Rian’s Snoke Theory Sucks

It was a total waste of time! Our new big baddie goes out like a total chump. Thank goodness for the space cow boob milking scene. That was a great consolation prize...

 

Well Snoke did rhyme with joke. Good 1 RJ.

 

Um . . . . BECAUSE HE WAS NEVER THE BIG BAD!!!

This is the story of Vader's Legacy in the opposing parallel of Rey and Kylo.

Kylo's fall is the tragedy that destroyed the pirate and the princess' happily ever after. His fall destroyed the fledgling Jedi order. He was always the REAL villain. Snoke was simply able to use him for a time. But the focus of the narrative isn't the struggle against Snoke its the rebirth of the Jedi striving against a new evil.

 

Stop crying because RJ didn't give a crap about all the lame Snoke theories. I liked the twist, totally unexpected. And it's very clear now he wasn't the main villain

 

I followed the Snoke rabbit hole probably as much, if not more, than anyone. I invested days in #SnokeIsPlagueis.
Oh how wrong I was to do that - and I love RJ for it! He did what was right for the story, something I never really saw coming: Renperor.
My whole take on Snoke being Plagueis was because I felt he had to be explained. He had to make sense in the context of the story and how the Dark Side works.
But it was also about how I thought the ST would end - and I based that solely on Ren's redemption, not thinking that Snoke didn't have to last the trilogy himself.

Now don't get me wrong, I NEED an explanation for Snoke somewhere along the line but the point is that I don't care how it arrives: in IX, in a book, comic or whatever. And for now I can choose who he is: Plagueis, The Prime Jedi (worshipped by the Sith) or a dodgy Vader clone. The other point is that once the explanation comes, as long as it makes sense, I'll happily accept it - because the the important story is the one that is occurring between Ren and Rey. I was just too blind sighted by theorising about unimportant things to see it - who is Rey, who is Snoke etc.

From now one I'll be debating the issues that really matter, such as: how can Ben be redeemed?
It's unbelievable to me that I am sitting here now and telling you all that not only does it not matter that Snoke is dead (and isn't important) but that his death scene was one of my favourites in the entire saga. I was nearly off my feet when Ren took that S.O.B. down!

 

Lucas's pre PT emperor theory sucked!

He randomly used force lighting once then died! We knew nothing about him!

"Rabble rabble"

 

Kylo isn't the main villain. We're made to believe that Snoke had been manipulating him *from conception* - as insane as that sounds. Snoke created Kylo. The only reason Luke even considered killing Kylo is because "Snoke had already turned his heart." Luke had nothing to do with how Kylo ended up, hell, according to the film Kylo doesn't even have anything to do with how Kylo ended up. Everything points to Snoke, but you know what, Rian didn't like the effort it would require to flesh that part out, so he just tells us... Yeah, it is Snoke... but... it doesn't matter. Yeah, he is dark, so dark, because of Snoke... trust me. Well RJ, show us! Don't tell us! Give us the story! Let us experience it, let us learn and understand and be there with the character.

I would like to point out that the OP is correct by default. Rian's Snoke theory does suck! The reason being he didn't even put in the effort to make one. Rian's Snoke is a caricature, a shallow, 2-dimensional being with no back-story, no substance and no motivation. Even if he existed to be killed off, it's just a poor story-teller who doesn't even attempt to understand his own characters.

Also, I would like to point out that not everyone who was disappointed by certain choices made by RJ is a troll. We are all fans and we are passionate, you know, we like to discuss these things and we deserve to have an outlet and a voice too.

 

Yeah Snoke was a joke, he should not have been killed and instead fleeing to an lonely island to whine about his miserable life. Ohh maybe on Luke's island.
And please kill off punk Kylo in the next one.

 

Snoke is an obstacle to Kylo fulfulling his inverted heroes journey. He never was that important, and he never was imagined as a Palpatine II. Neither of you people wanted another Palpatine. But now when it turns out Snoke dies, you all suddenly riot and reveal what you wanted was another Palpatine.

 

Problem is, it's a new evil that ain't all that evil. Kylo - a guy beaten by a girl without any training whatsoever - and conflicted with being good just isn't that scary. He's not Darth Vader, the Emperor, Snoke, etc. He's a tortured man-child, and now the only real baddie left in the series.

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That's fine, but if you're going to put another Palpatine in these films, at least have a wee bit of backstory setting up who the guy is and how he came to power in a post-Empire world where it was supposed to be sunshine and happiness. As it now stands, we have no clue whatsoever how we got from ROJ to TFA unless we read some of the comics/novels. That's absurd.

 

a. He never could be Darth Vader. You don't get better than Vader in the bad-ass villain stakes. But you can do something different that is better and more threatening than Vader is other ways.
b. You're judging Renperor by how he was in TLJ. Let's see how powerful he is without the manipulation of Snoke a few years into the future. He seemed less conflicted at the end of TLJ and my guess is that this help him use the Dark Side to a greater extent.
c. The challenge in defeating Ren is different to defeating Vader and the Emperor. Not only is Ren likely going to be off the charts powerful but it is going to be a heck of a struggle to redeem Ben (which I still believe will be the end game). We'll see that it was easier for Luke to bring out the light in his father than it will be for Rey to help bring Ben home...

 

But that's what I said. He isn't another Palpatine. That's what some fans assumed.........wrongly. We know everything we needed to know. That he is Kylo's master. That he leads the First Order. That he seduced Ben to the darkside. That he tries to play off Hux and Kylo against each other. That he merely sees both of them as tools for his own power.

I.e. his narrative function relates to Ben's arc and not to anything else. What would it add to the story if we would know exactly who or what Snoke is and how he came to power? The mystery surrounding him is 10 times more effective.

 

Whether he is or isn't another Palpatine is irrelevant. The point is, the lack of back story for such a major character - the lack of a feasible outline of how we got from ROJ to TFA - is lazy filmmaking and ultimately takes away any sense of cohesiveness in the franchise. With the prequels, as badly as they are disliked by some, at least we have a plausible and cohesive story line that sets up and carries the original trilogy forward. Here, we get none of that. ROJ ends on a happy note, and then somehow that was apparently all for naught. It would be nice to know how we got from point A to point B.

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I understand your point. I guess the bottom line is killing the evil guy, and going forward with a man-child as the big baddie just ain't all that appealing to me. There is no sense of danger for our heroes going forward, the way there was at the end of Empire.

 

This guy keeps creating threads because he didn't like the movie. It's sad how desperate some people are to spread their negatively around.

 

I sort of understand that. But then you're jumping the gun. We don't know what'll be in place for IX. A new villain (under Ren)? The Knights of Ren might pack a punch? Ren himself may be very different in a few years. But really, it is the Dark Side itself that has always been the villain and it doesn't need one person to provide a sense of dread.

 

I agree, JJ has a blank canvass with which to work. It will almost be a standalone movie from that point of view. There is no cliffhanger, and little in the way of cohesiveness that is needed for IX. He can do whatever he wants with it. Perhaps that is why I find it so disappointing.

 

Or it could be that not having a cliffhanger is subversive/misdirection. It makes us think we're just heading for a war but what they're really doing is distracting us from the surprises on the horizon...

It's funny, after TFA I couldn't wait to get to TLJ. I didn't enjoy TFA but it did set up questions I desperately wanted answered. With TLJ, I'm more than happy to watch it over and over, analyse it to death and wait patiently for IX!

 

I certainly did not expect it. I think it did help move Kylo's story along though, which was definitely the intention. It didn't really matter who Snoke was, he functioned as a device that showed us who Kylo really is.