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SPECULATION Hypothesis of Luke in TFA and what "Awakens" could mean

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens' started by Muyeika Samuravi, Sep 4, 2015.

?

What is Luke's affiliation in TFA?

Poll closed Sep 18, 2015.
  1. Good like in ROTJ

    42.4%
  2. Bad, like a Sith

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Good but with a heavy dose of Dark

    3.0%
  4. He is beyond taking sides and is simply the "hand" of the Force

    51.5%
  5. Other

    9.1%
  6. Seriously, Jon Snow…… don't make me say it again!

    6.1%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Muyeika Samuravi

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    a big what if.....

    From what we know thus far, Luke is living on a remote island, presumably alone. The following hypothesis is based on the assumption that Luke is not guarding anything on the island(like a super weapon or Sith tomb).


    One question we could ask is, "Why is he there?".

    Preamble....

    I mentioned in a different thread that I always wanted to see a force user "walk the line" so to say. One who explored all avenues of the force without committing to either of these Religions, citing that both have their limitations. It is also my belief that the Dark side is not inherently evil but is easily abused by those seeking power. Furthermore, it is the individual who is easily corrupted by the very power that wielding the Force gives him/her. The Force isn't a moral compass from a humanoid perspective, it's just there, to be accessed and even manipulated. It's what you do with it that results in potential calamity or serenity.

    To begin, lets touch on the "Awakening" of the Force. This has much to do with this hypothesis. We know that the force is a living thing, in the sense that it has some form of consciousness. To keep things simple, lets not try and say what that exactly is. Rather, lets consider it's primary users that we know of, the Sith and the Jedi. These are both Religions and both of them adhere to strict dogma. Both were created around the Force by humanoid species interpreting as they saw fit. Perhaps the awakening is the result of the lineage of the chosen one attempting to or straight-up bringing both sides into balance, alone, by being the conduit to bridge both sides.

    Delving into the more philosophical angle, the Dark and Light sides of the Force are also akin to Yang and Yin, Destructive and Constructive, Receptive and Creative etc. My point is that the Dark side is a natural part of the whole so it has to co-exist for there to be balance in the Universe. In what role exactly? Perhaps in another thread altogether.

    In Nature, destructive forces often pave way for new creation. Forest fires, floods, volcanoes and even meteors reek havoc only to leave behind fertile potential for other life to come back and flourish. Nature renews itself again and again. This even happens in space. Stars going supernova, spreading their particles (building blocks for future solar systems) into the further reaches, particles coalescing, becoming planets and stars again and the cycle continues.

    So, on with Luke. It could be that he might have eventually chosen a path of spiritual enlightenment over that of a warrior representing a broken political machine (the republic) that does not necessarily align with his views on the Universe. His ultimate choice of non-action against the Emperor is a clue supporting the idea that he sees a much bigger picture than those before him. He is the last of his kind and he surely knows that the Jedi Order was flawed. At least in the traditional sense, we don't even know how much of a Jedi he is anymore. He may be far more evolved from having Deity versions of Yoda, Obi-Wan and Anakin guiding him. So if he is indeed "absent" or hidden, it could be because he has chosen the life of a monk. So what do monks do? Pray, meditate, strengthen their faith and connection with divinity. So in Luke's case, he could be exploring the way in which one must bridge the dark and light within themself to be one. So upon achieving this or perhaps nearing it, the Force literally wakes up, as if it was waiting for someone to figure this out all along.

    Some rumours have suggested that Luke is now very powerful but not of sound mind. This could be a half-truth. By choosing the solitary life of a monk, Luke commits to becoming one with the Force in it's entirety. In this way, he likely evolves past the emotional, mental, and psychological states of ordinary humanoids. A real world example of this could be the learned behaviour non-attachment. One is able to separate themself from seemingly everything. This, I argue, is how one could navigate the Dark side of the Force.

    Comparing to another work of fiction will also help. We could liken Luke's state of consciousness*(edited for clarity) to that of Dr Manhattan from the Watchmen comic/film. Upon his creation, Dr Manhattan's human side slowly takes a back seat until ultimately, he is so far removed from an ordinary state of perception that he has to remove himself completely from everyone. He is super-conscious and not looking through a lens of good and evil. I feel that Luke could have this disposition and that it could lead to some characters thinking he is crazy, mad, disturbed etc. But in reality, he is just detached and looking at the big picture of the Universe, literally through the eyes of the Force.

    This would make Luke far more unpredictable as a character and would change the fundamentals of what it is to use the Force.

    Speaking of attachment, I am not attached to this hypothesis. Just a fanboy like the rest of you and would like to start a discussion based on the above. Ideally, someone can run with it and develop it more. I came up with the idea while considering the Clone Wars episode about the "Ones" on the planet Mortis. Remember, Anakin settled the dust in that episode with his Force prowess. And again there is this, "Who is Luke Skywalker? What his Father could have been." I will leave you with this quote from that episode....

