The big spoiler review thread

So, could one say that Luke is "Luke" has we knoe him by the end of the movie?

 

I can't wait for BluRay edition, when I will rewatch this fight for an hour, again and again. Both time I was watching it my jaw dropped.

 

At least they're paying attention to canon in some areas too, one of the 'legends' in the Legends of Luke Skywalker is referenced and clearly true.

The one about fishing with a huuuuuge spear

 

After 2nd Screening last night with my buddies, all of them Star Wars Junkies like me and by the way we all Loved this Movie, it's time to finally came down to what the really matters about Movie Reviews, My Personal Pros and Cons List (basically because i like to say a lot of stuff but i'm kinda lazy to write things down so the bullet points allow me cover up many things pretty fast).

Before we go into this it's time to set some basis about "The Last Jedi":
- The Force Awakens it's a Brilliant made Movie with a very "Lazy" or Non-Creative Plot but it serves it's purposes to introduce us the new characters for the future of the Star Wars Universe. Rey, Finn, Poe and Hux are Great characters with very talented actors behind them BUT Kylo Ren steals the show quickly and i think is probably the best character SW ever knew, and by the way BB-8 is Amazing and our new Droid of choice. I firmly believe "The Last Jedi" is a much better Movie than TFA, it might not get so good technically but delivers in Story, Pace and Character development.

PROS!!!

- Kylo Ren, Kylo Ren, Kylo Ren! This guy it's getting sooooooooooooo cool. Ben is presented as disoriented child in search for approval and quickly evolves into a spoiled brat kicking everything out of his way.This Dude is BAD but it still has some true silliness that makes us all likes him despite his vicious deeds. Honestly there's so much to dig into this guy that potential is unlimited in the SW Universe. I really like the way Adam Driver portraits Ben as a super powerful Teenager.

- Luke Skywalker. Yes we waited 30 Years to watch Luke Skywalker holding a lightsabre against the bad guys and instead we get an old bitter hermit BUT i Loved the Hermit Luke, pretty much mimic Yoda in ESB, and Mark was on the Spot on the hermit interpretation, i could watch 4 hours of crazy hermit Luke with Rey and Chewie on the Island.

- Greatest Movie Moment EVER - Luke standing alone facing several AT-AT's and Kylo Ren Shuttle, OK if they had a Luke line like "Surrender Now you don't have a chance!" we would be facing History in the making but still a pretty awesome scene.

- Space Battles were very, very Cool, but i felt they were extremly short, perhaps some editing removals but overall the Space Battles were Awesome if you forget the excessive skills of Poe lonely assault things were GREAT on Space War. On other hand the ground battles felt "meh", there even was a ground battle? or we just saw the Resistence set their defences and the new AT-AT approching with a cannon, even the land speeders witch looked cool weren't that much into combat.

- Snoke and his cronies. Supreme Leader Snoke is a Huge Marvelous Character to work with, his dialogues and his Force powers are some of the best in SW History, and his retine of Red Guards are F****ing Amazing, are kidding Me??? those guys are all so cool! The Red Guards looked cool and fight even better with incredible weapons, YES!!!! They even poped up some auxiliary Force users in the background just like Palpatine had in RTJ (the Blue guys - go check the Visual Dictionary). OK, Snoke is very cool and says pretty good stuff but having a Motion Capture God like Andy Serkys to make stand on his throne feels very poor, i hoped Serkys would made Snoke move just like Gary Oldman's Dracula, Spooky and Creepy. Snoke Died? The scene Kylo cuts Snoke is super despite the actual slashing being pretty much MEH and how came a guy so superpowerfull like Snoke didn't felt this coming? Is this another Darth Maul all again were a superb character is killed way to soon and later on "brought to life" in a very lame plot twist? Let's just hope not because i liked Snoke too much to have him used that way, but all the statements in the movie of body allocation and new Force Powers and the references to Snoke in the VD seem to lead a way to Snoke's return in the next Movie, let's wait and see.

- Rey. Rey is starting to evolve as a character and evolving away from the bidimentional SW Movie characters, Rey doesn't need a backstory she's just a girl learning to use her Force powers and trying to make the Galaxy a better place. Rey has some dept, she's not your Disney Princess all goody, No she's stuburn and makes mistakes, and she becames violent and dangerous while being extremly naive in her human relationships. Thank god Rey is a Nobody, that means a ton for the future of the SW Saga, no more royal bloodlines and let the zeros became heroes. Is it my personal interpretation or Rey is riding fast into the Dark Side, is Rey the Super Bad of the new Star Wars? That would explain the removing of Snoke and leave room for Ben redemption. I bet Sw Episode IX will be Rey's Movie and that's why there won't be room in it for Luke Skywalker, just like Obi-San in ESB.

