SPECULATION Snoke’s Real Identity (Poll)

I prefer him to be DP but I could live with him being a mix of Palps and Tashu created in the core of Jakku.

 

LOL... I'm only "wise" enough to know how foolish I truly am =)

I think it's an important part of the classic "Jedi fate," to realize that =)

But Bruce Lee -- now there was a wise man:

“A wise man can learn more from a foolish question than a fool can learn from a wise answer.”

Well, I can only hope that, perhaps, from my own foolish questions and speculations, there might come some good =)

 

It was Plags plan all along to remain behind the scenes and let Palps be the front man. So would be as easy as setting his apprentice up to try and kill him so he could fade into the background indefinitely. I think its funny when people gripe too

 

Snoke is one of the individuals that wrote the Journal of the Whills and now he is using all the knowledge to find Luke...

 

You're missing the point about why we reference the book. We're not saying it is canon - we're saying that the logical answers to some questions arise in the novel that could be used by LFL. It's not about bringing in any canon, but providing logical answers to certain questions. The fact is, Snoke looks half dead anyway and so Plagueis past and his special abilities would explain it all in one swift stroke!

See, the thing with DP is that we know nothing about his character other than his connection to Palpatine and his mooted abilities. For all intent and purposes, he would be new. They could make him be anyone they wanted him to be. Give him any look, personality and powers. They can provide any backstory they wish for him. And at the same time he'd tie beautifully into the story of Darth Vader unlike any other villain could.

 

I really dont care that much anymore, at this point I'd not really care as long as it is written well and believable

 

i only mentioned Rey Solo/Skywalker because i know of @master_shaitan 's dislike of such theories

i wouldn't mind a Rey Solo/Skywalker tbh, but i would be disappointed with a Snoke = Plagz.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 30, 2017 ---

at least we're both laughing, eh?

reusing a plot point from a Star Wars young adult novel as the basis of the conclusion of the ST just seems... lame. to each their own, i guess.

 

Yeah totally. In no way am I completely serious about this subject. I won't lose sleep. Promise. There is a world we we can agree to disagree! One question... when was the book considered young adult?

 

it may not have been marketed as young adult; i've never read any of the Star Wars books other than Tales from Jabba's Palace as a child, and i always assumed they were targeted towards younger audiences.

 

I voted Plagueis in the poll, but I'm actually surprised by the amount of votes for him - I expected fewer. However, there's a couple of arguments against Plagueis I'd like to address:

"Plagueis doesn't move the story forward. That's why I want Snoke to be something new".

The idea that Plagueis can't move the story forward isn't true. The idea that a brand new character automatically moves the story forward isn't true either.

I've always leaned towards if we're going to create something we should check and see if existed already to the fans because it has way more value if we bring that in. Why would I just replace it with something new? - Dave Filoni, writer (Clone Wars, Rebels)​

In my opinion, to move the story forward, I think it would be a good idea to start by introducing a character that has moved beyond the limitations and weaknesses of the Sith. Episodes I-VI highlighted two critical factors that led to the Sith's demise:

1. The Sith's Rule of Two
2. The Sith's failure to attain knowledge on par with the Jedi

So how could Snoke progress the story forward in regards to these two factors?:

1. Moving beyond the Sith's Rule of Two

We're already seeing that Snoke has moved beyond the Sith's Rule of Two. No longer is it the primary goal of an apprentice to surpass the power of their master. Compared to the Sith, Snoke has engineered his relationship with his apprentice differently. Kylo is called "master" by the master himself - a reversal of the Sith's way.

Since Kylo is already technically a master and belongs to the KOR, his primary goal is to surpass his grandfather's power. Therefore, Snoke is his teacher who'll help him reach that goal. I believe that Kylo's Vader obsession was manufactured by Snoke to reduce the chances Kylo would betray him à la a Sith apprentice.

2. Moving beyond the Sith's failure to attain knowledge on par with the Jedi

The Jedi achieved knowledge that was crucial in their ability to survive as an Order. The Sith however didn't and as a result went extinct. That knowledge, of course, was about preserving life essence through the Force.

The theme of conquering death began in ANH - played a much bigger role in ROTJ drafts - and has been prevalent in the prequels, the Clone Wars, Rebels - basically all SW medium since. With the introduction of Snoke and how he appears on-screen, do you think the story is moving AWAY from this important theme? Do you think Snoke doesn't know of the Jedi's knowledge of preserving life? Do you think after suffering severe (possible deadly) injures and his subsequent vulnerability that the ability to preserve life essence hasn't crossed Snoke's mind?

