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So it's Leia's fault he died?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens' started by dmgamer, Dec 18, 2015.

  1. dmgamer

    dmgamer Rebel Trooper

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    Han was convinced his son wasn't redeemable.
    Even watched him walk away carrying Rey.

    If Leia hadn't made him promise to try to "bring him home"... Han would still be alive.
    Han was in the clear and seemed like he was considering slipping out as Kylo walked across the bridge.
    Then... it seems, he remembered his promise to Leia.

    So Leia caused Han's death. Just saying...

    On more serious note - I do wonder what Han was like as a father. The parents obviously saw the darkness in him ( reminded of Grandpa ).
    Wonder if Kylo had more animosity towards Han for some perceived failings as a father or if he feels the same about Leia. Would he have killed her just as easily?
     
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  2. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

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    are you saying that Han was reckless due to a promise? Reckless is his nature. He would have done it regardless.
     
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  3. dmgamer

    dmgamer Rebel Trooper

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    If you think my point was than "Han isn't reckless" you misunderstood.
    It was established he believe his son was lost, both in dialogue with Leia, and even perhaps in him watching him march by & away carrying Rey. He didn't approach him then - that would've been plenty reckless - heck & even served a possibly additional noble purpose of saving Rey. No - he just watched him walk off. He even told Leia bout it - "He was here / saw him".
    *After*, however, Leia disagrees with Han that their son is 'lost'/'not coming back' ( "still light in him" ) & asks Han to promise to try to bring him back... *then* when Han sees him again, after appearing ready to sneak out/slip past ... does he go after Ben.

    I think it's sad that Leia caused Han's death... but the story & dialogue indicate Han probably wouldn't have gone after his son had he & Leia not discussed it.
     
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  4. Commodore

    Commodore Rebel Trooper

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    You're not the only person who noticed this. I got the impression that Han Solo had given up on his son, Ben Solo. It was not until Han was reunited with Leia, that he had a change of heart. It was a mother's love that convinced Han that Ben could be brought back from the Dark Side, and it was his love of Leia, not necessarily of Ben, that lead him out onto the bridge. It was Han attempting to set right what had gone so terrible wrong.
     
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  5. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

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    That scene was meant to convey the Luke/Kenobi scene from ANH but through Han's POV. Han went for his son to get back with Leia. Leia led him to his death without realizing it because she was too optimistic like Luke from Arotj. Han's recklessness was going there with no full plan. Han sensed he was going to die but didn't realize who's own son could do that...but take this into account: "The son of Solo is DEAD."
     
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  6. Nars

    Nars Rebel General

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    The beauty of this situation is, that Leia was right, but Han paradoxically helped Kylo embrace Dark Side. Killing his father was opportunity for Kylo, to kill Ben, to burn last bridge, that forbid him to totally sunk in to Dark Side.

    This scene mirrors Luke/Vader moment from OT.
     
  7. Bluestreaking

    Bluestreaking Imperial Grand Admiral with Bluish skin

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    If I was a therapist I would tell Leia it absolutely isn't her fault but she is going to blame herself anyway. It's going to be interesting see how she handles that in Episode VIII. We may see a very tortured Leia who has lost her son and husband seemingly forever.
     
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  8. PrincessLeiaCB3

    PrincessLeiaCB3 The Princess that was Promised
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    Poor Han. Never had a chance against these Skywalker guys dressed in black. If only he'd run away to Jabba after the Battle of Yavin...

    *uses humor to get over her grief*

    112b392c2b05c2d054473ee7fa3e00d5.jpg
     
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  9. Cakewalk25

    Cakewalk25 Rebel Trooper

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    The novelization makes it clear that Han goes after Ben because Leia asked him too. It's also hinted at more strongly than it is in the movie that Han planned on going back to her and reconciling if he had survived.

    The novelization says:

    A chance, then, to make it back to the Falcon before everything on this planet went to hell. A chance later for another reunion, on another world. A face swam before his, its features aged but still soft, the voice that emerged from between so-familiar lips biting yet always affectionate. Forming words that lingered in his thoughts. Forming, at last hearing, a request.

