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SPECULATION Rebels S03 will take our understanding of the force to a new level

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Rebels' started by Star Dude, Aug 30, 2016.

  1. Lord of the Rens

    Lord of the Rens Gatekeeper & Avatar Maker

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    I'd bet on Darth Kreia before Mother Talzin.
     
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  2. Star Dude

    Star Dude Jedi General

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    Well, that would make up for a very intriguing option indeed!
     
  3. Star Dude

    Star Dude Jedi General

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    I’ve to admit that the discussion as found in the article below gave me quite some different angle of vision on some things. Thanks to the guys @Viral Hide, @Rieekan, @Hard Case, @DEKKA129, @Rebo for taking me on the road to enlightenment!

    http://www.starwarsnewsnet.com/2016/09/swnn-staff-round-table-a-discussion-on-the-nature-of-the-force.html

    What I was too dumb to fully understand back then, was how the balance in the force could be re-established by having the chosen one wipe them Sith out, all of them. In my childish mind, a balance would be there if having equal parts of opposite things on a scale, like 2 Jedi vs. 2 Sith.

    For me, the analogy of the force behaving like a stream of water struck home. The Jedi, in their original philosophy, let the force flow as it was its natural “intention”. Then came the Sith, corrupting the natural force flow for their own good, like an abnormal, festering decease. They changed the force flow for their selfish cravings from a gentle meandering river by damming, re-routing and canalizing it on a micro and macro scale, causing all kinds of damaging side effects to the galaxy and themselves.

    Thus bringing balance to the force was to be understood more like a healing of its natural way, removing the Sith ulcer from it.

    Combining this with what the Bendu says, the force just is, you bring light or dark to it. I don’t think that there is a really a classic grey area the Jedi will dive into, mixing light and dark side teachings. Ultimately, tapping into the dark side will unbalance the force and make the person and the force around him “sick” again. But I recognize the use of force powers like the choke not as evil per se, depending on the context.

    In regards to that, the posts from Pablo give me some new input: As I understand them, by the end of the old republic, even the Jedi have removed themselves from the pure, natural flow of the force and have become a bureaucratic order way to static and detached from it. With their moraband moribund ways to teach and use the force, the late Jedi cut themselves of the possibility to listen and learn to the full potential from the force, facilitating the Sith on their way to stay hidden and in the end, let the Sith plans come to full fruition.

    I think Luke, with the help of Yoda’s and Obi-Wan’s ghosts, will come to the conclusion that a future Jedi order should be more earth-bound and in-tune with the force, not to become ensnared in its own procedures and aloof of the force whispers. A back-to-the roots approach so to say (see Anch-To & the first Jedi temple).

    From this perspective, it seems that Qui-Gon was one of the few recognizing this circumstance, thus removing himself from the council and it’s structure more and more, instead seeking out the teachings of other force wielders to get back to the original teachings in tune with the force again. And the end result of his findings while following this path speak for themselves.

    Yoda just realized this too late to save the order (in combination with all the other factors of course), but got back to the original philosophy in-time to learn what Qui-Gon has to teach and tutor Luke.

    Actually, I personally wouldn’t call this path “grey” as this includes in the classical (EU) sense the use of both the dark and the light side. And I don’t think the dark side will be part of this “back-to-nature” trend the surviving Jedi follow.

    For me it’s more like re-discovering the true essence of the nature of the force (which seems to be more neutral then a clear black or white), and then don’t deviate to much from it. Thus “grey” in a term fits to a certain degree, but without mixing really dark side cravings and Sith teaching with it!

    Or it’s just a new fancy color for old, worn Jedi robes when staying with the first temple. Also not talking to much seems a trait developing with the new philosophy of the Jedi order.

