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"Random" Rey.....

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Last Jedi' started by Lock_S_Foils, Dec 26, 2017.

  1. Lock_S_Foils

    Lock_S_Foils Red Leader

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    One of the most interesting things to come out of TLJ is the "Rey is a random" motif.

    A lot of people are apparently not happy about this. Frankly I love it and think it is one of RJ's best decisions. Just a couple questions on this:

    1. If you are irritated at "Rey is a random", then what theory of the force do you believe in? That it is only genetically passed on?

    2. Was Obi-Wan "random"? Were his parent(s) or other ancestors especially force-sensitive? How about Qui-Gonn? Mace? Other human Jedis?

    3. Is this genetic vs random thing only for humans? What about Jedi/force sensitive of other beings in the Universe?
     
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  2. Messi

    Messi G.O.A.T.

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    A slave...
    A farmer...
    A scavenger...

    Perfect arc. Simple as that.
     
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  3. Darth Lunya

    Darth Lunya Rebel General

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    Keep in mind that Rey's parents being nobodies answers none of the many questions raised in TFA and that's what many people are frustrated about.

    - Why did Luke's/Anakins lightsaber specifically call to Rey?

    - How does Rey know how to use force powers, beyond that of fully trained Jedi Masters, when she is totally untrained?

    - Why does Obi-Wan specifically call Rey's name in her forceback?

    - Why does Rey have the same accent as Obi-Wan?

    So many questions were raised in TFA and frustratingly nothing was answered, Rey's parents being just one of those things.

    Also, before you say that people aren't happy at the type of answers they got, I think it's more a case of the lack of answers.

    You must remember that Star Wars fans have favourite characters from past episodes, characters they feel a strong connection to and Rey's parents could have been any of them. It's not a matter of genetics but instead nostalgia.

    The reoccurring theme in TLJ about killing the past, just kill it, it doesn't matter. This is my biggest problem with TLJ. Where has this notion about killing 40 years worth of tradition come from? I can't relate. Every opportunity to connect the film to past characters was missed and thats because past SW fans didn't matter in this film. We don't matter. All that matters to Disney is Money. Even though Disney has it in abundance.

    Tradition means nothing to them.
     
    #3 Darth Lunya, Dec 26, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2017
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  4. DailyPlunge

    DailyPlunge Coramoor

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    - Where is it stated that a kyber crystal only calls to relatives?

    - She's an awakening in the force and a quick learner. She defeats a severely wounded Kylo Ren who was attempting to turn her.

    - Obi-Wan is a force ghost. There were other voices as well.

    - Rey's core world accent could have many explanations unrelated to Obi-Wan.
     
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  5. Darth Lunya

    Darth Lunya Rebel General

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    Oh great post, this answers all of the questions raised in TFA. Thank you so much for your reply. Jeez guys what were we getting so frustrated about, it's all clearly answered right here in the cantina by @DailyPlunge. Fantastic.
     
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  6. Aglarion

    Aglarion Force Sensitive

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    Where did you get the idea that people think that "the force is only genetically passed on"? I never heard of that theory.
    Force sensitive people can be born from non force sensitive people, this is nothing new.
     
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  7. Lock_S_Foils

    Lock_S_Foils Red Leader

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    Then what exactly does the "Rey is a random" statement mean then? So what, she's a "random", whatever that means.....
     
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  8. Aglarion

    Aglarion Force Sensitive

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    The complains about Rey being a random I have heard are based on the following points:
    They wanted Rey to be a Skywalker because of family dynamics, or because they wanted a good Skywalker to carry on the family legacy, or because they expected her to be a Skywalker as this was teased both in the previous movie and in interviews.
    In my case I expected her to be a Skylwaker or being born from the force like Anakin because of her extraordinary abilities with the force. It's a matter of consistency, if we are shown that Anakin who had more potential that any other jedi, even more force sensitive than master Yoda, had that particular extraordinary origin, then you can't just make Rey the most powerful jedi ever with no explanation whatsoever.
     
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  9. Longstar

    Longstar Rebelscum

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    IMO in TFA Maz makes it perfectly clear that Reys parentage wasnt of importance. "Your family arent coming back" her place in the story and galaxy has nothing to do with her past. Noone in TFA ever asks about Reys parents, they simply ask "who are YOU?" I think theres a lack of answers to pointless questions us fans wanted answers to that ultimately didnt matter

    I think Steele Saunders said it best, the only main question in TFA is where is Luke Skywalker? and when we found him the question becomes why is he there? Those questions are answered and then some in TLJ
     
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  10. BaranDo91

    BaranDo91 Rebelscum

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    Let me be honest; I didn't care that much about Rey. Ridley did a great job, acting wise, but the character in TFA was bland from a story perspective. That said, I liked Rey a lot more in TLJ. She isn't my favorite still and I do have issues with her character and whether or not she is a Mary Sue(a term I do not use lightly. Ask me if you are curious).

