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Many Bothans Died...

Discussion in 'Original Trilogy' started by Kibble, Sep 22, 2014.

  1. Kibble

    Kibble Rebelscum

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    At some point during or prior to the events of Return of the Jedi, as part of his evil plan to destroy the Rebel Alliance and turn Luke Skywalker to the dark side of the Force like his father, the Emperor let the Rebels get the technical readouts of the second Death Star. This event is not directly explained in the film, but we do know that for some reason during the event many "Bothans" died. I am wondering what you guys think "Bothans" were supposed to be!

    (If they were supposed to be anything in the first place, that is. And yes, I know they are some kind of horse-dog-man alien spy-race in the novels and stuff, but I am talking about the theatrical release of the Star Wars Original Trilogy)

    The first possibility I thought of (and probably the simplest) is just that the Bothans were just a group of people or aliens from a place called "Both" or "Bothia" or something, which might of been where the Rebel Alliance acquired the plan in some kind of destructive battle.

    The second (more interesting) possibility that I came up with has to do with the people present at the briefing room - there were plenty of human officials and pilots, plenty of fish-faced starship officers, one or two alien pilots, a few handsome roguish friends including a former smuggler, a princess, a young Jedi knight, a former business man, and a Wookie, and then a couple more aliens. These last aliens (my dad calls them Prune-face) are orange and wrinkled, and wear commando-looking clothes and gear, and a hooded cloak. It's definitely possible that these guys were supposed to be examples of the "Bothans", who in this case would appear to be a race of skilled infiltrators who might have managed to snag the data tapes after suffering many casualties (not knowing that they were meant to the whole time).

    There are definitely more possibilities based on subtle things I hadn't noticed, so I'll quit talking here.
     
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  2. DEKKA129

    DEKKA129 Professional Slinger of Balderdash

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    I always figured that it was another one of those evocative little throwaway lines that we always got in the OT, like Threepio's "sent to the spice mines of Kessel" line in ANH, Han's line about "the bounty hunter we ran into on Ord Mantell" in ESB, etc.

    Back in the day, before every last reference had to be wrung out into its own EU novel, these were the kinds of little touches that helped to make the world of Star Wars seem even more extensive and exotic than what we saw onscreen.

    I don't know that I ever really tried to work out exactly what a Bothan was (by the time ROTJ came out, I was getting to be more and more focused on figuring out how to get girls than on Star Wars) but I think I always figured that they were either an underground resistance cell that managed to steal copies of the new Death Star plans much as the first Death Star plans had been stolen, or that (as you mention) they were the inhabitants of the planet where the plans were kept and they helped the Rebels to break in and swipe the plans.

    What was interesting was, I never really thought of them as a specific race. They could have been human, they could have been nonhuman... I never really imagined what they were so much as what they had done.
     
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  3. Ceruleanlord

    Ceruleanlord Rebel General

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  4. Rebo

    Rebo Nearsighted Whill Guardian
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    I always imagined Bothans to resemble the French resistance of WW2. The Bothans were a race firmly entrenched in the empire, but fighting back through some sort of underground resistance, supplying aid and information to the rebellion where possible.

    But that was just my speculation back in the 80’s.
     
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  5. DEKKA129

    DEKKA129 Professional Slinger of Balderdash

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    That's about how I saw them too.
     
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  6. Kibble

    Kibble Rebelscum

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    Totes, that is one of the greatest things about Star Wars how you only see a little bit of the Galactic Empire, but with subtle implications, and like you said the throw-away lines really made you feel like the rest of the Galactic Empire really is there, its just we aren't seeing it. Verisimilitude! Its also one of the reasons the Prequels didn't feel as much like Star Wars movies, we shouldn't of seen the capitol or senate, or flown all over the place in the Galactic Empire, or seen the politics in (painfully boring) detail.
     
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  7. John Crichton

    John Crichton Rebel Official

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    I had always taken them as either a group specializing in intrigue, or a particular species that did likewise. In any case, I never had much doubt that they were working with the Rebellion given the look of utter loss Mon Mothma displayed as she said the words.

    In all honesty I never gave it much thought after that until I was "introduced" to them in some graphic novel. I feel like that was the graphic novel version of Shadows of the Empire, but I'm not 100% sure of that.

    Recently I looked at my collection of figures I purchased in the 90s. You can't imagine how many of the "no names" I found that I have sitting in there. Don't think I have this guy though.
     
