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Is Luke Skywalker an uber-powerful Force God in TFA?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens' started by Dark Toilet, Jan 23, 2015.

  1. Pastor Barndog

    Pastor Barndog Force Attuned

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    Powerful is subjective.

    Bruce Lee was a powerful martial artist.
    The US president is a powerful man.

    Neither would be described as god-like.

    A strong and wise in the force Jedi Master sure. Using the force to block a shot with a nearby moon or some inhumanly quantifiable that there is no longer any danger for him without a contrived weakness would not be cool.
     
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  2. TheNinthCousin

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    Luke at this point should be kinda like neo in the matrix sequels
     
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  3. Pastor Barndog

    Pastor Barndog Force Attuned

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    Neo was way more powerful than we saw anything of in SW.

    I don't need Luke stopping hundreds of blaster bolts with a gesture and superman flying. That might not be what you have in mind but that is instantly what I think of when Neo is mentioned and I think the powers should be more subtle than that.
     
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  4. darthquixote

    darthquixote Rebel Trooper

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    There are several arguments for Luke being the most powerful Jedi ever.

    Firstly, George Lucas said as much.

    Secondly, it naturally follows from the fact that he is the son of Anakin Skywalker, who was freaking conceived by the Force itself and had the potential to become the most powerful force user ever. He inherited Anakin's power and potential. I think what we should see with Luke is basically what would have happened with Anakin's power if he wasn't corrupted by the dark side- which basically would have been a level up from Yoda and Palpatine.

    Third, given that he trained for basically three years to get to a point where he could beat one of the greatest duelists and most powerful Force users of all time, it's clear he has an unbelievable amount of raw potential- as well as an ability to learn on his own. Over 30 years or so of gaining greater understanding of the Force, he should be at quite a level. And there are definitely temple and holocrons around to study. There has been mention of the planet Devaron in Weapon of the Jedi. I imagine Luke went there for a whie to do some more self-study and meditation.

    As for whether or not him being so powerful would be in keeping with the image of the Jedi- sure it would. The Jedi have no issue with power. They have an issue with power as an objective rather than a means to serve a higher purpose. That distinguishes them from dark siders fundamentally. Another distinguishing factor is how they view one should go about getting power. The Jedi view it as something that is achieved through preparation, dilligence, and experience, and that it is never something to be pursued in conflict with a greater objective. The Jedi who had been around for a while in the PT- Yoda and Mace Windu, namely- were able to go toe-to-toe with Palpatine- who, despite all his proclaimations about how much more powerful he is and the dark side is, couldn't beat them. This is in stark contrast to the Sith view, which is that one should just let all the power lust inside go wild.

    So Luke being super powerful would be just fine. This is not to say that, for example, he may have some fatal flaw. I think that would add something to his character. But it would have to be something significant- which gives you a sense of wonder about how he is able to accomplish some things despite his disadvantages, a bit like Yoda in ESB. I saw one poster on here throw out the idea of Luke being blind- which would simply be epic writing.
     
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  5. Pastor Barndog

    Pastor Barndog Force Attuned

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    Powerful is still subjective. I want him powerful but I don't want him "god-like." If he is so powerful that there is not threat to him or the only threat is a plot device like kryptonite then that is lame.

    Surpassing previous jedi no problem. Surpassing previous jedi in such away as they look insignificant way to far.
     
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  6. odmichael

    odmichael Rebel Official

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    He's not in the movie long enough to be a force god. I think he will be in Episode VIII though.
     
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  7. TheFettMan

    TheFettMan Rebel Official

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    Luke as "God" seems to be a bit of a stretch but....
    If you look at it from a "certain point of view" ;) , Disney and ILM can keep Skywalker in the mix for years if he can live forever or be iternal.
    He might develop force powers stronger than any other Jedi or Jedi master.
    That's what Snoke, Kylo Ren and maybe Darth Plaguis might not be ready for. :confused:
    30-33 years is a long time.
    From the way the recent TFA trailer plays it "history" is long forgotten & many people do not know or care about the force, Jedi, Sith, etc. :rolleyes:
    JJ, KK, Kasdan and Disney are really playing it coy.
    It looks like the plan if for the OT characters to stay around but drift into the background so the new young characters can propel the ST.
    Good plan? Maybe.
    Smart plan? Not really in my view.
    Jake Lloyd & Natalie Portman were both young in TPM; 1999. That film was soundly & harshly trashed partly because of the young actors.
     