    Getting back to Rebels, I wonder were Kanan and Ezra will fit into this retro development of the Jedi order. But ‘Disruptive Transformation’ seems to be the key word both for our future earthly business models as well as for Jedi/Sith orders from a galaxy far far away.
    --- Double Post Merged, Sep 21, 2016, Original Post Date: Sep 21, 2016 ---

    As I keep thinking about this topic, I guess the evolution for a new, naturalist and much more laid-back Jedi order will just be a matter of time!

    dude_02.jpg dude_03.jpg

    They will most probably…

    • stick with the dress code, maybe making it even more bathrobe-like.
    • getting even more pacifistic.
    • playing more New-Age music in the temples and training halls.
    • introduce force bowling for stress relaxation and as a universal answer to everything.
    • adding special herb lore and consumption for mind enhancement techniques during training and for spare time.
    • banning ”Black Russians”, only ‘White Russians” are allowed and mandatory at least three times a day to evoke a certain mental state.

    [I’m really sorry guys, but I couldn’t resist this. Forgive me. I feel it again... The pull to the dude side]
     
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  4. DEKKA129

    DEKKA129 Professional Slinger of Balderdash

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    Well... DEKKA129 abides, man. ;)
     
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  5. Darth Sploder

    Darth Sploder Rebel Commander

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    "Hell of a force choke Jackie."
     
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  6. Lazlo

    Lazlo Rebel Official

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    We saw the light side of the Bendu in the premier, but I am betting that this means we still have the dark side to contend with...
     
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  7. Star Dude

    Star Dude Jedi General

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    Yeah, that was an interesting one!

    I’m not sure if it really was some light side thing, or just a helping hand to Kanan to get him back to balance. The Bendu was nice, but did he do exactly anything light, or just getting Kanan back on track to accept his blindness, trust himself and the force again?

    What I found most intriguing is where the Sith holocron went. Kanan beliefs it to be save with the Bendu, but we all know from the trailers were it will end up – with Ezra and Maul again to be mated with the Jedi one.

    So therefore we will meet the Bendu again. But I don’t think he (it?) will do anything strongly biased to the Ashla or Bogan (hah, how I loved to hear that old saying again!), but stay in the balanced middle ground of this duality.

    I really enjoy the fact, that they take the freedom to delve deeper into the different aspects of the greater force lore. The underlying mysticism was always one thing that made Star Wars so great and enjoyable to us.
     
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  8. Star Dude

    Star Dude Jedi General

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    Naturally, Maul wants to get hold of the Sith Holocron again, but then he discovers the Jedi Holocron on his way. Is he planning to use it as exchange currency to get the Sith one back? Or does he plan to merge the holocrons right away after obtaining the Jedi one?

    Also interesting to note is that Maul is able to use the Mind read technique as practiced also by Kylo Ren. I cannot remember anybody else showing that ability so far in the OT and PT (I might be mistaken though).

    And how will they (who?) will get the Sith Holocron back from The Bendu? I assume that the Bendu will only do this by his own will, not forced by someone. It might happen in the scene when both Kanan and Ezra are meeting up with him again.

    Although it might quite be very interesting to see what would happen if Maul and the Bendu meet.
     
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  9. alex

    alex Rebel Official

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    1) Vader uses it on Luke to learn about Leia. Luke and Leia, and Vader with Luke can straight up talk to each other from a distance. In clone wars a group of jedi work together to force mind read a dude.

    2) I think he might. Seems like the easiest way for him to get it back from the Bendu. Either that or he threatens Hera's life and forces Kanan to give it to him, which, now that I think about it, is a lot more likely.
     
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  10. Star Dude

    Star Dude Jedi General

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    1) I thought so but for me it always looked a bit different with Vader doing it from afar and more or less reading the emotions of Luke, while the other guys more forcefully “lay hands” on the minds and squeeze all knowledge out, regardless of what the topic or relation was. Vader’s version seems more “gentle” in comparison and more emotion that fact driven.

    2) I would love to see what would happen, “old master” Maul vs. “the rock” Bendu. Who would go down in round three me thinks?! ;)


    By the way the “problem” with the Bendu is, that he (it?) is neutral. At least when looking at the excerpts about these damn neutrals from one of the wised, none-green persons in the galaxy (but of course he’s got a green adjutant):

    "What makes a good man go neutral? Lust for gold? Power? Or were you just born with a heart full of neutrality?"
    “I hate these filthy Neutrals, Kif. With enemies you know where they stand but with Neutrals, who knows? It sickens me.”
    zapp.jpg
     
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  11. Star Dude

    Star Dude Jedi General

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    Episode 03 / Bendu’s saying on uniting the two Holocrons:


