TFA better than ROTJ?

No.
The Rathtars in TFA have nothing whatsoever to do with the Ewoks in ROTJ. I don't even know why you mention them in the same sentence.

The Ewoks were horrible, period. The whole idea, the heroes being kidnapped by the Ewoks, and the Ewoks defeating an "entire legion" of the Emperor's "best Stormtroopers" is utterly obnoxious. The Ewoks are worse than Jar Jar.

Even aside from that,
- Harrison Ford phones it in as Han Solo; in other words, it's a flat, bored performance. This is understandable as, frankly, he isn't given a lot to do after being saved from Jabba's palace.
- After the Jabba's palace sequence, the action is relatively boring; the feet battle is not especially compelling, and other than the speeder chase, there aren't many great action scenes.
- Luke vs Vader & Emperor is great, yes... But Vader's character feels neutered and less impressive than in the previous two films.

My ranking:
ANH
ESB - TFA
ROTS
ROTJ
TPM
AOTC

Anyone who INSISTS that the OT movies are all superior, etc etc... That's just nostalgia goggles. Take them off and see each movie on its own for what it is. ROTJ is a weak film, weaker than TFA (or ROTS imo).

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 26, 2015, Original Post Date: Dec 26, 2015 ---

YES!!!

 

TFA already has a dozen of beatiful shots that will have more power and nostalgia in 10 years. I am sure about that. So, in 10 years will be very hard to decide wich one its better.

PS. Just reading that some fans are putting TFA above ROTJ makes me happy, imposible to happens with any of the PT movies.

 

ahaha the wonderful hypocrisy buried within this paragraph. Its quite apparent how little of RoTJ's ending clicked within your mind. thankfully, everyone else got it and most believe it to be a poignant ending to the saga. If RotJ is lazy, then TFA takes lazy to new extremes. lets break it down shall we? 1st off, the entirety of TFA's plot consists of circumstances so extreme that in order for the audience to buy into such notions, they must completely abandon everything they know in regards to Luke Skywalker. if the audience cant buy TFA's Luke, who is quite literally the polar opposite of the previous iterations, the movie fails then and there. as Luke doesnt intervene in the atrocities that take place during Ep. 7. and there is no added context in TFA for Luke's drastic change of character. you just either accept this luke or you dont. its a lazy use of a macguffin if ive ever seen one, as i never could quite understand why Leia & the Resistance ever believed THIS Luke could help them in the first place. the guy left you to deal with the mess, Leia. if you havent heard from him in over a decade why do you expect this will change now? other than the plot dictates it so. The worst part is the "our son" arc. TFA never gives us a reason to buy into Han, Leia and Kylo's relationship. we never get a scene before the final confrontation and ultimately the scene falls flat because of it. All we get are Han and Leia repeating "our son" multiple times within 5 minutes. its an incredibly lazy way to establish a relationship and it all feels forced because of it. and what is Han's motivation for confronting Kylo after so many years? in TFA, that motivation comes solely from Leia asking Han to go on a suicide mission to bring home their son. We get absolutely zero context for Leia even believing this to be an option at this point, and it almost makes Leia appear borderline manipulative for asking such a thing. its the laziest motivation for Han to confront Kylo that they could have concocted. i can go on....

 

The question isn't whether TFA is better than ROTJ.

It's whether it's better than TPM.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 27, 2015, Original Post Date: Dec 27, 2015 ---

Tied with Empire!? OMG.

My rankings:

TESB
ANH
ROTJ
ROTS
ATOC
TPM
TFA (dead last)

 

There should be a 'deluded' option in reactions.

Having been a Star Wars fan for thirty five years I didn't have to abandon anything I knew with regards to Luke. To say Luke is the polar opposite to previous iterations is A to not understand Luke and B to not understand the art of story telling. Luke was the last Jedi. He had to reconstruct the Jedi order on the basis of little or no training. He was the son of 'the chosen one' so he had immense pressure heaped upon him to complete that task. Luke's attempt to reconstruct the Jedi Order ended in catastrophic failure, so he went into hiding - that all makes sense. Your problem is that your idea of Luke as omnipotent did not carry over into the new trilogy - which in terms of story telling would have rendered a new trilogy redundant.