We learnt that the Jedi focused on spiritual manifestation to achieve their goal of eternal consciousness, whereas the Sith focused on physical manifestation. We learnt the Sith failed because they cannot let go of the Self. But who's to say that Snoke hasn't learnt a way of preserving his life essence through physical manifestation to overcome his injuries? Who's to say Snoke hasn't learnt knowledge on par with the Jedi? Wouldn't THAT move the story forward in a way that is relevant to the underlying themes that's been apparent in this saga since the beginning? How else can Snoke move this story forward if a) he hasn't achieved knowledge at least on par with the Jedi/Sith or b) he hasn't surpassed the limitations of the Sith?

This is why I don't buy the idea Plagueis can't move the story forward. He absolutely would! Remember, this is basically what we know about Snoke:

• A 'Master of the Dark Side'
• Rues the downfall of the Sith's Empire (Vader's mistake)
• Seeks to rebuild Lord Vader's legacy (through Kylo Ren and the Knights of Ren)
• Seeks to rebuild the Empire's Imperial legacy (through the First Order)
• Seeks to destroy the Jedi
• Seeks to recover/has recovered from severely damaging injuries

Personally, I see Snoke's character as the perfect template to introduce someone who has learnt powerful hidden knowledge of the Force, someone who has surpassed the Sith's limitations, and someone who now can finish the Sith's plan of dark-side, galaxy-wide domination. And in my view, Plagueis is that answer. Rather than creating something brand new for the sake of being brand new, Plagueis is a credible fan-favourite EU character, he connects to the saga's important themes and he can progress the story better than anything I can think of.

"Plagueis was a Muun - George himself wanted that. They're not going to change his species."

Plagueis was most definitely a Muun. if there was one single characteristic that could easily end the Snoke-is-Plagueis debate is the fact Plagueis was a Muun. Peroid. Say the word once and it's over.

Knowing that Plagueis was indeed a Muun, why didn't James Luceno (author of the Darth Plagueis novel) not make this canon FACT in his Tarkin novel? What stopped Luceno from mentioning that key detail? Why did he confirm Plagueis' droid, 11-4D, amongst other plot details from that book, but not include his species (the one thing George himself told Luceno about the character)? Luceno describes the species of other characters in Tarkin, but not Plagueis !? That's all odd to me, especially when you consider Luceno's comments about writing in the new-canon era:

"I write the book. I don't want to be too constrained by [rebranded canon]. I wait for the story board to kind of pass judgment. If there's a place they don't want me to go or mention, a species they think is problematic, they get back to me and ask me to tweak this or change this. I didn't let influence my storytelling."

"When I met with them, I had a sense of what the gameplan was. Not to rely so much on the existing EU. I did a lot of editorial work myself, I wrote a first draft and changed things that I myself thought might be problematic. However, they did ask me to change the species of a couple of characters, there were some minor cuts, but it wasn't an intrusive process. And they didn't really dictate to me where I could go." (source)

"Throughout the outline process and following the submission of a first draft, the Story Group kept me on target, as it were, and reined me in from including too many references and too much expository prose." (source)

"I think that’s what the Story Group has been created to contain. Without spilling secrets they can say, ‘I think this isn’t a good place to go with this book’ or ‘You might want to steer clear of this topic.’ This is part of an effort to maintain a so-called continuity where every book and every game and every comic will all be part of a single story going forward, and that wasn’t the case earlier on." (source)

"I think [Plagueis in canon] is an ongoing discussion and I haven't pushed hard to [write a new Plagueis book]. I think Plagueis is out there for anyone that wants to read it, and they can take the book as Legends or as canon, depending on whatever their own viewpoint is. So I haven't pushed one way or another, and it's hard to know in the future which way characters are going to be developed in continuity. So maybe some things will be used and some things won't. That's the way it is." (source)​

 

I hope it's Plagueis.

 

Very well thought out argument but Snoke and Kylo are not Sith.

 

Thanks. It's true they aren't Sith, but I don't think it's impossible for Snoke to be an ex-Sith who's moved beyond their limitations i.e. the Rule of Two & preserving life essence.

 

HE COULD BE DARTH MALGUS BECAUSE OF SNOKES MOUTH

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 31, 2017, Original Post Date: Oct 31, 2017 ---

 

Palpatine

 

Snoke is nothing. Well, his nothingness is a sign of LFL's own lack.

 

kinda like the dashes in your name?

 

He and Rey are related.


Snoke Random and Rey Random