    "My children and I can manipulate the Force like no other. Therefore, it was necessary to withdraw from the temporal world and live here as anchorites."
    "As a sanctuary?"
    "And a prison. You cannot imagine what pain it is to have such love for your children… and realize that they could tear the very fabric of our universe."
    ―The Father and Anakin Skywalker

    xo
     
    #1 Muyeika Samuravi, Sep 4, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2015
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  2. Muyeika Samuravi

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    Really? Nothing? Nada? No one?
     
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  3. duckface

    duckface Rebel Official

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    I like this idea a lot... JJ did say this film would answer the question of "Who is Luke Skywalker?" And considering the fact that the Jedi Order was blind and corrupt, it's unlikely he would have gone down the path of restoring it (as in the EU).
     
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  4. Muyeika Samuravi

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    As an add-on, there was a rumour that the climax could revolve around Luke saving the day but in an unsettling manner. Could he be beginning to "tear the very fabric of (the) Universe" only to be stopped by something before going too far? Perhaps his connection to Leia or the kids, reeling him back to a perspective rooted in love? Family winning the day?
     
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  5. rebelscum

    rebelscum Rebel Official

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    It's a great post...but what about Plagueis?
    Kinda hoping Luke meets grandpa.
    Otherwise, really liked this speculation.
     
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  6. LTO

    LTO Rebelscum

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    As far as a film device, I'm leaning towards the force 'awakening' as meaning the force is going through a powerful age. Meaning force users are now stronger as a result.

    As far as story goes, possibly the force is reacting to being abused or misused or simply a lack of force sensitive beings. Maybe Luke and Snoke can affect the force as much as it affects them.

    For the force to awaken it would have to have been dormant or near dormant(relatively). Was it near dormant between Episode VI and VII? Or was it near dormant since long before the trilogies? What does an 'awakened' state for the force mean for the galaxy? What possibilities exist?
     
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  7. Wayne

    Wayne Rebel Official

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    Really good post, @Muyeika Samuravi -- I agree 100%, would like to see Luke's story take this direction and even posited similar ideas myself on these boards. However: when I put SW in a real-world context I begin to question if this could happen under Disney's tenure of the franchise.

    For many viewers, the status of "Jedi" is THE aspirational focus of the film. This is largely down to Luke's journey through the OT and, admittedly, may not be as strong for younger fans who came to the saga via the PT; but let's stay with the idea that being a successful Jedi is the aspirational focus of SW for many for now.

    Disney has recently made a huge success of bought franchises; Pixar, Marvel and The Muppets being the most notable. Marvel's aspirational focus is clear: superheroes! And Pixar gave Disney it's most lucrative property with 'Cars'. Now we could argue that Disney is taking their superhero franchise into unknown territories with Civil War (there will be fall outs and many will die, I guess), but will they alter the essence of the superhero? I doubt it. I certainly doubt there will ever be a Cars movie where the central character pulls the key and decides sitting idle is better for the environment. Heroes fly and clobber, cars race and race.

    So how would audiences feel about Jedi stopping doing what they do, which is (let's face it) controlling weak people's minds, moving stuff from a distance and FIGHTING WITH A LIGHT SABER. I don't think that would go over well, especially if the alternative is that Jedi now sit in caves and contemplate bigger pictures we mere mortals can't see ourselves.

    The other issue with Luke being some kind of uber accomplished, transcendental Jedi is that it creates a destination for the new generation of Force Users/Jedi, namely (we suspect) Rey and Finn. Knowing that these two will one day become Luke creates the same inevitability that the PT suffered with us already knowing Anakin would become Vader. Luke following the teaching of Obi-Wan and Yoda in the OT was fine, because we knew (and they admitted) that they had failed: their work was incomplete and they NEEDED Luke to help sort that. But if Luke is ascended, or whatever you want to call it, he NEEDS no one. He is just a beacon of perfection and that makes every other Jedi's destiny a little..predestined.

    And I know, the fun is watching the journey unfold -- but I don't want a perfect Luke. I want there to be a time in the ST when someone (my hope is Rey) questions Luke, calls him out, sets their own path to Jedihood.

    You know, I began this post pretty certain I knew what I thought; but even as I typed all this I began to see flaws. But I stay with the idea that Luke needs to be flawed himself; if he's the embodiment of what a Jedi should be, then the journey is over. So if Luke has withdrawn into some meditative seclusion to ponder the universe, I can only hope that that turns out to have been a big mistake.

    MTFBWY.... >_<
     
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  8. AmeddaBoomBoom

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    Luke will become more attuned with the cosmic force, but he won't become a god with the living force. As in, he'll perceive life in the galaxy as Dr. Manhattan would, but he won't have the same kind of power as that character did.

