. Han, Leia and Luke didn't reach out to Kylo Ren after he joined the First Order. Leia only suggested it to Han because he was on his way to Starkiller anyway. And to make matters worse, Han was actually reluctant. And it's safe to assume that Luke didn't even consider the possibility.

7. Han utters the words "We've lost out son". Even though their son is alive, only 29 years old, and manipulated by an incarnation of evil. Father of the year strikes again! Lucky him, Kylo Ren wasn't there to witness the sheer stupidity of that moment (so he wasn't affected), but it's pretty telling about Han's relationship with his son throughout the years.

I'd say these things had a great effect on Ben Solo.

 

Luke has a red Kyber crystal around his neck, i wouldn't be surprised now if he wields a red lightsaber in TLJ...

 

It could be Vader's, or maybe Kylo's cracked one? Or maybe he kept Vader's saber?