    As for who she is, I like the reveal in concept, but the execution I found was shotty. And note to avoid sounding like a critical jerk I will give a suggestion that works within the confines of the story. For starters, it adds a great sense of tragedy for Rey.

    Being stranded on a planet and wondering who she is, I can appreciate that element, as Maz's words in my view have a lot deeper meaning. It also adds to the theme of the movie to where legacies can be weights on one's shoulders and individuals need to find their own way. Which I can dig. The issue I have is that it does NOT explain why she's powerful. The movie attempts to do this by saying that Kylo and Rey are Yin and Yang to where when one got stronger, the other does so. A cool idea, but basically reinforces my issue with Rey's power; it was given to her and she did NOT have to work for it. Had we seen her loose to Kylo Ren in one duel, I could buy this explanation but really she didn't lose anything and suffer any consequences.


    So, given that I have probably pissed off a few people and thrown some shade, what would I do? Basically, I'd have the same reveal BUT add one bit. Kylo says she was found/ adopted by those junkers. Why this element? Rey did state she was familiar with the island of Ach-too? That in of itself would be a cool carryover in Episode Nine. Namely, to where Rey's folks perhaps discovered her on Ach-too and she is revealed to be a part of the First Jedi temple through some bloodline. Or it could be something else. Either way, Rian Johnson should have given some more breadcrumbs to this element.

    For real, in my view, much as I like Rey a lot more in TLJ than TFA: I still think she is a Mary Sue. And note I do NOT use that term so flippantly. For I have my own reasons why.
     
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  11. LarsSkywalker

    LarsSkywalker Rebel Official

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    We just got young broom boy who can already force grab objects. It's quite obvious that the Force is evolving.
     
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  12. Lock_S_Foils

    Lock_S_Foils Red Leader

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    Yoda would say...."Heh....think you understand the force, do you?....Heh....Very mysterious the force is.......always changing it is. Not possible to completely understand it is......backwards talking I am getting sick of....."
     
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  13. Unseen

    Unseen Rebel Official

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    But, in TLJ the question becomes “who are my parents?”

    If it wasn’t meant to be important, if the answer was given by maz, then why is it such a big question in the new film?

    Why tease it out, even showing a Leia-looking silhouette in the cave?

    Why did Rey go from “my family is coming back” to inexplicably giving up on Jakku and going to ach to to then changing her focus to “who are my parents »?

    TFA was clearly written without the trilogy planned out.

    Rian not only ignored huge elements of TFA, but also used some aspects to manipulate and ‘gotcha!’ the audience.

    Even if you like TLJ, you have to admit these things.

    And I like Rian.

    But he leaned a lot on manipulating and tricking the audience.

    Unfortunately, folks have confused this with being original.


    ** Also, I really beleive one day we will learn that TFA originally revealed Rey as a solo.

    There were scenes cut- there had to have been.

    It’s the only thing that explains stuff like

    ‘What Girl?!?’

    The Leia hug. Why would Leia hug a stranger over chewie???

    Rey giving up on going back to Jakku, which is literally all she wanted the entire film, to go to Luke.


    Etc.


    I really think one day we’ll learn of cut TFA scenes explaining Rey as a solo.
     
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  14. Lock_S_Foils

    Lock_S_Foils Red Leader

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    I love your energy, but, really have to ask you something? Can you explain, coherently, what "Not Rey is not Rey Rey" means?
     
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  15. techsteveo

    techsteveo Force Sensitive

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    1.Not irritated. I just would have preferred she be a Skywalker since it would make the saber calling to her make more sense. Add the fact that she force pulled the saber and it went to her and not Kylo when he tried at the end of TFA.
    2. We can’t answer this question.
    3. I don’t believe it’s ONLY genetic just like it’s not ONLY random. Some bloodlines like the Skywalkers seem to have each offspring pass on their powers. However, it could also be true that a force sensitive child would have non force sensitive children and vice versa.

    Many keep bringing up “why is Rey, who is a random, so powerful with no training?”.

    The in-universe answer is the force awakened in her as the equal to Ben Solo in order to achieve balance. She knew of the Jedi and some of the things they could do. She listened to Maz and let the light it, then the force helped control her actions to defeat a wounded and unbalqnced Kylo Ren. In TLJ she tells Luke the force is a power that controls people and makes things float. It’s funny because that’s all she has ever used the force for. Mind trick and floating the lightsaber to her. I’m guessing with someone who is supposed to be as powerful as her, these are not complicated force tricks.

