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Kylo and Vader's helmet

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Last Jedi' started by Bluemilk, Jan 16, 2017.

  1. Bluemilk

    Bluemilk I AM the Senate

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    I was thinking about the scene where Kylo says to Vader's mask"Show me again the power of the darkness."

    Do you think when he first touched that helmet he had a vision like Rey. Something similar only like Rey seeing Kylo, he sees Rey too.

    And that he will again in VIII?

    I have no evidence he seen anything other than what he says, but just wondering what you all think.
     
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  2. master_shaitan

    master_shaitan Jedi General

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    I've thought something similar as well.
    It might be that the saber was the light side calling to Rey in her awakening and the helmet might've called to Ren in a dark side awakening.

    JJ did say that the awakening of the light is Rey and the dark was Ren.
     
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  3. lealt

    lealt Rebel Official

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    I don't think. If we have to believe OT is still canon, Darth Vader in the end came back as Anakin Skaywalker. So I guess Kylo can't comunicate with "Darth Vader (so with the dark side through him), but Anakin Skywalker may tell or show something to his grandson and - if so - I doubt it will be about the dark side
    But, who knows...

    However I came here to ask you all something about another scene: Luke and R2 in Rey's Vision.
    I always assumed that is a vision form the past and specifically of the moment when Luke saved the rest of the map inside the droid

    But C3PO tells BB8 "R2-D2 has been in low power mode ever since Master Luke went away"
    He says "went away".

    Meaning that at some point Luke was with R2D2, but also Leia and C3P0 at least.
    This also explane how they have R2 (if the dorid was left in low power mode in another planet that would be almost impossible)

    The thing is I doubt Luke met Leia after Ben/Kylo betrayl.

    One can imanige he felt the need to personally expalin his sister what happened.
    But Luke is hunted by the FO.
    All TFA plot is about his sister trying to find him to gain his help and more over in the other hand about the FO trying to find and kill him.
    And if you are hunted you avoid the most obvius place one can find you and you avoid to put the people you love in danger.

    So do you think Is it possible R2-D2 has been in low mode from long time before. From the last time Luke and Leia met each other and Luke went away (with Ben) maybe in search of the first Jedi temple (leaving a clue inside R2, you know... just in case)?
    And - if so - do you think that scene Luke+R2D2 in Rey's vision comes from the future and not the past?
     
    #3 lealt, Jan 16, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2017
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  4. master_shaitan

    master_shaitan Jedi General

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    It's no so much about the ghost of Vader communicating with him but the Dark Side itself or whatever dark energy is connected to the helmet.

    No, I think that was certainly after the massacre. My thinking is that he left Artoo at the scene and he was found by Leia and co or Artoo went back, told them Luke had left and then shut down for whatever reason.

    Re: the clue inside Artoo. Luke didn't leave that. Artoo had that in him from when he downloaded the archives of the Empire on the Death Star. The Empire were searching the galaxy for Jedi Temples but someone must've hidden that section (that BB8 had), leaving them with an incomplete map. The piece that BB8 had must've been removed from the archives a long time ago - likely by a Jedi or member of the Church of the Force.
     
    #4 master_shaitan, Jan 16, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2017
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  5. lealt

    lealt Rebel Official

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    thank you so much :)
     
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  6. GotTheSilver

    GotTheSilver Rebel Official

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    I have wondered about these things myself.

    As for Vader's helmet, it seems possible to me that Kylo got a vision when he first touched it. But it seems like maybe he is not seeing that vision anymore, hence his asking "Grandfather" to show it to him again but not having another vision in TFA. I think the vision would be the result of the dark side energy stored in the helmet, not a vision specifically sent by Anakin.

    As for the shot of R2 and Luke, I have wondered when this takes place. It really could be any time! It could be right after the massacre happens, occurring at the site of the massacre near a burning building (would be a strong emotional scene to implant itself on the saber). It could be happening in the future on Ach To. Maybe it happens prior to the massacre. There is so little to go on here.
     
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  7. ITG

    ITG Force Sensitive

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    #PlagueisForceIllusionsConfirmed
     
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  8. Bluemilk

    Bluemilk I AM the Senate

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    Just to make clear I'm not saying Anakin visited him. I'm just wondering if by receiving and touching the helmet he had visions because of the dark side.
     
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  9. tm0910196

    tm0910196 Guest

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    I was thinking this exact idea yesterday, and yes, I think you're on to something. I believe that the Anakin/Luke lightsaber imparts knowledge (via Force visions) to those with strong Force potential and that Vader's helmet does the same thing. What you see might depend on whether you adhere to the light or dark side.

    But yes, I definitely think there's that parallel.
     
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  10. Haswaa

    Haswaa Rebel Trooper

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    I don't think there is any dark force aura or whatever...it's snoke manipulating him just as palps did with Anakin.
     
  11. GingerByte

    GingerByte Guest

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    Don't rule out dark side visions/ aura just yet. In the Lando comics we see ancient dark side artifacts corrupt beings, and in an unfinished Clone Wars episode, it was to be revealed that the Jedi Temple was built on top of a Sith shrine. This was revealed instead in the novel Tarkin. The dark side shrine was unearthed and reactivated by Palpatine, and this allowed him to help "cloud" the Jedi above.
     
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  12. Lord Phanatic

    Lord Phanatic Villainous
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    I wonder. Kylo is a Vader fanatic. He's obsessed with Vader. That being the case, I wonder if he even NEEDS any dark side energy resonating from Vader's helmet. His worship of his grandfather's evil ways seems to do the job on it's own. He's totally driven by this and he's totally unstable at the same time. He slashes computer consoles and other equipment on his own ship in temper tantrums. His vision is so clouded that his irrationality led him to murder his own father. He's a bit of a lunatic so its not hard to see him talking to an old burnt helmet. Not saying I don't like the character, I think he's dope, but this is what happens when one is seduced. Even Leia said he was seduced by Snoke. I'm not ruling out the fact that there may be dark side energy in Vader's helmet. I can see his old saber resonating with the force do to the fact that it has a kyber crystal. But I'm thinking Kylo is really after the saber and the force energy that it's CRYSTAL holds, and that his state of mind thus far is do to Snoke and not Vader's helmet. I'm thinking Vader's Helmet is simply a prized and precious artifact, that it's all that's left of his grandfather that he can physically touch. It's his only connection to Vader.
     
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  13. master_shaitan

    master_shaitan Jedi General

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    Indeed. Also a chance Snoke just put all this stuff in Ren's head. Made him obsessed with Vader and perhaps even created illusions of some kind to make him feel he had some kind of destiny to fulfil Vader's ambitions.
     
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  14. ITG

    ITG Force Sensitive

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    Like I said....
     
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