    A request that wouldn’t go away, he knew. It would never go away. He made up his mind. Instead of retreating, he advanced. Instead of running for safety, he took up the challenge. There was no real choice, he told himself as he advanced to the edge of the walkway. And called out.


    I think it was an honourable way for Han to go out. He loves Leia and he knew their family would never be whole again unless Ben was redeemed. Leia asked him to bring him home so he tried so their family could be whole again.
     
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  10. PrincessLeiaCB3

    PrincessLeiaCB3 The Princess that was Promised
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    Now I am weeping. It was his choice and his love for Leia. Sigh.
     
    #10 PrincessLeiaCB3, Dec 18, 2015
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2016
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  11. Cameron

    Cameron Clone

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    As soon as Leia said that; "bring him back" I thought, what? Are you nuts? thats a suicide mission! And when he when to talk to him, I thought, surely they aren't going to be so obvious as to kill him here, right? And, just for a moment, it looked like they might do a fairly good plot twist, and he actually would go back would Han. That would have made a good story. But no, stick with the routine cliche plot lines. And afterwards I thought just the same, Leia, you got Han killed, why?
     
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  12. Cakewalk25

    Cakewalk25 Rebel Trooper

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    Leia knew Vader turns back from the Dark Side and held out hope that her son could too. I don't think she should be criticized for having a mother's love for her child that led her to hope there was some good left in him. Even Kylo says he still struggles with the Light inside him.
     
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  13. Commodore

    Commodore Rebel Trooper

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    May his death not be in vein.
     
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  14. PrincessLeiaCB3

    PrincessLeiaCB3 The Princess that was Promised
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    The very same scoundrel who came back for her in Hoth when he already had his clearance to leave. *burst into tears*
     
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  15. dmgamer

    dmgamer Rebel Trooper

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    Understand and agree with you.
    I don't think she should be criticized for showing a "mother's love", just pointing out that tragically/ironically Leia caused Han's death. Or, as others have pointed out - Han's love for Leia led to this.

    Leia was naive...

    Han should've said something along the lines of:
    "I once thought as you. Now I know Kylo is twisted and evil." ;)
     
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  16. jedimasterjohnny

    jedimasterjohnny Rebelscum

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    People want to blame Leia for Han's death as Han said "I take orders from one person sweet heart, me!" I believe thats how it goes. Seriously though nobody tells Han what to do, him going out on that walkway was him still loving and not giving up on his son which is echoed by his holding his face before fallling.
     
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  17. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

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    NOBODY PUTS HAN SOLO IN A CORNER !
     
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  18. Veradun

    Veradun Clone Commander

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    I'm pretty sure that saber went through multiple veins, and probably a vital organ or two as well. ;)

    ps - i only joke to cope; Han was my favorite good guy character from the OT
     
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  19. semiote

    semiote Rebel General

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    As I saw things, Han's declaration that they'd lost their son forever was a moment of despair: in his heart of hearts, he wanted to believe Ben could be redeemed. Leia just took him out of this despair back to hope. When Han approached Ben, there wasn't any fear in his eyes:, as I read his expression: only love, grief, and hope.

    Kathleen Kennedy recently said that Harrison Ford (among other cast members) would appear in episode VIII. I think somehow, we'll see a force vision of Han and perhaps even Leia with the young Ben - a brief glimpse to show us Ben's childhood and their love for him (perhaps using the kinds of de-aging effects we saw in "Antman"). More of the backstory will be revealed to us this, including, I hope, a strong emphasis on the emotional beats. Perhaps we'll even get to see the Big Three together in this vision, which a lot of people seemed to miss in TFA.

    At least, these are my hopes...
     
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  20. PrincessLeiaCB3

    PrincessLeiaCB3 The Princess that was Promised
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    We are there with you. I missed the Big 3 together again too.
    --- Double Post Merged, Dec 21, 2015, Original Post Date: Dec 21, 2015 ---
    My face reading this:

    image.jpg
     
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