  8. ig89

    ig89 Rebelscum

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    He has to be extremely powerful with the force. His younger self fought really slow with a lightsaber (like all saberfighting was in the OT). It would be weird to suddenly see him swing his lightsaber like an acrobat. It would make much more sense if he did really strong force abilities.
     
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  9. TheFettMan

    TheFettMan Rebel Official

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    I disagree with parts of the last post.
    Luke could very well hone his fighting-saber skills in 33 years. (duel)
    If you do some web sleuthing you might watch the reported stunt training-stage combat video where a stunt performer takes on 2 opponents. This guy was IDed as a crew member on TFA :cool: .
    It very well may be Luke who in the film climax, fights off both Snoke & Kylo Ren, maybe with Finn's blue guardian saber.
    Actor Andy Sedikis(Snoke) also let slip a fact that he had a training plan/intensive stunt-action scene to work on.
    This heavy duty Luke-Snoke confrontation might end the film but lead into Ep8.
     
  10. Skywalker MD

    Skywalker MD Rebelscum

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    Every time I see Dooku do one of his front flips my brain disconnects from the movie and my eyes roll in the back in the head. I want Luke to be powerful with the saber, like his old man before him. I just want him to be really efficient with his strikes. The less the better in my opinion. Let the kids twirl and figure out the force for themselves.
     
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  11. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

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    He;'s the one who brings down the star destroyer on Jakku. ;) .
     
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  12. HAL'sgal

    HAL'sgal Force Sensitive

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    "I have become Death, the destroyer of worlds." Oppenheimer (quoting the Bhagavad Gita).
    But it's a very applicable quote because, as @Dark Toilet said, a Jedi doesn't want to be the ultimate power, it's a Sith thing. They're the ones who are destroyers of worlds, literally.

    Luke conquered the Dark Side not through the violent application of the Force, but ultimately through its wisdom; and through love & self-sacrifice (very New Testament, that). That's what saved Anakin and destroyed Palpatine, because Palpatine had no idea how strong compassion, truth and redemption could be. Any of us could have predicted Darth Vader could not kill his own son, but Palpatine wrote off that possibility after some weak reassurances from Vader. Honestly, that was just a dumb thing to do, but he had no idea of the power of the Light. But in the entire six movies, I never heard anyone refer to the "Power of the Light Side of the Force." Maybe it's Luke who finally has that revelation.

    So, in some ways, resorting to a lightsaber signals a certain degree of failure for a Jedi. In that regard, I think that 30 years of meditation and reflection could have made Luke an extremely powerful Jedi, but we'll probably never see him cut down another bad guy again, because he won't have to do that to get the job done. Imagine being so powerful that you never have to fight.
     
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  13. Emperor Abrams

    Emperor Abrams Rebel General

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    Better question:

    IS LUKE SKYWALKER EVEN IN IT?

    And does he have more screen time than Leonard Nimoy Spock did in JJ Abrams' Star Trek film? Will he interact with Han and Leia?

    And will his cameo in The Force Awakens be smaller than his cameo in Revenge Of The Sith?

    Baby Luke 1.png




    * screams * "J JAAAAAAAYYY!!!!!!"

    Kirk screams Khan gif.gif








    JJ abrams knockout gif Star Trek 1.gif
     
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  14. Fussel2107

    Fussel2107 Rebel General

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    I couldn't help but laugh out loud at the image of a training council of force ghosts.
    " Luke, you're doing it wrong! You need to go in low and then cut upwards and turn away, before they break your defense!"
    "Shut up, Dad! I know what I'm doing!"
    "On the day when I have not bested you with that move, kiddo. Do it again."
    Cue annoyed eyeroll.
     
    #54 Fussel2107, Oct 27, 2015
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  15. Lt. Hija

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    What about Leia? In determining what kind of role Luke could possibly have in TFA I've not noticed any talk regarding her. She had the same powers but from everything I can only guess thus far, it seems that she had no interest becoming a Jedi herself.

    What's there at the end of ROJ: A wrecked galaxy because of a conflict between the Jedi and the Sith. And the "children of Darth Vader" are supposed to take control of it and bring back peace?

    "With our combined strength, we can end this destructive conflict and bring order to the
    galaxy." (Vader in ESB)

    Almost seems to me that Luke and Leia decided not to advertise their abilities and their heritage. No more supernatural powers, let the "mundanes" govern and rule themselves, again, and do not follow Dad's advice.

    But apparently the Dark Side rises again - and eventually Luke will be called for help and assistance?
     
