Official Finn Episode VIII thread

Han's role in RotJ certainly IS criticized quite a bit. Even Harrison Ford himself said several times he felt Han should have died, as it would have given more weight to his character's journey.

Still, at the end of the day, he was an important Rebel General, his unconventionnal and cunning tactics were decisive in the battle of Endor, and was part of the main romance.
It was also much easier to give him a pass, as Han had much more going for him before that point : he saved both Luke & Leia twice, had many cool moments, a better and cooler characterisation, a cool ship...

In comparaison, Finn got janitor jokes and leaking Bacta suit, and caused the near anihilation of the Resistance and Luke's death. (let's not even mention the reason for that)
"Worse", TLJ even made a point to show us how BB-8 was both more useful AND more badass on the field (while Finn's tricks can't even fool enemy BB units).
If i had to chose between "an army of Finns" and "an army of BB-8s", based on TLJ, the BB-8s would win...

 

Just out of curiosity (so no wrong answers) what exactly does Finn do in TLJ that postures him now to be a hero? I'm assuming it's more than just joining the Resistance... or is that a bad assumption?
Finn will have a leadership role - why? Is it just that there's no one else around to be a leader?

I know why Rey will be the Jedi from TLJ, and I know why Poe will be the leader from TLJ, I see nothing in TLJ that has says Finn will be a leader or a hero. During his speech to Kylo, Luke seems to allude only what we already know, Finn is now a part of the rebellion. What specifically is telling you he will also be a leader and a hero?

 

Very cunning....

Finn is already a hero for before The Last Jedi. He's famous for leaving the First Order and helping blow up Starkiller Base. Finn choses sides in The Last Jedi, kills Captain Phasma, and by the end of the film he's one of the people who will lead the rebellion.

 

Ok I think we may agree, Finn was certainly viewed as a hero in TFA (based on stories not necessarily fact), but we the audience can say he was a hero because we see his actions on SKB in an attempt to save someone other than himself. I don't see an equivalent set of actions for Finn in TLJ or a reason to project he will be (future tense) a hero in EPIX.

Based on your last line I take it that , he will indeed be a leader in the rebellion, because there's just no one else.

Equivalently Rose will also be a leader, for the same reason

 

And what's the consequence of that choice ?

Because he chose to stay, the Battle of Crait happened, Luke Skywalker died, as well as 90 % of the Resistance.

Why should we even be happy he did not succesfully run away ?

 

There's the speech he does in TLJ, to lift everyone's spirits when they see the canon arrive on Crait. The one when he talks about they need to delay the FO until reinforcements arrive, that the Galaxy believes in Leia, and all that. Basically motivating everybody.

According to the novel, this is also when Rose falls in love for him.

 

I'm not seeing this connection at all. Because Finn chose to stay Luke died? This doesn't make sense.

He helped the Resistance blow up SKB. Not sure what you mean by "not necessarily fact."

Agree to disagree I guess. Finn is a large part of the Battle of Crait and the survival of the Rebellion.

 

Oh, it's definitely stupid. But unfortunately, that's the very plot of TLJ. The Battle of Crait only happened because of DJ's betrayal.

So had Finn escaped, there would be no Canto Bight, no DJ, and thus no Battle of Crait.

Q.E.D.

 

These kind of "alternate timeline" theories may be interesting, but that doesn't define Finn or change the conclusion that he's a hero/leader in the new Rebellion.

 

That's how Finn's contribution to TLJ's main plot is defined : he stayed and his actions caused the Battle of Crait. That's alll in the movie.

 

Let's be clear, you define Finn's contribution in this manner. We'll agree to disagree I guess, but the perception for Rebellion and their sympathizers is Finn a hero for leaving the First Order, the destruction of Starkiller Base, and for the last stand at the Battle of Crait.

 

Too bad they couldn't do anything for him. Like have an idea from what part of the galaxy the FO took children from. Being called a hero is fine , but it would be better if he could be called by his real name. Rose is selfish. She only so called loves him for what he is doing for them. What have they given Finn?

 

Medical treatment.

 

Freedom to choose his own path, a family, a reason to fight, and a cause in which to believe.

 

He came to save Rey, not the Resistance. I consider him heroic for what he did for Rey. He faced certain death and the embodiment of the FO to save Rey in the forest against Kylo, that was heroic. His contribution to the destruction of SKB was minimal; unless you give him credit for singlehandedly lowering the shields (which he did not, he, Han and Chewie ambushed Phasma). It's Han that circumvents the shields to get them on the planet, and Han and Chewie that plant the bombs, Poe destroys the thermal oscillator.

I'm fine to agree to disagree here too. Finn is part of the reason there WAS a Battle of Crait, there was just supposed to be a clandestine, undetected escape to Crait. The failed Canto Bight mission turned it into the slaughter on the way to Crait and then the Battle of Crait. And the Resistance definitively loses this battle (because they are severely out gunned - no one should have expected them to win under these conditions). None of the people piloting the skimmers did anything to delay the deployment of the Ram canon. Finn was going to, Rose stopped him. The ones who contribute to the survival of the Resistance was Luke (for giving them time), Poe (for realizing Luke was stalling and figuring out to follow the crystal foxes to find an escape), and Rey (for bringing escape vehicle and opening a way).

 

It's interesting that you're blaming Finn for the Battle of Crait, but giving Poe credit even though he's more responsible for DJ betrayal. It was Poe who leaked the information about the Crait plan.

This is a matter of opinion. The skimmers we to buy time to send the signal. The signal was sent.

 

I think the phrase I used was "Finn is part of the reason there WAS a Battle of Crait". Poe is also part of the reason there was a battle of Crait (I do not absolve him at all, or Rose for that matter. Everyone who was part of the mission is partly responsible. But this is the Finn thread, and my inquiry was about what exactly made Finn a hero, other than people asserting it.)

Not sure that I agree that this is a matter of opinion, they do not slow the advance of the Walkers or the Canon. Poe calls off the attack because their counter offensive is completely ineffective. Even with the TIE fighters drawn off, the skimmers are picked off mercilessly by the Walkers. The only thing delaying the deployment of the cannon is the speed of the cannon itself to get into position and warm up. Out of curiosity, how does the signal even factor into this? No one answers their call for help.

 

I think Finn's future lies in the custodial arts. He has the experience so should play to his strengths.

 

The skimmers plan was to buy time for the signal to be sent out. The signal went out and no one responded. So the plan worked in terms of getting the signal out. Luke then saves the day giving them time to escape.

 

Finn's plan was to buy time by taking out the cannon : his line is (and the movie) was more than explicit about that. (the Resistance didn't just need to send a signal, but to hold until help could arrive on site)

The speeeder attack was completely inconsequential in slowing down the FO : the cannon & AT-M6 were still advancing during the battle.

Like most of Finn's choices, his decision to rally the troops and launch the speeder attack (or sacrifice himself) : all of that was completely useless and irrelevant. Finn did not affect the outcome.
(and even if it worked : saving the last 10% of the Resistance doesn't make up for causing the destruction of the remaining 90%)