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Main Rey/Daisy Ridley Episode IX thread

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker' started by LadyMusashi, Jul 5, 2018.

  1. RockyRoadHux

    RockyRoadHux Ginger General

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    I would have to disagree. Yeah, Rey disarmed her, but without Zorri they
    would not gotten Babu's help to modify C3po and they would not got off the planet without being noticed by the FO.

    Moreover saying that her asking for help was something special baffles me like , the good guys in SW always behave Like that it is not a special trait of Rey's. Finn or Poe would have asked for help too.
     
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  2. The Birdwatcher

    The Birdwatcher Rebel General

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    Hmm. I've had an epiphany. Blood lines didn't matter in Empire (I suppose). It was a coincidence that Luke could use force powers as well as Vader; Luke had been trained.

    The reason why the Luke-Vader connection is so powerful is because Luke's whole family is dead-mother, father, aunt, uncle. Also, his best friend- Biggs is dead. When a piece of Luke's family is still alive, especially one that Luke looked up to, is now alive. It's relieving as awful for Luke that his father is alive, only to be a mass-murderer. Luke's a survivor, and survivors like to cling to some part of their past to recover unless they can move on. Luke's bonded with Han and Leia, too, which is part of the reason for rejecting Vader's proposal, as well as it not being the right thing to do.

    Palpatine- 1. In ROTJ is basically a watered-down version of TESB Vader, with references to evil being primarily placed on Palpatine- spider-web trap, pale skin, yellow eyes, wrinkly skin, minus the father-son connection. Plus, (imo) it dishonors the TESB emperor with alterations. It was more clear that the TESB Emperor was humanoid/alien in design with the bulging eyes. Clearly the design was changed (even more radically than TFA Snoke to TLJ Snoke).
    2. ROTJ Emperor's power play is weaker than Vader, since he won't replace the dead father figure or even emphasizes a co-rule to Luke, which may be implied.
    3. Prequels trilogy Palpatine is better, as he exhibits some machinations in TPM and AOTC. However, some have pointed out (Confused Matthew in particular) about how the vote of no confidence for Chancellor Valorum seems like it was meant to set up the Republic for direct take over, since it was just a single vote. Also, it seems suspicious that if the Jedi were told of a conspiracy with the clones that they wouldn't investigate the matter further.

    That being said, Palpatine is a mixed character. I almost want to root for him, but he is often too cliched. Also, I can't take him seriously outside of TPM and AOTC and a few contemplative moments in ROTJ.

    So, pseudo-Vader makes his move on Rey. What he really wants to do is live again through his heir. Okay, fair enough. Rey has never had a dead grandfather that she looked up to, though. So, besides exhibiting a dead family and maybe wanting a dead family member come back to life, Rey doesn't need a dead grandfather.

    And then, Palpatine makes a similar move in TROS to ROTJ's- your friends will die. However, it's different because this time he says that this time she could save them. Yes, but hold the phone, didn't he just say that they would fuse just before if she accepts? Doesn't imply a lack of control if Palpatine and the other Sith ghosts overwhelm her? Duh.

    Again, Palpatine's arguments are bogus, if only a little more clever. This time you will save your friends if you accept. It's only a little bit smarter than it's unavoidable from ROTJ. Also, the argument seems like ROTS- I don't know if I can save your wife, but together we can discover the secret. It's like oh yeah, I know, but wait a little longer. It's like one of those pop-up ads on the internet- oh yeah I have $5,000, if you only click here.

    Anyway, Palpatine's switch-and-bait arguments seems lacking to Vader's more concrete offer to Luke.

    Palpatine also argues that Rey needs him because he is family. Again, it's not only about family in TESB; it's about what was dead is back. This is what ROTJ Luke almost seems obsessed about- I must save my dad- I need to keep him.
     