- The Guy portraided by Benicio Del Toro, DJ is a crew nickname like in "Dishonest John" the Traitor. But Benicio played the part with Greatness, it's a beautiful character even with all his quirks.

- Yoda. I praise the return of Great Little Master, is only used in a very funny scene and i know it could go so much better but i Loved watching Yoda on a new SW Movie.

- Rose. After the huge surprise it was Finn in TFA, Boyega is a great actor trully capable of bringing the ordinary people hero to life on screen, but Rose rises in our hearts as long the Movie develops after loosing his sister in the beggining of the movie in a great Space Battle, Rose will always see the good on any situation and tried to help everybody. Two thumb Up! Off Course the mais cast is on spot, D Gleeson might just be the best actor in the middle of a very talented cast and his General Hux delivers a super strong presence again while Oscar Isaac proves that he is more than good looks and reveals Poe Dameron is the new Leader of the Resistance.

- The Throne Room Battle is just LEGENDARY Star Wars Material, with Kylo, Rey, Snoke and the Red Guards delivering first a tremendous dialogue and Force power scene followed by an even better fightinf sequence, this scene might not have the importance that the original Throne Room had, with Palpatine Vader and Luke, but it felt *Blasphemy* better.

- The Force Powers. I think this must be the best SW Movie to address the Force issue. Let's not get into the balance thing, the light side producing a champion to face the Dark Side Champion, even the Light and Dark separations, those are just stupid labels to fit into the reallity (in psychiatry this duality is a clear indication of personallity disorder of some kind, for those who see only in black or white, but reallity is actually filled with all kinds of GREY). But i guess they must establish the sense that the Force is everywhere and everyone has and taps into the Force, no Royal Bloodlines required. There won't be anymore the Humans and the Super Humans users of the Force, everybody will use the Force. Off Course that now we do really have Force Powers, instead of blade fighting, Force Choking, influence persons and small time object moving we now have full scale telekinesis and Space Allocation, things just got wayyyy BIGGER and much mooooore POWERFUL, and i really loved that. I keep saying imagine in TFA if we don't have the Starkiller Base but instead we watched Snoke in the middle of a group of Blue Force users moving an asteroid against Coruscant, that would be EPIC!! Loved TLJ Final Scene because it represented a future for the Force and a hope to stand for the Republic but also it might show the democratization of the Force Users.
Luke's finest moment might be when he states the Jedi were just arrogant pricks and they should end. (VOILÁ)

CONS!!!

- PORGS! I Hated those little guys, they bring nothing to the development of the movie except an oportunity to Disney Marketing Department to CASH IN!!! Excuse me but having Porgs nesting inside the Falcon to me is the exact same thing of taking a dump in the middle of the Vatican Square, i Hated It. And all across the Movie we get Disney exploring everything to start milking the SW Cow in Christmas Merchandise, like: Luke wearing 3 full costumes, new ship designs that actually do NOTHING on screen, new fluffy creatures, so many variations of the BB-8, etc.

- Neverending Escape. Can you please explain how this Movie happens in the narrow time window where a Spaceship is running away from a fleet, like a Turtle to Turtle pursuit until one gets exausted? This is some serious Lazy story telling, the FO could go after them in a million other ways while the Resistence to escape just needed to send their smallet ships into the FO Fleet allowing the Resistance Cruiser to Jump anywhere.

- Where's the Great Jedi Master Luke Skywalker? MIA? I really missed Luke Skywalker, and it's a shame we won't see more of slashbucking Luke. Every Sw Fan deserved a great Battle Scene with Luke Skywalker, ok i know he should die in this Movie but they could deliver so much more of the Last Jedi Luke Skywalker, mainly in combat and force skills. SHAME

- Time Travel??? Really, while Rey hands the Lightsabre to Luke, the FO completely conquers the Galaxy and destroys the Republic. There's some time bending here, in Ach To time followed his regular course after the ending of TFA while in rest of the Galaxy the Time runs several months allowing the FO to conquer everything.

- Carrie Fischer. Rest In Peace Carrie, we Love you. I said it about TFA, i didn't liked Leia's interpretation, and in TLJ despite being better i didn't like it at all. To a Mother facing her own son there should some emotions, when a mother admits her son is lost it should had drama, but Carrie's performance was good on the action scenes but a little carved on the emotional parts. I believe Leia's journey into outer space is a great idea but it wasn't well delivered on screen, the director didn't make us feel she was in danger and she came back with her own skill and free will, this might be the scene Ryan Johnsson failled (i say bad angle on Carrie for start).