    Luke will still need a ship to travel between planets. He won't be shifting through time or parallel realities, Could he kill someone instantly with thought? Maybe. But not the way Dr. Manhattan did -- maybe more like Paul Atreides. I don't think he'll be able to immaculately conceive life. But it wouldn't surprise me if he healed someone on the verge of death, or maybe even someone who'd recently died.

    Luke's real power will be akin to Taoism. He'll remove himself from the ethics of governance (which Leia will be taking care of) and instead become a keeper of the balanced force -- only interjecting himself into the fray when the balance is threatened. He'll train others to succeed him, and rebuild the Jedi order as they were meant to be: before the megalomania.
     
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  9. Muyeika Samuravi

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    Yes, I concur. I wasn't thinking his power was comparable to Dr. Manhattan but rather his perspective of consciousness and how it evolves. Moreover, what it is to have a solitary perspective such as that of Dr. Manhattan's simply because of being powerful enough to see it. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
     
  10. Muyeika Samuravi

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    Good points. I am hoping it has been dormant for ages and that yes, we have seen nothing in terms of what Force users are actually capable of. This could lead to massive instability in the Galaxy for it's inahbitants. It could also tie into a creation through destruction sort of renewal/cleansing of the Galaxy by the Force acting through those who feel it the most. I like the idea of the Force having as much control over it's users as it's users have over it. That could be really fun.
    --- Double Post Merged, Sep 5, 2015, Original Post Date: Sep 5, 2015 ---
    You are totally right about Disney. I never considered Disney at all in this scenario. That's a big part of it for sure. I think it would be kind of cool if the Jedi and Sith both became legends leading to new paths for Force users altogether. The thing is, there would be all kinds of hardship along the way in building new foundations and guidelines for those who refuse the path of Jedi and Sith. And who says it has to be a Religion anyway? Perhaps following a spiritual path but not glued to a strict belief system created by someone else works in favour of an "awakened" Force. But yes, there is a precious money maker at hand here. Discarding the Jedi and Sith would likely cause outrage too but I like the idea of the spiritual side of the Force taking a whole new direction.

    As far as Luke goes, I see what you mean about the path of the Jedi leading to an inevitable predestination and thus stopping the story arc of Force users dead in it's tracks. However, perhaps that is only his role, fulfilling his lineage. I am sure there are a host of ways it could be explored. I dunno, I don't write movies, I just sound design them to make them better. :)
     
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  11. Miklos Cavvad

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    Hello all, the topic of Luke skywalker is appealing largely because Luke is my favorite character in the Star Wars saga thus far. It is my belief that Luke has become so powerful that he secludes himself to keep from becoming another Vader or Sidious, I do not however think of him as a God; but a necessary teacher for a new generation of force users. Wether the become Jedi or simply follow the Grand Master's teachings. I do hope they give Luke the tenents he deserves and not turn him into a monster with the ability to use the force that he is most capable of becoming.
     
  12. fizzgig

    fizzgig Rebelscum

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    To be honest, the thought of Luke being a protector of the Force and a guardian of the balance of Light/Dark sounds very much like the underlying plot of LOST. I know I may get slammed and called a troll, but still.
    Hurley and Ben became the guardians of the island and the "Force" it capped. They were both unselfish beings. One was naturally that way (Hurley) and one had to learn to be that way after he lost his humanity (Ben).
     
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  13. Kryptic Mind

    Kryptic Mind Rebel Official

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    I think when Luke failed the first time with his academy (the flashback) he realised he had rushed things and was not ready just as he had rushed his encounter with Vader . When we see him this time he has focused and meditated for 10 years living like a hermit in every sense of the word and emerged a true Jedi Master . Hermits are often seen as a bit crazy and excentric by their surroundings and that includes Luke. The starkiller weapon is now ready and Luke feels it , the dark side is on the move .The state of cold war in the galaxy is over. The force awakens!! He has foreseen a lot of things and waits patiently on his island , his apprentice will come to him guided by the force (and a certain lightsaber) . He is the last Jedi and can not foolishly rush into battle like the Luke of his youth would. He must pass on what he has learned ,the future of the galaxy far far away depends on it.

    I predict that only when Luke feels that Rey (and Finn?) has learned enough will we see him do battle one last time in episode 9 . Fans will have to wait patiently , i think this is a much deeper story that doesn't jump the shark like the prequels did . Or maybe he doesn't fight at all? We will perhaps see a demonstration of tremendous force power with him lifting something huge in a epic scene . A more original approach though would be having him do the Jedi Mind trick on a huge crowd. Imagine Luke in his white robes standing alone like a messiah on a hill commanding a whole army to lay down their weapons .While he stands there like a beacon of peace John Williams beautiful binary sunset theme breaks out and goosebumps/tears spreads in the movie theatre like the fricking plague. ;)
     
    #13 Kryptic Mind, Sep 5, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2015
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