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  3. p03

    p03 Force Sensitive

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    I'm torn on the Palpatine situation because I agree and have said it. Palpatine was used to centralise Rey. This should have always been the case but she was written out of the TLJ. She was just on the outskirts doing nothing to contribute the film. JJ and Terrio needed something to pull her back in so Palpatine basically became a plot point and I am glad of that. However, the message becomes somewhat blurred because the film is saying it doesn't matter who you are a born from its who you become. Then why make her a Palpatine in the first place. However, I do agree am not a fan of eugenics myself. Also on a buisness side of things, yep I agree the male Skywalker bloodline had to end. Some may hate me for saying that but Annakin Skywalker, Luke Skywalker, Ben Solo. It's simply unoriginal and lacks nuanced and is some what a clouded view point. (Lol I just quoted the ratings accidentally :p). Rey Skywalker through force adoption kind of did open up a precedence of new force users to be able to take up that mantle and lead new forthcoming trilogies. We can now have poc becoming central protagonist holding the name. (Something we wouldn't have if we had Reylo babies). We could have aliens, they can be any gender and yes they can become a Skywalker too. Last names shouldn't matter either whoever they are even if they are Palpatine. I think it a beautiful narrative but did Rey need to be Palpatine maybe not. Good idea in principle but I wouldn't have gone that route but am just glad our protagonist was more than just the boyfriend of.
     
  4. RockyRoadHux

    RockyRoadHux Ginger General

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    Rumor has it that the Boyfriend will get his own series...
     
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  5. p03

    p03 Force Sensitive

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    Baiting

    Besides what does pre TFA material have to do with Rey having a boyfriend. Take it to a Kylo thread.

    Am sorry we will never see eye to eye on Adam Driver and Kylo Ren and shipping because I find it sexist so just put me on ignore.
     
    #465 p03, Aug 19, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2020
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  6. Veronica

    Veronica Rebel Commander

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    Can you explain this. Because I don't follow. How exactly was she on the sidelined doing nothing?


    That was the message from the get go, especially given how crippled Rey was at the start of the film, crippled by her insecurities about who she was. Rey's arc through 3 movies is: Desperately wants to know her family - > Accepts her ancestry doesn't define her - > Understands she can choose her family for herself. So by the time she learns her "true" lineage any attachment she would have to that information has been thoroughly disposed of.

    From what I have read and evidence provided by other fans. Rey was always meant to be a Palpatine From the get go. It's in everything from the name change of Kira to Rey (which is Spanish for King) just as they went to filming. To the similarity between Rey's theme and Palpatine's. And there is also the fact that Daisy was instructed and coached to speak with an Received Pronunciation (AKA BBC English) which is supposed to denote the aristocracy in the SW universe. When I first saw Rey I surmised that she was a rich kid from a prominent family whose family fell afoul of the TFO and were executed (I was close). Not being a SW fan or of the films I wasn't aware of the common thread of Palpatine vs. Skywalker. So it would be only be fitting that she be connected to a character in the story. There's also, as I now know. George's original concept and idea for a ST which was supposed to involve Annakin's grandchildren a boy and a girl. And LF took the concept and did twist to it making

     
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  7. p03

    p03 Force Sensitive

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    I will send you a private message later, maybe tomorrow. Got stuff to do.
     
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  8. Veronica

    Veronica Rebel Commander

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    Here's a link regarding Daisy's career so far. Expected her to be busier. But sort of not surprised on another hand:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/films/news/daisy-ridley-star-wars-acting-roles-chaos-walking-video-game-twelve-minutes-a9692681.htl

    There is a reason we never got an Emma Peel type movie franchise. And the Bachelor has lasted 10+ years on tv. Alpha/Sigma type heroines are not that liked (hence why Mulan is going straight to cable instead of being pushed back). People find them too threatening.

    Anyway I hope it works out for her. I suspect we'll see her on Netflix or in a BBC drama soon.
     
    #468 Veronica, Aug 29, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2020
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  9. Messi

    Messi Force Attuned

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    I think Mark Hamill had the same problem after finishing the OT back in the 80's.