- The Underuse of great Actors in Star Wars Movies Continue. Why get a very gifted young actress like Lupita under an awfull character like Maz, why was Maz in this Movie after all? Gwendolin could bring the House down in a super cool Phasma, she cold be a ruthless leader and excel in the skirmish against Finn, a super awaited scene just rushed into oblivion.

- And there's always Tiny Little Bits that shouldn't make the Cut, the Canto Bigh Casino scenes are super underused and unnecessary to the Movie, BB-8 dazzled in TFA but in TLJ they made him just Ridiculous with overused capabillities, the Poe "General Hugs" could be great if they didn't push it again and again and again becoming just obnoxious (just like my son when he says a real good joke but in the next hour he will use that joke 50 times and it just gets annoing), what happenned to the Resistence ground forces? we saw them prepare to battle but after only the few guys inside the angar made the run.

OVERALL!!!!

I would rate this movie a 8-9 out of 10, 8.50.
Mainly because of the ridiculous space pursuit and the underuse of the Great Luke Skywalker, because this movie might deserve more. Just to remember that i gave TFA my overall 7.00 and today i thing TFA could be an 8.00 because it really gets better and better over the time, when you start bitching about the lack of Luke and observe the amazing how Kylo Ren is things get really better.

And what do You all, Star Wars Fans, think?

 

I dont remember the kid using the force?!

 

He forced pulled the broom into his hand - only a small distance though.

 

The kid doesn't have the Force though... The broom does. Wrap your head around that one!

 

There is no broom

 

Damn... I almost put the same reference in my original post... Great minds!

 

Just a quick question... Whatever Happened to The Knights of Ren?

My guess they are fighting with the Slaves of Tattoine while those *STILL* expect Anakin to free them!!!!!

OK, now seriously someone should start to keep track on these Big and Important things announced in the SW Movies and then completely forgotten into oblivion. Just imagine SW Movies with the Tattoine Slave Rebellion or the Great Knights of Ren forcing it out with the Great Darth Plagueis between the Kessel Run and Nerf Herds passing by.... I will watch all of that!

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 15, 2017, Original Post Date: Dec 15, 2017 ---

Another Mystery solved..... Why Yoda appears to Luke in Aaaach-To?

Borrowing some Milk He should....


Remember Luke got his Bluemilk from the Sea Cows, just like these

 

10 years was my immediate thought. Time for Rey to come into her own, for Kylo to mature, time for the resistance to build (the kids on Canto Bight have to grow up)

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 15, 2017, Original Post Date: Dec 15, 2017 ---

This was actually OK. I saw a science documentary about space and it turns out that the instant death that has been portrayed on screen so many times has conditioned us all to expect this, but the slow freeze and descent into oblivion as portrayed for Leia is actually closer to reality...even though it feels weird to type that in relation to AGFFA.

 

Also I think that RJ had in mind show us Leia with some knowledge about the force. That during this 30 years since ROTJ she probably had some training in the ways of the jedi. The scene is beatifull by the way.

 

Yoda made lightning strike as a ghost. That’s a big deal for force ghosts!

 

First watch pros and cons list.

PROS:

Poe finally gets his time to shine. I was a big fan of Poe in The Force Awakens, but I thought he was severely underused. Obviously there's reasons why, mostly because the character was originally supposed to die early on in the film and when they ultimately decided against doing that, they could only fit him into the story when appropriate, they weren't going to make major changes to accommodate the character but in this film boy does he have a lot to do. I think Poe might be my favorite part of the film.

Finn and Rose's arc. I didn't know any spoilers going into seeing TLJ but I had seen a fair share of non-spoiler reviews and, despite the praise there seemed to be a lot of negativity surrounding Finn and Rose and their storyline, so I went in being extremely pessimistic about it, but I'm proud to say that I really enjoyed it. Canto Bight itself was a bit of a letdown but overall I was pleased with what they did with them. The thing on Crait where she saves him and then kisses him is a little bit eh, it's not like there was a lot of romantic tension there but I think it gets established early on when they first meet that Rose is infatuated with Finn based off the stories she and Paige have heard about him. It's innocent puppy love and I'm fine with that. And the two of them have GREAT chemistry.

DJ. Again, going into the movie I didn't hear many positive things about him but he was a highlight character for me. I'll admit I absolutely love Benicio Del Toro as an actor so maybe that's why I like DJ so much but some of what he said, especially in relation to the Resistance/First Order cat and mouse game was pretty riveting to me. I think Finn learned a lot from him.