  8. TrooperTK-421

    TrooperTK-421 Rebel Commander

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    My guess is they were either meant to be Force-sensitive beings who were masters of the 'get in, get out' approach, or they happened upon the Death Star plans by chance and in the process of getting the plans to the Rebels they happened to lose a great number.
     
  9. Ceruleanlord

    Ceruleanlord Rebel General

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    It was by the Emperor's design that the second Death Star plans fell into the alliance's hands, and the info that He would be there. It was to trap the Rebels to ultimately destroy them and lure Luke to be Vader's replacement. The Bothans were just another pawn in the Emperor's plan, the information they received was by design but many died to make it look like it wasn't.
     
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  10. Shawshank

    Shawshank Rebel General

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    I wish Bothans had been shown specifically in the PT so that Kibbles could deny their existence since it didn't happen in the original original original version of Star Wars.

    It would be entertaining...if they had done so, I can see this playing out:

    Kibbles: "Yeah but when Mon Mothma talked about the Bothans, we didn't see ANY of the aliens that portrayed them in the PT, so I'll just choose to ignore it as cannon because the PT is an abomination and I enjoy life by hating it and pretending that nothing but the original, original original versions is what Star Wars actually is."

    "How do you feel about Naboo, Kibbles?"

    "I don't know what you're talking about, because that was part of the PT and I choose to ignore it. It's my prerogative."

    Think I nailed it.


    P.S.-Good luck enjoying the ST. I'll be shocked if you and those that think like you do. Nothing personal, but man every post you make it some outlandish diatribe that wants to pretend nothing but the original movies exists, and you go out of your way to "prove it."
     
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  11. Kibble

    Kibble Rebelscum

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    Well sure Shawshank you are right, I don't like to discuss the Prequels because I think they are bad. I don't think its fun to talk about something you don't like. But there are other reasons I ignore them besides that! Firstly, there's not much to discuss about the Prequels at all, because they are so internally and externally inconsistent that analysis becomes pointless, especially concerning character motivation. Secondly, the point of this particular thread (and my other one) was discussion of the artist's intent, and different artists worked on the Originals than worked on the Prequels, so it would be unfair to use Prequel evidence to explain the intent of an Original artist.
     
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  12. Echo-07

    Echo-07 Rebel Official

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    LOL For someone who doesn't "like to discuss the PT" you do an awful lot of discussing and bashing the PT.
     
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  13. DEKKA129

    DEKKA129 Professional Slinger of Balderdash

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    To be fair, I also can't help but notice that Shawshank seems to have developed a bit of a tendency to openly bait Kibble about the fact that she doesn't like the PT. This isn't the first discussion in which this has occurred.
     
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  14. Pobody's Nerfect

    Pobody's Nerfect Jedi General

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    I always pictured the Bothans as an alien species, peaceful and wise. The intensity of Mon Mothra's pain seemed proportional to the tragedy she was reporting, so the Bothans must have been non-combatants for her to seem so stunned at their deaths.

    The scene set the tone for the coming battle. It gave us even more reason to root for the rebels by reminding us just how ruthless the Empire was.
     
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  15. DEKKA129

    DEKKA129 Professional Slinger of Balderdash

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    Y'know, now that you mention it, I remember having that same feeling when I first saw ROTJ long ago... that these were peaceful non-combatants who were killed for the sake of delivering the information about the new Death Star and the Emperor's presence on it.

    Good call! :)
     
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  16. Shawshank

    Shawshank Rebel General

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  17. Captain Sabalan

    Captain Sabalan Nerd Vigilante

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    I hope these "Bothans" will be explored more in the ST I didn't catch the ones they showed in ROTJ. I will have to look again
     
  18. Big Daddy Dave

    Big Daddy Dave Rebelscum

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    With race's like Ackbar's and Nien Nunb taking part in the rebellion in Jedi, I was picturing some kind of fishy looking aliens when Mothma mentions the Bothans that died to get them this critical information. Nothing else to base that off of, but that's what was in my 9 year old head in 1983.
     
  19. Shawshank

    Shawshank Rebel General

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    Ahem...

    1. Only after getting horribly frustrated when trying to have a conversation with someone that literally disregards anything that isn't the very original unaltered versions of the OT...pretty hard to not get annoyed.

    2. Um...sometimes whiskey logs into my account and posts for me... Chalk it up to earning a few PUIs on the board :confused:
     
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  20. DEKKA129

    DEKKA129 Professional Slinger of Balderdash

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    LOL! Yeah, recreational intoxicants do have a knack of taking over just a wee bit when we're not keeping a close eye on 'em, don't they? ;)
     
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