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SPECULATION If Luke Is Alive Does Star Wars "Jump the Shark"?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker' started by Rayjefury, Mar 22, 2018.

  1. Pawek_13

    Pawek_13 Jedi General

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    Force Ghosts are to Star Wars what Angels are to the Bible and Quran - they come, give either a piece of advice/information or a lesson and they're gone. If someone hopes they'll start directly participating in combat they'll be sorely disappointed. The Force is there to provide guidance, not military support.
     
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  2. ScumAndVillainy

    ScumAndVillainy Rebelscum

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    The problem is Rainy Johnston's movie says otherwise. If FG's like Yoda can have a tangible effect on the outside world and burn trees, why can't he do the same against a real enemy? Oh Right! Reasons...
     
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  3. DailyPlunge

    DailyPlunge Jedi General

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    If the internet existed in 1983 would people have been on the internet complaining that force ghost Obi-Wan sat on a log?

    Anyway, Yoda burning down the tree was a fantastic moment in TLJ and I welcome any additions to force ghost lore.
     
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  4. Trev

    Trev Rebel Official

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    At this point, retconning his death is only going to make everything worse. They need to just accept that he died—and on his own terms, no less—and continue on with the story. Everyone has made this very clear in interviews. It’s not Luke’s story anymore. The old characters are passing the torch onto these new characters. To be honest, we’re lucky that Luke, Leia and Han have been as crucial to the Sequel Trilogy as they’ve been, because when Disney first acquired Lucasfilm, I really thought their roles would be significantly smaller to focus on the newbies.

    I think it’s almost definite that Luke will be in Episode IX as a Force ghost, especially because Leia obviously won’t be in the film now. And I think he should be. I think his relationships with both Rey and Kylo Ren are important to the story. Perhaps he is able to pass on information that was initially intended to be revealed by Leia? We know her role in Episode IX was supposed to be prominent, and I have strong suspicions that she was key in Kylo Ren’s redemption. If there’s anyone who might be able to carry out some of what Leia was intended to do in this film, it’s probably Luke.

    Really, like others have said, these films need to focus on the new characters. As hard as that may be for some fans to digest, it’s not all about Luke. He’s part of a bigger story now, as important as he is, and while I don’t doubt that he’ll return, anyone who’s expecting him to come back to life is just setting themselves up for further disappointment. Episode IX will focus on Rey and Kylo Ren’s relationship to each other (I’m referencing their connection and parallels, not the romantic tension that may or may not exist between them) and the Force.
     
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  5. srg

    srg Force Attuned

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    I must add that I'm grateful for getting - *personal opinion warning* - such a beautiful death for Luke. I couldn't think of a better way to go. And this comes from someone convinced single-handedly by TLJ. I used to think Luke should live past IX. Now I 100% think the time was right, because IX is where the new characters have to shine, so making Luke's death a central point emotionally in that movie probably wouldn't be the best choice. It would be even worse to make his death somewhat pushed aside among all the plotlines that need their ending. Episode VIII was the right moment to make a huge deal out of it. I'm really impressed by what Rian came up with. Totally nailed the "on his own terms" aspect and "peace and purpose" are indeed perfect words to describe it.

    I used to think that it's a mistake to kill certain characters, because sometimes there's so much stories you can tell about them. But I've come around and I think it's often better to see finality on screen, especially when it comes to main characters. And I'm not saying all characters should die in their films, but you shouldn't purposefully save them for the future. Just focus on writing the most compelling ending. I thought that killing the whole Rogue One crew was a bad move, but after I thought harder about the story, I recognised that it made sense.

    A huge part of my reasoning is the fact that tie-ins are simply not always good and I don't want stuff crucial for the lore to fall into the hands of mediocre novelists. I just feel there's more care involved when they're making the films.
     
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  6. Andrew Waples

    Andrew Waples Jedi General

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    Or that Vader is Luke's father!
     
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  7. Sparafucile

    Sparafucile Guest

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    Do fans who love TLJ have such a hard time understanding there's a difference to a new sci-fi in comparison to an established world? It's an "argument" I keep hearing to justify TLJ, which if you love TLJ that's more than fine, but justifying it in this way is like saying oranges are good because watermelon is good. The comparison is completely out of context and makes no sense.

    I understand the insinuation is that fans back then would have hated on ESB and RotJ, but I don't see it. Firstly, the fandom wasn't established the same way as it is now. Second, the OT didn't have the amount of mystery boxes TFA left us with. Third, fans were more easily able to accept the plot twists because they weren't misdirected and trolled in those movies. In summary, the OT had a couple big plot twists (father/another) and the answer to those questions were satisfying to the fandom. The ST had a half dozen or so and they were misdirect or let downs for many (some).

