1. Due to the increased amount of spam bots on the forum, we are strengthening our defenses. You may experience a CAPTCHA challenge from time to time.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Notification emails are working properly again. Please check your email spam folder and if you see any emails from the Cantina there, make sure to mark them as "Not Spam". This will help a lot to whitelist the emails and to stop them going to spam.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. IMPORTANT! To be able to create new threads and rate posts, you need to have at least 30 posts in The Cantina.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Before posting a new thread, check the list with similar threads that will appear when you start typing the thread's title.
    Dismiss Notice

Leia's message to Ben

Discussion in 'General Sequel Trilogy Discussion' started by FN-3263827, Nov 28, 2017.

?

did Ben get Leia's message?

  1. no, and it might have changed everything

    2 vote(s)
    11.8%
  2. no, but he may get it now

    3 vote(s)
    17.6%
  3. yes, but it was too late

    9 vote(s)
    52.9%
  4. yes, but he didn't care about what she had to say

    1 vote(s)
    5.9%
  5. it's not important

    2 vote(s)
    11.8%
  1. FN-3263827

    FN-3263827 First Order CPS
    1030th General **** (Mod)

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Posts:
    10,000
    Likes Received:
    141,358
    Trophy Points:
    173,077
    Credits:
    68,837
    Ratings:
    +157,681 / 65 / -7
    so in Bloodline, after Leia is outed as being Vader's daughter, she sends a very distraught message to Ben, with whom she hasn't spoken in a long while (he and Luke have been out of touch, adventuring around the galaxy)

    we have no idea what the content of the message is, only that Han rushes to be with her when she delivers it, and that she's crying so much she can barely get through it.

    we also have no idea if Ben ever received it.

    so:
    • what do you think Leia told (or tried to tell) him?
    • do you think Ben got the message before finding out about Vader, after, or not at all?
    • do you think we'll find out the contents of the message in the ST?
     
    • Like Like x 10
    • Informative Informative x 1
  2. tm0910196

    tm0910196 Guest

    Credits:
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    So:
    • she was sorry she hid her Vader-lineage and was sorry that she and Han were neglectful parents
    • After, or not at all (which could be very poignant onscreen if done well)
    • Hopefully. Maybe that could be how Leia figures into Ep. IX without Carrie Fisher.
     
    • Like Like x 10
  3. FN-3263827

    FN-3263827 First Order CPS
    1030th General **** (Mod)

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Posts:
    10,000
    Likes Received:
    141,358
    Trophy Points:
    173,077
    Credits:
    68,837
    Ratings:
    +157,681 / 65 / -7
    right??? this is kinda what i was thinking too. even if he did get the message, he might have dismissed it in a pique.
    but what if it came back to haunt him? what if it haunts him now? what if he plays it over and over to torment himself?

    or :

    what if, confronting by Kylo Ren in TLJ, she tells him how she tried to reach him, and he says: what? i never got any message! and she either tells him what she sent, or sends it later (in IX *sob*), and it's all staticky and she's blubbering so you can't really hear every word, but she says all the right things that he needed to hear then but never did.

    ugh. it's breaking my heart that she won't be in IX! : ' o (
     
    • Like Like x 8
  4. Trevor

    Trevor Rebellion Arms Supplier
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2014
    Posts:
    3,815
    Likes Received:
    11,270
    Trophy Points:
    144,177
    Credits:
    13,747
    Ratings:
    +16,009 / 96 / -33
    I think that he got it, It has to be that "Vader was your grandfather" only because she got outed and had to, and I almost expect that he saw it first on "Galactic Holo-News" which is ONE of the reasons that he's so pi$$ed at his parents...because they hid it from him. IDK if we'll ever know exactly what was in it, but it'd make a solid plot point and an excellent scene if done right.
     
    • Like Like x 7
  5. FN-3263827

    FN-3263827 First Order CPS
    1030th General **** (Mod)

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Posts:
    10,000
    Likes Received:
    141,358
    Trophy Points:
    173,077
    Credits:
    68,837
    Ratings:
    +157,681 / 65 / -7
    i feel like Claudia Gray specifically didn't "script" it because she either didn't know what it should say, or they wanted to hold it back.
    like you said, i think it could be a very powerful plot element given all the emotional stakes.
    especially too, since this is the only time i know of in current canon that adult Leia has ever openly cried.
     