  16. darthquixote

    darthquixote Rebel Trooper

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    There's a lot of discussion about the Force choke.

    Aggressive? Yes. But Jedi used aggressive moves a lot. Yoda slammed the hell out of Palpatine's guards when he entered his office- to the point of at least knocking them unconscious. I don't see how that is better than what Luke did to the guards. Both used aggressive power for the same reason: to basically say, "Don't screw with me." Which is basically what Luke spent quite a bit of time trying to warn Jabba about, as he knew what would happen if Jabba trying to kill him.

    The ability to choke someone wouldn't seem to be inherently a dark side power. You're talking ultimately about manipulation of space in such a way to suffocate people. Manipuating space doesn't require inherent use of the dark side, as we know. I think it is more about how you are applying the ability. Vader applied the ability with a lot of rage when he choked subjects: when he choked Padme, when he choked Imperials who either mocked him or failed him, etc.. Luke's choke was a lot more non-chalant and was not done with any hint of any internal anger driving his move.

    The main difference between a light sider and dark side is that a light sider is characterized by letting the Force flow through him and using its assistance as an ally to meet an objective, whereas a dark sider seeks to use his internal passions to conquer the Force and empower oneself over others. Depending on the situation, one could achieve similar results using either side.

    Something like Force Lightning is where I would draw a clear line, as this is a particularly violent power that would arise from great anger and and wish to lay hell down on someone. You don't see Jedi doing this for a reason, even if the EU has blurred the lines on this one.
    --- Double Post Merged, Oct 27, 2015, Original Post Date: Oct 27, 2015 ---
    If Luke fights like the guy playing him in this video, I would be very pleased. Hi-quality Djem-So with lots of creative moments and on-the-fly intuition mixed with polished, but not totally elaborate, blade work. The level of mobility in this video would be about right- maybe with a Force-assisted jump or two if we are talking about platforms.

     
    #56 darthquixote, Oct 27, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2015
  17. darthquixote

    darthquixote Rebel Trooper

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    Firstly, every actor in TFA is older than Jake Lloyd and Natalie Portman were in TPM. The only cast member who is younger than Carrie Fisher was in 1977 when ANH came out is Daisy Ridley, and she is younger by one wopping year. So it's not as if we have a bunch of teenage actors running around or that Disney is making The Mickey Mouse Club in Space.

    Secondly, the issue wasn't that they had young actors. The issue was the concepts in which young actors were used. There's really no reason, I think, why you had to go to the length of introducing Anakin as a 9-year old in literally every sense and making him basically the hero of a Saturday morning show. That is a specific point of contention that people had with the film- giving such an epic character such an unserious profile.

    Personally, I think Natalie Portman was an excellent casting choice and a tragic case of a true talent having horrible material to work with.

    But if you think Star Wars can exist without young leads, you're fooling yourself. Youth is central to the Star Wars saga, and it's essential that the leads are young.

    Time passes, we all move on to different roles. The original 3 have, as well, even though they are now leading-from-behind roles. We have new characters now with new story arcs, because this thing can't go on when Harrison Ford, Mark Hammil, and Carrie Fisher are gone. It's time to develop new characters while still expanding existing characters as far as they can go. (We'll get Han's backstory and great sacrifice, and then it's over for him. Luke still has a promise to keep to an old friend and the matter of sorting things out when he comes back to things, and Leia's role is more or less clear.)
     
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  18. TheFettMan

    TheFettMan Rebel Official

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    Of course the new SW films will have young leads.
    Kids and young adults like to watch other kids. Duuuh!.... :rolleyes:
    I'm saying the PT wasn't helped by the casting but that's a different topic.
    I think JJ & Kasdan correctly decided to use the OT characters a lot in this plot then shift the new young actors into main roles.
    Luke Skywalker is NOT going to be the main character or focus. He may become a mentor or leader like Obi Wan or Yoda. A few scenes or like Gandolf in the Jackson LOTR films.
     
  19. Bluemilk

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    Yoda and Obi Wan taught Luke to use the Force for knowledge and defense. Luke tosses away his weapon. Which tells me what he will be like in TFA.
     
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  20. Polyamarous

    Polyamarous Clone Commander

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    He will be the most powerful Jedi we've ever seen on the big screen. He will be able to rip a tie fighter from the sky with ease. A star destroyer? That's a little excessive, even Yoda old and feeble could lift a X-Wing. Yoda even explained that size doesn't matter, so I guess theoretically it would be possible for a powerful force user to move something massive. I don't want to see them go that far though.
     
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