Admiral Holdo. The character itself is pretty middle of the road in my opinion but the way she goes out, the sacrifice that she makes is oh... just so good. Visually and the sound design, it's one of the absolute best moments in the film.

General Hux. I'm very surprised (in a good way) he made it all the way to 9. He was good in TFA, he was great in this film... he's on the bubble when it comes to my top 10 favorite Star Wars characters.

The overall look/design of Crait and the real "war" like feeling that the trenches had was great.

The acting of Mark Hamill, Daisy Ridley and Adam Driver was really good. That story itself? Ehh we'll get to that but absolutely no complaints about the performances themselves.

Throne. Room. That whole 10-15 minutes with Snoke, Rey and Kylo is in contention for the best sequence in the whole saga.



CONS:

Phasma. They screwed the pooch twice with her. A very underwhelming character. It almost feels like they went out of their way to make another Boba Fett in every way possible.

The humor. Oh boy, the humor. It didn't bother me NEARLY as much as I thought it would but there are two scenes in particular that just bother me so much. The first is when Luke tosses the lightsaber over his shoulder after he takes it from Rey. Tossing it to the side ala Return of the Jedi would've been so much better. Also BB8 in the AT-ST, it got a lot of laughs in my theater but I kind of had that Larry David face of "yeah ok".

The look of the film. As gorgeous as it is, I'm putting it as a negative because I think it's going to be so off putting in 10 years from now when we watch this trilogy back to back to back, we pop in a JJ Abrams film which looks okay, pretty good. Then we pop in this absolutely beautiful film... and then back to a JJ film. It's gonna feel weird. I know it's unfair because there's literally nothing that could be done about it but it was one of the things I was thinking about on the drive home last night and I didn't like it. Hopefully JJ steps his game up.



LUKE/REY/KYLO STORY:

I'm giving this its own category because it contains both good and bad, as well as areas of grey that I'm still processing. It all felt a little disjointed to me, I'm not sure if that's just the way that the film was cut but I never felt as invested in it as I think I should have. I thought we were going to explore more of the history, not Luke's history but the history of the Jedi... and why Luke feels so strongly that it needs to end. While they did address it, I almost feel like it was glossed over just a bit. Rey and Luke's relationship is still something that I'm trying to process, despite the fact that this is already the longest SW movie... I honestly think we needed more of just Rey and Luke, it needed to be fleshed out. When Rey left Ahch-To I didn't feel completely satisfied, there was so much more that I wanted to find out and because of what happens at the end of the film, I don't think we're going to. The interaction between Kylo and Rey was phenomenal, they have amazing chemistry. I like the dynamic of them at one point seeming to find comfort in each other but not necessarily in a romantic way. The cave scene with Rey was an extremely high point in the film for me, when she reaches out and says, "Show me my parents" and then the shadows begin to form it was the one time in the whole movie where I was at the very edge of my seat and my heart was beating a mile a minute... and then we got just Rey. Admittedly I was a little let down at first but once she talks about how she had never felt so alone I realized the brilliance of the scene. I've shared my thoughts about the throne room scene, but I wanna touch on Snoke's death. I thought it was brilliantly done and I'm not mad at all that he's gone. I think we've had the wrong idea about Snoke the whole time. While we saw him as this uber mystery, I think Lucasfilm saw him more as a crutch, someone that just had to be there as a dark side master to Kylo Ren, they never intended for him to play that big of a role in any of this. With him gone we now have an unhinged Kylo Ren and Hux who I think are both going to try and take over as Supreme Leader in 9, I can't wait to see how that plays out.

And then we get to Luke on Crait... and this is sorta where the movie lost me. I'm gonna reserve full judgement until I see it a few more times but right now I'm very indifferent towards it. There were some great moments but I think it also came off as a little pretentious, especially with the twin suns on Ahch-To... but like I said, in a week or two I'll have a better idea on exactly how I feel about it.

The final shot is an interesting one, I wonder what it's foreshadowing. My buddy last night said he thinks there's going to be a big time jump in-between Epiosode 8 and 9 and in 9 we're going to see a full Jedi order again. I don't think there's any chance that happens, I think it's more so that they're telling us that they're going to go beyond 9 in this saga.

It stands between an 8.5-9 for me, and I guess depending on if my feelings towards the ending change that could go up even more. It wasn't at all what I expected but I'm more than happy for what we got. There's so much set up for 9, I can't wait.