    • Like Like x 6
  6. The Hero With No Fear

    The Hero With No Fear Resident Sand Hater

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2017
    Posts:
    1,235
    Likes Received:
    35,436
    Trophy Points:
    157,617
    Credits:
    23,186
    Ratings:
    +36,647 / 14 / -9
    I'm actually going to start rereading Bloodline tomorrow. I'd guess that he got her message but he didn't matter. I also think that this event was likely what triggered his fall to the dark side.

    Imagine being told that your linege was of a family of great heroes, but you find out, (not by your parents themselves) after twenty years, that your grandfather was a terrifying monster who'd killed thousands. Even if your grandfather was a good man once, and was able to renounce his evil ways shortly before death, that'd still be horrible to find out.
     
    • Like Like x 5
  7. Bandini

    Bandini Jedi Commander

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2015
    Posts:
    4,862
    Likes Received:
    5,536
    Trophy Points:
    87,267
    Credits:
    9,058
    Ratings:
    +10,279 / 461 / -131
    From Leia's point of view, Vader is her genitor, her father is Bail Organa.

    She didn't lie, she never did.

    Darth Vader never was her father.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Wise Wise x 1
    • Original Original x 1
    • Hopeful Hopeful x 1
  8. FN-3263827

    FN-3263827 First Order CPS
    1030th General **** (Mod)

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Posts:
    10,000
    Likes Received:
    141,358
    Trophy Points:
    173,077
    Credits:
    68,837
    Ratings:
    +157,681 / 65 / -7
    i want to reread it too (probably this weekend).

    i would imagine that anger would be compounded by the fact that he's probably always known he was "different" but couldn't understand it and no one could/would explain it to him. that's a pretty rough thing to discover so late--not even so much that Vader is his grandfather, but that his parents allowed him to exist in this state of confusion/turmoil. for what reason? to protect him, i'm sure they were thinking. but yeah, that's doesn't really make it all right.

    absolutely! but it maybe does kind of matter that Vader actually sired her in this case.
    we don't know yet what she ever told Ben, so we have no idea whether she lied by omission or straight out lied, or said nothing at all.
    these are some of the things i hope we find out--if not in the movies, then supplementally somewhere.
     
    • Like Like x 6
  9. NinjaRen

    NinjaRen Supreme Leader

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2015
    Posts:
    4,792
    Likes Received:
    102,324
    Trophy Points:
    171,517
    Credits:
    55,495
    Ratings:
    +110,835 / 173 / -32
    Yes, I think he got the message, but he couldn't care less. Leia could have written the best message, but Ben couldn't accept this betrayal. He may haven't even read it fully. It would be cool if this message gets mentioned again in TLJ.
     
    • Like Like x 8
  10. tm0910196

    tm0910196 Guest

    Credits:
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    I agree. Also, I have to mention this, since you're not a native English speaker: thank you for using the phrase "couldn't care less" correctly. Lots of people write "could care less," which gives the opposite meaning of what they want. (Well, the full phrase is, "I could care less, but that would take too much effort" - but since most people leave out the second part, you need to use "couldn't" to make the same point).

    Okay, carry on discussing Leia's message, everybody.
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Friendly Friendly x 3
  11. Bluemilk

    Bluemilk I AM the Senate

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2014
    Posts:
    4,447
    Likes Received:
    8,774
    Trophy Points:
    92,402
    Credits:
    11,899
    Ratings:
    +14,558 / 149 / -71
    My guess is that Luke probably received the message along the lines of being outed and being truthful to Ben about his grandfather. And either he hid it from Ben and he found out or he was there and was listening. That would create even greater conflict and drama if they use it in TLJ at all.
     
    • Like Like x 6
  12. FN-3263827

    FN-3263827 First Order CPS
    1030th General **** (Mod)

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Posts:
    10,000
    Likes Received:
    141,358
    Trophy Points:
    173,077
    Credits:
    68,837
    Ratings:
    +157,681 / 65 / -7
    that would be interesting--and terrible. i can see Luke possibly thinking: oh no, let me try to "manage" this, am bungling it.
    Leia never believed/accepted that Vader returned to the Light, so it would not have been part of her "narrative", but i can't imagine Luke would have wanted to have that conversation with his nephew without telling him his own side.

    which i can see could get really messy: your parents lied to you, but wait, there's still more.
    and now what are you really supposed to believe?

    i can totally see Ben walking out to find out the truth for himself, right into Snoke's waiting hands.
     
