SPECULATION OFFICIAL Kylo Ren Discussion Thread

Mrs Whiskerson ‏@gobbolino_twc 11 h
@pablohidalgo [...] Is the thing about Kylo being a focal point for light & dark not accurate then (from the novelisation)?

Pablo Hidalgo ‏@pablohidalgo 11 h
@gobbolino_twc That was in the script too. I guess we'll see where that goes.

 

I don't think that Kylo was planning to kill Han on that bridge, it's pretty clear that he's conflicted, but I certainly think that line is a reference to killing Han. At that moment he thinks what he has to do is kill his father, that was tasked to him by Snoke, a test of his commitment to the path he chose. The dialogue matches the intent:

Kylo: I know what I have to do but I don't know if I have the strength to do it. Will you help me?

Han: Yes, anything.

*Cue stabbing*

Kylo: Thank you.

Now obviously Han thinks that Kylo is referring to leaving the FO when he says that first line but we know he's referring to killing Han, to discarding his family. Something he hopes will free him from his conflicted feelings, his weakness. Did Kylo plan to kill Han on that bridge? No, he was struggling to commit to that dark act right until the final moment.

 

It probably has been brought up somewhere in here, but I failed to come up with a matching search.
Is there somewhere stated if Kylo Ren knows that Vader killed the emperor and turned away from the dark?
I watched the movie several times and read the script but I can't find a hint that he knows of Vaders fate.
Actually we don't know if past VI much is known of the role of Luke and Vader.

 

from the TFA novelization, we find out that Ren knows that Vader succumbed to "compassion".
we can perhaps assume that means he knows that Vader died saving Luke, but the details aren't spelled out.
the feeling you get is that Snoke has told him what happened, but spun it in a way to suggest Vader had a moment of weakness (instead of strength), and that was his undoing.

it's clear from Bloodline, also, that the galaxy at large has no idea any of this happened: Luke is somewhat of an unsung hero and Vader is a monster.

 

I'm pretty close to order Bloodline. Thanks, I would give you a +1 but I have to finish this post first.

 

if you haven't read the Alan Dean Foster book, i would recommend it too. it's not a masterpiece, but it does have some interesting things about the characters that are worth considering in the big picture. Bloodline is great, though if you are looking specifically for more info about Kylo Ren prepared to be somewhat frustrated by Ben Solo's almost absence in the narrative ~ hahahaha

 

i try to project into that far-off future when all the secrets will have been revealed and we can just move forward again.
i feel like we're totally stuck in a spin cycle right now.
i am ever-amused by the burgeoning head-canon out there, but it's a runaway train that's going to hit hard for some people ~ hahaha.

 

I'm still waiting for the paperback of life dept which will be released March 23. I wonder why ebooks are still more expensive than paperbacks.

 

They just should add the ebook to the hardcover, sell a cheaper ebook along and reduce the price to the one of the Paperback when it is released

 

He really cherishes grandaddy's mask

 

This has been bothering me: If Kylo's "deepest, darkest secret" is that he is afraid of not being as strong as Vader, that seems like something he would want to hide from Snoke. So my questions are: does Snoke know Kylo's fear? Rey was able to discover it with incredible ease. Was Kylo's guard down in his search for the map? If Snoke does not know, does that make Rey stronger than Snoke?

This matter has most likely been raised before, but I cannot find discussion for it...

 

I think the fact that Rey tapped in to Kylo Ren's deepest fear is that his guard was pretty much down...that is symbolized by taking off his helmet. And as with the light saber fight with Rey, he was overconfident and did not realize how vulnerable he was. But I don't think it was incredibly easy for Rey--she looked like she was working pretty hard to get there. My personal head canon is that while Kylo Ren was blithely messing around in Rey's head, she was learning a great many of his own Force tricks and via those was able to get past whatever flimsy token guard he still had up against her.

As for Snoke, he's probably got enough evil psychological holds on Ren to control him pretty well without having to know all his fears. Ren is pretty transparent about a lot of things anyway ("He means nothing to me"--riiiiiight) so IMO it wouldn't take much work from his twisted mind to get to Ren's deepest fears if he put in the effort.

 

just to add to what @Choose Light said: Snoke either doesn't care or already knows. Ren is an unreliable source of information. when he says "Supreme Leader senses [his conflict]", what he really means is: Snoke knows i'm drowning but I can't admit that even to myself because the implications are too hideous to deal with.

Snoke, for his part, like @Choose Light implied, could very well be overconfident in terms of dealing with Ren's struggle and is deliberately dismissing it at the moment. in the scene in which he sets forth the challenge, listen to the cruel mirth in his tone. he's messing with this kid and doesn't think Ren has two brain cells to think for himself. we, however, have numerous hints otherwise. : D

 

Thanks for replying, @Choose Light and @FN-3263827 ! You both addressed aspects of Snoke's character that I had missed. And that helmet symbolism!

It's been quite a while, but this film still intrigues me.

 

But Snoke knows ...

There has been an awakening, have you felt it ? Yes.

...

The call to the light, Supreme leader senses it ...

This is what Snoke is talking about, the awakening happened IN Kylo Ren.

 

It's something that intetests me too. We don't as yet know how much Ben/kylo knows about his Grandfather or his Uncle's history. It would depend on how much his mother and father revealed to him as a child. My suspicions are that Snoke has given him a very distorted and untrue version of events. It would seem obvious to me that he would want to blame Luke for vader's death (which is true from a certain point of view). It would interest me if he knew anything of the Emperor. Kylo seems to view Vader as if he were on a pedestal. Maybe he thinks Vader lead the Empire?

 

What I wonder is what is kylo reffering to when he wows to finish what his grandfather started? What was the last thing Vader started?

 

I always assumed it was the whole ruling the galaxy thing. but based on Kylo Ren's action's in film, and also based on his data bank profile online it seems he's only interested in exterminating the Jedi as that would bring some balance to the force, by leaving him, Kylo Ren, as the last Jedi/force user. That was apparantly also vaders plan...go check Kylo Ren's Data Bank profile and it says it several times on that site. also the name 'Jedi Killer' hints to that being his main motive. as well as his interaction with Hux, where Hux accues Ren's personal interests in finding Luke Skywalker with potentially jepodising their mission from Snoke.