 

In my opinion, I'll sum up how the movie compares to TFA from my perspective.

The highs of TLJ was higher than the highs in TFA while,
the lows of TLJ was even lower than the lows in TFA.

There were certain inconsistencies in terms of tone and pacing but maybe it'll improve during my second viewing.

 

I'll go with some different thoughts.

Force ghosts can now "DO" things. Yoda brought down the lightning. This opens it up for Luke to be more powerful than we can possibly imagine in IX.

Luke as a man who in the end won by not fighting. This is the Luke in his moment of triumph on DS2.

Chewie getting a guilt trip...awesome

Luke is a legend in the end and only a very few people will veer know any differently. But he again provided hope to the galaxy.

Finally, a half cocked crazy a$$ plan didn't work, and wisdom and experience are more important than blowing stuff up.

This was really too much to process in one viewing. I'm going to hold off on a real review until then.

 

Another quick question....... What a Full Trained Jedi Is Capable Of? Will we ever going to see a fully trained Master Jedi, besides hermit Yoda?
(let's leave the Jedi Order from the Prequels Out of consideration please)

I Mean, Luke trained for a couple of Days with Yoda and was able to defeat Darth Vader, Kill Emperor Palpatine and defeat The Empire. Rey trained a couple of days with Luke and she's already capable of beat the crap of the main bad guy, Kylo Ren, and the great warriors, the Red Guard. Leia never trained and was capable of walk\swim in cold Space. I bet with training Rey will be capable of create not a Star but a full Universe with her Force Mind Tricks. C'Mon!

And just one thing more................. Do You know what's heavily missing in SW Galaxy? A PSYCHIATRIST

Why is everyone so needy in SW, and why no one can dealt with any kind of emotions? Luke met an old man and in a couple of days he swears eternal loyalty to him, not to mention is enormous affection over a short alien he recently encountered. Luke's best friend might be R2 D2, a robot we don't even understand. And what about all this obsesion with their Fathers, and why can't a Father in SW take care of his own son? In TFA Rey consider a Father figure a guy she literally met a couple of hours early. Don't forget Han leave his wife to walk about with his buddy. My advice, hire Woody Allen to Co-Writer and instead of Spacecraft battles and laser sword duels we start to get Ben Solo crying his heart out while screams "Why my Papy doesn't like me?"

 

This Den of Geek article renders my opinion on TLJ better than I can. It's a superb spoiler review. Superb. Read it, it is delicious...

http://www.denofgeek.com/us/movies/...rs-the-last-jedi-a-spoiler-filled-exploration

My last comment:

I liked TLJ. I think the film has many flaws and I'm glad JJ takes over the reigns for Episode IX. TLJ's over-burdened and overly cluttered arc is redeemed by Mark Hamill's performance.

In fact, I'll say this: Mark Hamill's performance in TLJ is the best performance by an actor in any of the eight films (and whatever Rogue One was). He's just that good.

I think Kathleen Kennedy deserves a lot of praise. She has stewarded this brand from death's door (the completely miserable returns from the 3D release of TPM made everyone realize Star Wars was on its last breath), She has saved the brand. It will now thrive for as long as Kathleen chooses to continue to guide it.

 

Well, Ben Solo isn't a teenager lol.

Kylo Ren is like 30

 

It's undefinable and unknowable. That's part of the Force's allure, it's ability to not be quantified, measured or fully understood. We're dealing with mysticism here not a high school physics course.

Most people I know could use a little therapy. And again this is Star Wars' strength. There is no Rambo. There is no Thanos. The massive alpha-male, wish fulfillment cardboard characters are left behind. Characters are emotive, complex and often torn. You know what makes Han Solo great? He goes from ruthless murderer to hero who sacrifices everything for family and friends.

It's called good writing. Characters that need psychiatrists are rich, wonderful and interesting. Massively powerful characters who get whatever they want belong in bad Batman films.

As for "Daddy issues" in Star Wars, you may want to take a little time and read just a little about human psychology. Our parental figures (be they male, female, biological parents, or mentors) are at the heart of how and why we develop the psyche's that we do. Citizen Kane had "Mommy issues" remember? Bicycle Thief? The entire film is about a boy having his illusions and heart broken by what his father must become to survive.

Good cinema deals with the very themes we deal with as human beings. Star Wars strength is that despite the fact it takes place "A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away", it's still a human drama and we can identify and understand a mystical character like Luke Skywalker, because his problems, are ultimately human problems.

Star Wars isn't a Justice League cartoon, it's richer, deeper and more complex than that and that makes it great, not weak.