    1) “They will grant a clarity of vision beyond your kind.“
    2) “When joined, any secrets, wisdom or destiny can be seen through the force. One could bring much chaos with such hidden truths.”
    3) “I have seen it before”
    4) “Do what you must, but such power comes with a price”

    1) Does this refer only to the persons of Maul, Kanan and Ezra or the separated Jedi and Sith orders as a whole? If yes, each single order then sees only part of the big (force) picture. Thinking about it, to really advance in the understanding of the force, one have to go beyond the teachings of even the Jedi order as there is wisdom beyond to be gained. I wonder if Ashoka or even Luke since TFA are on this road. I guess that at least Snoke has found out, that when combining the light and the dark side, you can become more powerful than most can possibly imagine.

    2) Vader secures Jedi Holocrons after the fall of Grakkus, from the Hutt’s Jedi treasure grove. Did Vader or Palpatine ever considered joining them with some Sith Holocrons already in their collection? I assume that such a powerfull Sith such as Darth Sidious, pupil of the great Darth Plagueis, will have at least one Sith Holocron in his possession. Or would even Palpatine be reluctant because of the grave danger this might bring?

    3) I’ve wondered to what galactic event(s) from the past Bendu relates to. Did a Jedi or Sith tried this before, and what was the outcome?

    So Bendu is helping Ezra and Kanan to rediscover their balance as master and apprentice. He seems quite satisfied at the point the conflict was ended and perhaps balance restored. I can’t help to see him doing positives things then staying neutral, as this balance strengthens the light side.

    All in all, with the last episode, the trip on the road to greater understanding of the force continues, well done!
     
  12. Star Dude

    Star Dude Jedi General

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    #32 Star Dude, Oct 10, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2016
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  13. Jayardia

    Jayardia Rebel Official

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    I like it. It leaves plenty to ponder for Ahsoka fans.

    ...and because of such references, we can clearly expect something tremendous from Ahsoka in the future. (I suppose such tremendous action *may* also coincide with/ or require her corporeal death.)

    It's interesting stuff.
     
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  14. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

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    What we didn't see in TFA:

    - Rey hands Luke the saber.

    - He stares at her with glassy eyes.

    - Rey, "You're Luke Skywalker, the legendary jedi knight. I have something that belongs to you."

    - “Yeah, well, you know, that’s just, like, your opinion, man.”

    :p
     
  15. Star Dude

    Star Dude Jedi General

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    Absolutely! All those small hints on Ahsoka’s journey (revived by the daughter, the convor in the daughter’s color, the trip along the river to the afterlife, the color of her lighsabers, etc.), real promising stuff. Dave will have still something in stock for us, I’m sure.

    And now we got the Bendu as a new part of the (force) puzzle. I wonder if he will have influence or effect of any kind also an Ahsoka’s journey.

    I guess at least some questions will be answered by the upcoming Ahsoka novel, e.g. how she got the lightsabers with the unique colored Kyber crystals.
     
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  16. Star Dude

    Star Dude Jedi General

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    Although already written down by @LadyMusashi in this great article (http://www.starwarsnewsnet.com/2016/10/jelenas-review-ahsoka-by-e-k-johnston.html), I want to cite some lines here as they fit so perfectly into this ongoing discussion:

    We also get further explanation of kyber crystals. They are completely translucent and in the ice of Ilum completely invisible. The crystal chooses its user by ‘singing’ to them while remaining invisible to anyone else. The connection to the user is giving the crystal its color. The crystal will never ‘sing’ to a Dark Sider. They practically take the crystals which belong to someone else and bend them to their will – they ‘make them bleed’ giving the crystal its deep red color. While the places like Ilum have large quantities of crystals and are considered holy, the crystals appear in other places but they are harder to find.
     
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  17. Nathan_Marrek

    Nathan_Marrek Force Attuned

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    Wow so much depth to be potentially explored in a possible star wars film or more....


    Love it
     
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  18. Star Dude

    Star Dude Jedi General

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    Yes, with what is currently imparted by Rebels and upcoming with what knowledge can be found on the soil of Jedha, force lore is expanding fast these days compared to the timeline of the last 40 years.
     
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