    She was fine in the remake of Murder on the Orient Express, but the movie was awful.
    Never seen Ophelia.
     
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  10. Veronica

    Veronica Rebel Commander

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    It also depends on what she's been auditioning for. If, as I suspect, she wants to get away from doing costume dramas and British Ice Queen type roles , I can see how she would run into problems with casting directors who only see her as being one way. Ophelia was okay. But I honestly would only watch it if you are die hard fan of Daisy and enjoy watching her perform.




     
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  11. MagnarTheGreat

    MagnarTheGreat Jedi General

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    Daisy Ridley: "No [I have not been keeping Rey's secret from the beginning and didn't know the parentage from the beginning]. At the beginning, there was toying with like an Obi-wan [Kenobi] connection and then, um, it really went...there were like different versions and then it really went to she was no one and then it came to Episode IX and JJ pitched me the film and was like, 'Oh yeah, Palpatine’s [Rey's] granddaddy,' and I was like, 'Awesome!' and then two weeks later he was like 'Oh, we're not sure [anymore]...' So it kept changing! So even as we were filming and I wasn’t sure what the answer was gonna be." "You tell me, Josh, [who Rey's grandmother is]." (September 8, 2020) (archive)

     
    #471 MagnarTheGreat, Sep 9, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2020
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  12. Mosley909

    Mosley909 Rebel Official

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    It's fine. they definitely got away with the fact they didn't know where they were going with all the mysteries they set up in force awakens, no one noticed and it hasn't caused a massive uproar in the film going community or anything like that......
     
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  13. Use the Falchion

    Use the Falchion Force Sensitive

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    I just watched it! This is fascinating. So after TFA, when Daisy was talking about Rey's lineage being obvious, she really meant Kenobi. (TFA hints at this pretty well, so I'm not too surprised.) And RJ really meant Nobody, and then JJ just wanted something different it seems.*
    Changing direction during the creation process of something is totally fine, but the fact that it changed so much over the course of the trilogy...that leaves a weird taste in my mouth. It's like one of those "my feelings are vindicated and justified, but I really wish they weren't" sort of tastes. Not the first time in the past seven days either...

    Overall, while I think this interview is good background info for us fans, I don't think it helps Lucasfilm's image, nor does it paint a better picture of the ST.

    *Maybe JJ thought pre-TLJ that Luke was going to take Rey under his tutelage, and then Rey would be so endeared by this act that she'd take his name at the end of the trilogy. When RJ said "well, you didn't make a decision on her lineage, so I'll do it for my story" and took Rey and Luke's arcs in a different direction, JJ felt a little loss. And then he realized that if he can make Rey's grandparents bad, then he can use that to motivate Rey to change her name. Or that's how I'll probably justify it.
     
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  14. DailyPlunge

    DailyPlunge Jedi General

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    Daisy would have known that Rey wasn't a Kenobi after release for the reasons pointed out here.

    I don't believe this interviews is that interesting other than the bit about Kenobi that they were kicking around early on in production. It's also important to remember that they were thinking about Palpatine early on as well based on the concept art they were doing during the beginning planning phases.

    It was pretty obvious after TROS that making her a Palpatine wasn't originally planned. JJ forcing that into the story is just another example of how much of a mess that production was... I don't blame JJ for this, but that timeline was impossible.
     
  15. Old Jedi

    Old Jedi Rebelscum

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    I can’t imagine anyone is surprised that the Rey/Palpatine connection was not set at the outset of the trilogy.

    I think the ST definitely suffered from the lack of an overall story arc for the trilogy, but the OT and PT proved to me it can work without one (OT) and not work with one (PT).

    For those that dislike the ST or aspects of it (I’d be in the later camp) there seems to be a tendency to “blame” the director of the movie(s) in the trilogy they like the least. I don’t really see the point. Ultimately I think the Palpatine connection in TROS could have worked just fine, but admit I think it was pretty poorly set-up relative to what was in TFA (she’s somebody!) and TLJ (she’s nobody!). My personal preference is the JJ version and story in TFA/TROS, but even in the context of the lack of a planned arc it still could have been handled better story wise imo.