    Any assumptions about the fandom back in 83 is about as accurate as anyone stating with certainty about fan backlash or the lack thereof, and in all cases we'll probably never get a sure answer. Bringing it up to make a point serves no purpose other than looking snidely on those who oppose your view. It causes more division and does not work in any way to prove any point. It's a lame joke that at least half the fandom rolls their eyes at (I'm sure many who like TLJ see it for what it is), as it very much is a form of trolling the "other side".

    In most ways, the OT and ST is not comparable (effects, established story vs new, following canon vs expanding on existing canon, attitude of the times, ect...), so comparing them or making assumptions on fan reactions, then compared to now, is a useless endeavor.
     
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  8. srg

    srg Force Attuned

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    Any particular reason why you quoted my post? I wasn't talking about what you are talking here.
     
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  9. DailyPlunge

    DailyPlunge Jedi General

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    I literally just read that twice attempting to understand the context of that reply to your post and I still don't get it. @Sparafucile did you quote the wrong post on the wrong thread?
     
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  10. Sparafucile

    Sparafucile Guest

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    I apologize, it was directed more at @DailyPlunge and @Andrew Waples as well as others who use the same comparison. I guess I read a few posts, got busy and when I returned I assumed the one before Andrew's last post was a continuation.
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 25, 2018, Original Post Date: Mar 25, 2018 ---
    lol, yeah I did haha
     
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  11. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

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    What about yoda in TLJ
    --- Double Post Merged, Mar 25, 2018, Original Post Date: Mar 25, 2018 ---
    that was due to a lack of advanced technology and before force ghosts were even a thing while star wars was still new...but now it has been decades and everything has been established...even obi wan says something in the star wars episode four about how even though he would not be able interfere directly if darth vader killed him, he would still be more powerful.
     
  12. NOT JEDI MATERIAL

    NOT JEDI MATERIAL Rebel Trooper

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    This quote is about as on track as it can be for now with what little we know about 9. JJ has no reason to bring Luke back other than as a guide of some kind for Rey and even that will be extremely limited in scope should it happen. Long time SW fans like myself have to accept this is now about the future of the franchise/marketing efforts and we will never get those years back where we were without Luke, Han, and Leia. Thinking Luke will come back to win some great light saber duel of significance is setting ones self up for disappointment I believe.
     
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  13. Trev

    Trev Rebel Official

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    I agree completely. Luke will surely continue to mentor Rey, and obviously Leia’s presence will be felt throughout the whole film. But some of the fans just cannot seem to accept that these new films are focused on characters beyond the original three. Really, I think any Star Wars film will suffer the same fate—it’s not as good as the Original Trilogy in the longtime fans’ eyes. I think this trilogy has been fantastic so far. The Last Jedi challenged my expectations in just about every possible way, and I love it even more for that.
     
  14. Big Daddy Dave

    Big Daddy Dave Rebelscum

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    As much as I dislike TLJ and hate the narrative decisions made, I fully agree with you and this entire post. I WANT luke back, but there is no point going back. The trilogy belongs to Rey, Finn, Poe and Ben. For better or worse. Like you said, Luke's character arc is done. JJ would be wise to use Luke as a force ghost to haunt Kylo Ren in one scene, two scenes tops. I don't even see the point in him appearing to Rey. She is nothing to him. The connection is Ben and Luke. Luke knew her for all of a few hours and there is as of now no family connection to link them.
     
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  15. nightangel

    nightangel Rebel Official

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    yep, sadly have to agree.
     
  16. Lord Phanatic

    Lord Phanatic Moff Gideon Wannabe

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  17. StarWarsGaming

    StarWarsGaming Rebelscum

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    Look why can’t the fans just take it as it is. Luke is dead. I hope he doesn’t come back as a real character. It would be great to see him as a force ghost teaching Rey a bit more about the force maybe. If he does comeback it would just make TLJ mean absolutely nothing. The world between worlds should be used as minimal as possible. I like the way it was implemented and the story behind it. But, it just doesn’t seem right that people can be brought back when they have died. It just seems a bit corny to me. It defeats the point of them dying in the first place.
     
  18. Paul

    Paul Rebel Commander

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    Luke will be back, as threatened haunting and taunting Kylo until he's in balance - the reversal of Obi Wan supporting the hero. Their battle isn't over. Redeeming bad guys is Luke's M.O. after all.
     
  19. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

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    Now with DVD at home..did you noted how Yoda's spirit looks "material" at moments doesn't even have blue halo around.Its even not transparent like spirits from OT.

    Luke's Return....what does dead mean?

    He would look and act almost the same as alive ,actually like his image on Crait .

    .Yoda's spirit summoned Lightning.

    Action spirits are coming folks.

    Prepare yourselves.
     
    #59 McDiarmid, Apr 2, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2018
  20. nightangel

    nightangel Rebel Official

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    would love to have your optimism, but doubt it.
     
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