    The out of universe answer is simply they did not want to take the time to setup this character since there were no other light side force users in TFA. In ANH, you had Obi-Wan so Luke didn’t need to use a lightsaber, etc. In TFA, Han played the Obi-Wan role as the one to send the heroes on their journey. Han wasn’t going to weild a saber so they needed to accelerate Rey’s character into that role. Bottom line, they don’t think the movie going audience cares that much so they aren’t going to write training scenes to explain her powers when they can have stuff blowing up or force-time calls between Rey and Kylo.
     
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  16. Pobody's Nerfect

    Pobody's Nerfect Jedi Commander

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    This is how I think of it -

    There was an ancient prophecy and a bloodline of destiny. It was a good story arc but it's been told in depth already, and that chapter of the saga is done. Anakin brought balance to the Force, prophecy was fulfilled, bloodline reached its destiny, nothing more about the Skywalker story to explore.

    But that doesn't mean the Force is finished. As Luke explained to Rey, the Force provides the connection and the tension between all living things. The Force belongs to everybody, not just those who can manipulate it. The Jedi were vain to believe the Force "belonged" to them. So were the Sith.

    Rey being a nobody is the culmination of this idea. The Force may have used the Skywalker bloodline to bring itself back into balance once, but that doesn't mean the Force needs a Skywalker to keep the cycle of birth and death, peace and violence, growth and decay, or light and dark going.

    The Force is bigger than the dogma of the Sith or the Jedi.

    Think about this: If inheritance by birthright is so important then Kylo Ren should have the Falcon and Luke's lightsaber. Instead the Force put them in the hands of a nobody.
     
  17. Trokanmariel

    Trokanmariel Clone Trooper

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    It was just part of the practical process. The outcome seems right though
     
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  18. Sparafucile

    Sparafucile Guest

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    I have no issue with Rey being powerful in the force or being a random. I have an issue with her not ever having an example of a mind trick, yet not only knowing it's possible, but using it herself without any training.

    Rey could be the most powerful Jedi of all time and I'd be okay with it. It's a new story, so she can be what ever the creative team wants her to be. She can even train herself with the books and become the most skilled Jedi of all time. I'd be fine with that too. I'm just not fine with someone who barely knew the force existed being able to use force skills without even knowing those skills are even a possibility.

    I suppose the force could have given her knowledge of the ability, but if that was the case, JJ should have shown the viewers that the force was "speaking" to her. He didn't, and nor did RJ, therefor she's a Mary Sue in at least one way, she knows what the viewers know without any in story development.

    Even her skill with a lightsaber is over done. Luke had a year or so between ANH and ESB and still got schooled. then he had another 3 years before ROTJ. Even then, he tapped into the dark side to defeat Vader by letting out his anger and fear for his sister. He just barely managed to resist the temptation, but the consequence was he had to stop fighting and trust in another. Rey doesn't need to trust in anyone (don't hold my hand) since she can do everything and anything within the limits of the force and most probably beyond if the writer choose so. She's kind of like early Superman, where when writer cornered themselves, they'd just add a power to him. The difference was Superman had very little in the way of cannon to follow, Rey has 6 movies and more in books and games. Early Superman is a joke, but it helped him evolve into what he is today, after many remakes and retooling of the characters back story. Rey, being within the SW saga's cannon, doesn't have that opportunity to be retooled. We have a near perfect character with no explanation for her perfection as of yet.

    Based on the writing I've seen in TLJ, I'm not holding much hope that her abilities will ever be properly explained. Viewers are simply supposed to just accept she can do anything. I can't, many other fans can't. Congrats if you can, but you probably won't enjoy it when a bigger minority has more powers than Rey without the backstory too, because trust me, Rey won't stay on top of the power pile for ever... she's white and thin after all.
     
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  19. Paladinryan

    Paladinryan Rebel General

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    The Force has nothing to do with it. This is supposed to be a family saga focusing on the Skywalkers. Force spirituality is secondary to that, as Episodes 1-7 made clear with all the family drama. I've also been a fan of Finn being Force Sensitive. Rey can be a Skywalker and there can still be room for the Force to choose her and other people to be powerful. Two are not mutually exclusive.

    Irrelevant comparison, since Obi-Wan was never the main protagonist the way Anakin, Luke, and now Rey are. He was always secondary. Having a non-Skywalker main protagonist in Episodes 7-9 after having a main Skywalker protagonist in Episodes 1-6 makes no sense and makes me less interested in the films as a result. It seems like Disney just gave these movies episode numbers as a cash grab. At least Rogue One was good, though.

    Not sure what the point of your third question is.
     
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  20. Jedi MD

    Jedi MD Jedi Commander

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    It was pretty obvious to me that Rey picked up how to do the mind trick from Kylo when he entered her mind and was probing around and while fighting it,l reversed it in him
     
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