    I still think another 15-30 min of exposition in TROS could have made a huge overall difference. Bring on the JJ Cut! :)
     
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  16. Use the Falchion

    Use the Falchion Force Sensitive

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    I think that's where my problem is too. But when things DON'T work as intended or naturally, there's this feeling of the director's "forcing" their way through to get what they want, and that's what Rey Palpatine felt like to most. It's not the concept that was the problem, just the actualization.

    I'm in that latter camp as well, but I always try to see what the creator was doing. Things like the Director's Commentary and cut scenes are integral to this when available; and the fact that they aren't available for TROS speaks volumes.


    TFA/TLJ (I don't agree with everything in TLJ, but I respect RJ and find his enthusiasm to be infectious.)

    If it exists, I'd love to watch it too!
     
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  17. Kraven Head

    Kraven Head Rebelscum

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    Somewhere in 2013....

    Disney Exec #1: Hey let's go out and buy the most valuable film franchise in history, tell its creator thanks for the pointers but no thanks, start fresh with no plan in sight and just wing it movie by movie'"

    Disney Exec #2: Sounds like a 4 billion $ plan boss!
     
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  18. Veronica

    Veronica Rebel Commander

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    Except for the fact that they did use some of George's pointers. It was George's idea to make Luke a hermit and not Rian Johnson. It was George who initially came up with a female student (?) who went to the island to coax Luke out of retirement. It was George's idea to make a ST based on Anakin's grandkids--a boy and a girl. And that's exactly what we got.

    They probably got their idea from George Lucas. I mean he clearly admitted that the had no plan for the OT and looked out how well that worked out ;).
    --- Double Post Merged, Sep 17, 2020, Original Post Date: Sep 17, 2020 ---
    I don't buy that. There are too many hints dropped in TFA that hint at her being connected to Palpatine to have it been something that was tacked on as an afterthought in the last film.






    Now it might have been dropped in such a way that only astute viewers and fans could pick up on and it would be no big deal if another director wanted to go in another direction. But Rey was never going to a 'nobody'. She does not behave like a child of riff -raff. And Rian Johnson admitted that TLJ was not the final word on the subject.

    https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry...ter-all_n_5a39a21ee4b025f99e130e7f?ri18n=true

    Given her speech and mannerisms I was convinced that it would turn out that she the child of a disgraced politician or noble close who fell afoul of TFO or some other political entity (hey I was close!). But it was reading a posting from another fan that SW films have always been about two dueling families that it all just made sense.
     
  19. Use the Falchion

    Use the Falchion Force Sensitive

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    Not to invalidate this point (too much), but speculation over Rey's parentage was so rampant and multi-faceted, that people thought of EVERYTHING. To say that "only astute viewers thought of or considered this" is categorically untrue, as evidenced by the view count on the video you chose. People thought of it, considered it, and dismissed it due to it not lining up with different and equally as valid (at the time) speculation.




    I know you're joking here, so I won't say much, but this is always a pet peeve of mine. Just because a student aces a test without studying doesn't mean they should never study again. Just because Lucas was lucky - and he WAS lucky - with his method the first time doesn't mean that we should automatically repeat the process.

    Edit - Although this does make me think. How many people in the fanbase who like this twist like it because they predicted it instead of it being a solid twist? How many people hate it because they were wrong? No blame or accusations here, just thinking out loud...
     
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  20. RockyRoadHux

    RockyRoadHux Ginger General

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    I fairly disagree. It was all in the open,
    Abrams left the question deliberately unanswered, so that the other directors could do whatever they like with it. Claiming it was all mapped out and acting like a know it all while ignoring every fact that was brought up hinting she was meant to be a Nobody or Kenobi is silly.
     
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