Also, I feel like you didn't pay much attention when you were watching the film. Han didn't go on a suicide mission to bring his son home. He went to disable the sheild of the Starkiller base. In the process of that he encountered his son, he trusts Leia's judgement because he knows the force is with her and in the heat of the moment he tries to appeal to his son. ANd that isn''t all that crazy because he almost gets through to him. The film has a consistent arc, sorry if you didn't like it, but you are wrong to think it has more inconsistencies than the OT. Very, very wrong.

 

...

 

No.

 

Your justification for Lukes absence is the same as TFA's. I have a whole trilogy worth of Luke's actions/decisions a.k.a. character development that wholly contradicts a Luke Skywalker who "goes into hiding" when times get rough, and they are rougher now then ever. it in fact does not make sense when taking into account Luke's character as he was developed throughout the OT. the very notion that you so willingly accept such a break in character tells me all i need to know about your so called enlightment in regards to storytelling. In other words, you clearly dont get it. & you clearly dont have a clue as to who Luke Skywalker is. The fact that after 35 years of self-proclaimed fandom, you took no issue with such changes shows me Disney made the right move... fiscally speaking.

 

I'd like to point out that we don't know if Luke is actually hiding just to hide, or if he's hiding because he's been developing something.
Aside from that; the reason is symbolic - there needs to be a mystical great Jedi who is the only hope in hiding just as much as there needed to be a force attuned protagonist hidden away on a desert planet with a knack for flying and being an ornery cuss.

 

So sad for you. It is you who are mistaken, about a great many things. Not even now, do you understand that Luke Skywalker is and always has been a complicated character with many layers, not a one dimensional hero who believes he can always save the galaxy, and that the galaxy always needs him. Do yourself a favour and save yourself a blood vessel and don't go see episode eight.

 

Comparing the two is ridiculous as both are different films as one is starting a story and one is finishing it.

For what it's worth though, TFA>ROTJ.

Oh, and DFF, I'll still feel the same way in ten years.

 

I agree. Doesn't come close for me, personally. It's a fine movie but not something truly monumental. I see it as a new beginning, a kind of reintroduction to Star Wars, and I'm expecting the fun to really begin with VIII & IX. I'd rank TFA right in between the OT and the PT.

 

Writing a character, whom has 38 years worth of character development (3 films worth of canon), to act in a way that isnt supported within the context of his previous iterations is the definition of a cop out. its been a cornerstone of lazy screen writing since the day film was first used to tell stories. youre here telling me what does or doesnt constitute as lazy storytelling, in a very condescending way. I, the english major, am telling you, in a very pretentious way that you have fundamentally misunderstood what consists of "good" storytelling. Once again, writing a character to make decisions that arent consistent with the character him or herself does not make said character complex, or as you say, complicated. it makes the screen writing complicated, as it creates false tension and drama.

 

The last half hour of ROTJ is superb. The Luke/Vader/Emperor confrontation is the perfect climax to the Skywalker legacy (up to that point now of course).

Objectively, TFA is a better all round film. The average cinema goer would feel that I imagine.

I however appreciate ROTJ more than TFA because, like all of Lucas' SW films it is unique and that ending was 100x more impactful than any scene/every scene put together in TFA.

There is a ton of stupid stuff that happens in Star Wars. The Ewoks probably in the top 3 of that list. However, they serve a purpose in regard to the theme they represent in the SW mythology. Could it have been done better, of course! But nevertheless, I have to hold my hands up and say when all appears lost and those furry little fu*** show up I actually feel a bit pumped!

I watched ROTJ before I went in and saw TFA. infelt more during the former than the latter viewing.

So my answer is:

TFA IS a better film. Objectively.
To me, ROTJ is above TFA.

 

Objectively TFA had more problems than ROTJ.

Problems with pacing, unlikable characters, and no memorable scenes.

Once you take a step back, and see past the fog of lies that have been promoted by the mainstream media, then it becomes pretty obvious that TFA just isn't a very good Star Wars film.

Certainly not one that merits such a ridiculously high tomatometer.

...coundown to rated as trolling in 3....2...1

 

Who were the unlikeable characters in your opinion?

 

I have a bad feeling about this thread ...