    • Like Like x 6
  13. Maximus

    Maximus Reel 2 Dialogue 2

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Posts:
    3,223
    Likes Received:
    72,395
    Trophy Points:
    171,705
    Credits:
    23,625
    Ratings:
    +78,188 / 26 / -13
    that might be the first time i've seen you call him that :p
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Funny Funny x 2
  14. FN-3263827

    FN-3263827 First Order CPS
    1030th General **** (Mod)

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Posts:
    10,000
    Likes Received:
    141,358
    Trophy Points:
    173,077
    Credits:
    68,837
    Ratings:
    +157,681 / 65 / -7
    BWHAHahahaha ~ hope he enjoys it because it probably won't happen again any time soon.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Funny Funny x 2
  15. Lazarus Dei

    Lazarus Dei Tree Dodger Extraordinaire
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2015
    Posts:
    3,213
    Likes Received:
    27,115
    Trophy Points:
    153,527
    Credits:
    17,370
    Ratings:
    +31,513 / 8 / -0
    Thanks for kicking this thread off @FN-3263827 - I'm so desperately behind on reading these days that I'd have known nothing about a message going into TLJ otherwise. Assuming it turns out to be movie plot relevant it's good to know about it in advance!
     
    • Like Like x 6
  16. Maximus

    Maximus Reel 2 Dialogue 2

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Posts:
    3,223
    Likes Received:
    72,395
    Trophy Points:
    171,705
    Credits:
    23,625
    Ratings:
    +78,188 / 26 / -13
    If the message was to inform Ben about his grandfather.. then I'm not sure it would matter if he got it, but I'm guessing he did.

    Gotta look someone in the eyes to tell them something like that. A last minute message because someone has uncovered your lie is not gonna help.

    I don't like to knock Leia.. but she made a big ol booboo
     
    • Like Like x 6
  17. FN-3263827

    FN-3263827 First Order CPS
    1030th General **** (Mod)

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Posts:
    10,000
    Likes Received:
    141,358
    Trophy Points:
    173,077
    Credits:
    68,837
    Ratings:
    +157,681 / 65 / -7
    i really struggle with this too. i mean, i think that's why she's crying so hard: she knows she screwed up big time. so less than: "hey by the way sweetie, Vader's your grandpa", it might've been more "i'm so sorry i didn't tell you; i only was trying to protect you."

    again, not that it helps. especially under the circumstances.

    i found most of Leia's behavior really unflattering in Bloodline.
    she's got a lot to answer for, but also she's clearly got a lot to reconcile for her own self with regard to Vader--and now with her son.
    dunno if it will ever be brought up, but it feels like kind of a big deal in terms of how Ben fell.
    you definitely should read Bloodline (even though i've now spoiled a big moment for you) : o p
    but one of the things i think Bloodline does that's really critical to the ST is that it sets up the political landscape (and not in a boring PT way) ~ hahahaha
     
    • Like Like x 6
  18. Bluemilk

    Bluemilk I AM the Senate

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2014
    Posts:
    4,447
    Likes Received:
    8,774
    Trophy Points:
    92,402
    Credits:
    11,899
    Ratings:
    +14,558 / 149 / -71
    Or the message could've been more simple.

    Dear son, I'm visiting Hoth and my TaunTaun got stuck in the snow. Please send an XWing to pull me out. Your dad is off smuggling more Rathars. I also need some milk and bread. Love mom
     
    • Funny Funny x 7
    • Like Like x 1
  19. FN-3263827

    FN-3263827 First Order CPS
    1030th General **** (Mod)

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Posts:
    10,000
    Likes Received:
    141,358
    Trophy Points:
    173,077
    Credits:
    68,837
    Ratings:
    +157,681 / 65 / -7
    suddenly Ben's turn to the Darkside is not only understandable, but fully justified ~ hahahahaha
     
    • Funny Funny x 5
    • Like Like x 2
  20. Maximus

    Maximus Reel 2 Dialogue 2

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Posts:
    3,223
    Likes Received:
    72,395
    Trophy Points:
    171,705
    Credits:
    23,625
    Ratings:
    +78,188 / 26 / -13
    it doesn't make her a bad mom.. it's just a mistake, and it happens.

    frequently an adopted child finds out via some method other than their parents telling them.. where the parents were waiting for that 'prefect' moment when the child reaches a certain age that they might understand what they are being told.. and why it was kept from them.

    there is no perfect time for life altering news... it's nearly always best to just do it early and hope for the best. easier said than done though.

    whether it was in the message or not, and even if he did get it... she still has to have that talk with him.

    tissues at the ready
     
    • Like Like x 5
    • Wise Wise x 1
Loading...

Share This Page