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SPECULATION The Connection Between Rey and Ben.

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Last Jedi' started by BB-Rey, Feb 12, 2017.

?

What Is Their Connection?

  1. Cousins

    27 vote(s)
    23.9%
  2. Siblings

    7 vote(s)
    6.2%
  3. Cousins and Balancing of the Force

    19 vote(s)
    16.8%
  4. Siblings and Balancing of the Force

    8 vote(s)
    7.1%
  5. No Biological Connection and Balancing of the Force

    36 vote(s)
    31.9%
  6. None of the Above

    16 vote(s)
    14.2%
  1. Niamor

    Niamor Rebel Official

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    Beauty and the Beast live action film by Disney:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]


    JJ Abrams in the audio commentary of TFA "But when his mask comes off, you see Adam Driver, and he just looks like a sort of prince. [...] You’re probably going to have a castle, and a prince and a princess, if you’re looking at a fairy tale. We wanted to give these sort of, fundamental, not cosmetic, but, sort of, prerequisite elements. These locations in which we can set our new story and our new characters.” Just before Rey and Kylo meet in a very fairytale-esque forest near Maz's castle. He also described Rey as Cinderella...
     
    #361 Niamor, Mar 22, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2017
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  2. master_shaitan

    master_shaitan Jedi General

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    Well shut me down...
     
  3. Niamor

    Niamor Rebel Official

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    Beauty and the Beast by Disney and The Force Awakens:
    [​IMG]

    Another coincidences...
     
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  4. nightangel

    nightangel Rebel Official

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    this thread :eek: Beauty and the Beast = most insulting movie to women ever. :eek: Reylo = :eek:
     
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  5. master_shaitan

    master_shaitan Jedi General

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    HYPERBOLE ALERT!!!!
     
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  6. nightangel

    nightangel Rebel Official

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    no, just the terrible truth. :(
     
  7. master_shaitan

    master_shaitan Jedi General

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    Except, it's not true.
     
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  8. FN-3263827

    FN-3263827 First Order CPS
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    i'm saddened at how the Beauty and the Beast narrative has been recast to portray Beauty as a victim.
    Beauty is one of the most amazing characters in folklore.
    • she's strong and morally right: she sacrifices herself for her father to pay his debt. right out of the gates she demonstrates her iron will.
    • she's smart. she doesn't put up with the Beast's boorish behavior (this is the part everyone seems to forget!). she bends him to her will, and ultimately convinces him to let her go because he sees her love for her father and believes in her honor (people forget this too).
    • she's compassionate. she returns to the Beast because she knows that he will die without her. this does not mean she rejects her family or is weak-willed or has some kind of obsessive co-dependent relationship with the Beast. she doesn't have stockholm syndrome. she's not returning to a state of captivity.
    most fairy tales are about a damsel who is saved by a prince.
    Beauty and the Beast is about a prince who is saved by a damsel.

    go figure.

    Screen Shot 2017-03-23 at 7.07.41 AM.png
     
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  9. nightangel

    nightangel Rebel Official

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    I just heavily dislike stories like Beauty and the Best and the portrayal of such weak women, who give up everything to save/fix a bad/broken man. Like women who give up their whole career for a man. These should not be stories preached in our modern times to kids. :(
     
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  10. master_shaitan

    master_shaitan Jedi General

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    I don't think it has been recast. I just don't think people know the stories. Case in point:

    Seriously, what?
     
  11. FN-3263827

    FN-3263827 First Order CPS
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    i guess i consider that a kind of recasting.
    it's taking the story completely out of context to fit some model of abuse or weakness that is not and never was in the original narrative.

    the original story is about courtesy.
    The Beast conditionally extends his courtesy to the father, who then violates it and must pay a price.
    Beauty pays the price for him, but demonstrates the way in which the bargain was, ultimately. unjust (and discourteous in itself).
    Beauty further demonstrates true courtesy by saving the Beast's life because its the right thing to do.

    the fact that he turns into a handsome prince and she reaps all the riches of Araby is just a metaphoric reward for her bravery, ingenuity, and most of all her compassion.

    but people will just see what they want to see, i guess. [shrug]
     
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  12. mrverylongusername

    mrverylongusername Rebelscum

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    Wait!!!

    Conclusive proof that E.T and Rey have a connection...

    [​IMG]
    and look! they both have starey eyes and a mark across their face

    [​IMG]
    It's soooo obvious where this is going now.... #plagueisconfirmed
     
    #372 mrverylongusername, Mar 23, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2017
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  13. Niamor

    Niamor Rebel Official

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    Yeah but E.T./David Bowie are not Disney things/fairy tales, Beauty and the Beast is a Disney thing/fairy tale, just like Star Wars and TFA, JJ Abrams has clearly said that TFA is influenced by fairy tailes: a castle (Maz' castle), a Prince (Kylo), a princess/Cinderella (Rey), a meeting in the wood between the "prince" and the "princess" and according to Abrams "Rey is going to have a very interesting relationship with Kylo moving forward"...

    And Beauty and the Beast is a redemption story, it's obvious Kylo will also have a redemption story because of Rey.
     
    #373 Niamor, Mar 23, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2017
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  14. mrverylongusername

    mrverylongusername Rebelscum

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    Star wars has always been a fairy tale. Much more so than sci-fi. You could equally say that Rey is Ali Baba, Kylo is Abanazar, Maz is the genie and Anakin's sabre is the lamp.
     
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  15. MagnarTheGreat

    MagnarTheGreat Jedi General

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    It's not gonna be 'the evil murderer sees the light when he gets sex from a magic woman' like all these toxic power fantasies and beliefs.

    The Star Wars movies are about family and for families.

    Mod comment: modified offensive terms.



    EDIT: Perhaps it wasn't understood I was talking about the weirdos who hold the toxic belief that sexual love fixes all the worlds/people problems.
     
    #375 MagnarTheGreat, Mar 23, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2017
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  16. Niamor

    Niamor Rebel Official

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    [​IMG]

    Snoke "Kylo Ren, I watched the Galactic Empire rise, and then fall. The gullible prattle on about the triumph of truth and justice, of individualism and free will. As if such things were solid and real instead of simple subjective judgments. The historians have it all wrong. It was neither poor strategy nor arrogance that brought down the Empire. You know too well what did.”

    Ren nodded once. “Sentiment.”

    “Yes. Such a simple thing. Such a foolish error of judgment. A momentary lapse in an otherwise exemplary life. Had Lord Vader not succumbed to emotion at the crucial moment—had the father killed the son—the Empire would have prevailed. And there would be no threat of Skywalker’s return today."

    No it will be "the monster Kylo Ren will change and rebecome Ben Solo the "prince" because of Rey and the sentiments/compassion he has for her", history will repeat, Snoke and the First Order will be destroyed because of sentiment, the good sentiments of Kylo for Rey.
     
    #376 Niamor, Mar 23, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2017
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  17. mrverylongusername

    mrverylongusername Rebelscum

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    And that's the bit that I don't like. After the rehash of 'A New Hope' that was 'The Force Awakens', are we really heading lazily into a rehash of the ending of Jedi? Surely the LSG have something different up their sleeve?
     
  18. Valim

    Valim Rebel General

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    I can watch a million different films, a lot f fans don't want different. We want a 2017 modern take of our favourite 80's sci-fi fairytale, the family heros journey. This is the same story retold for a new generation, but more relevant.

    Retelling a GREAT story doesn't make it a bad one!

    Go mess with other franchises, leave our SW alone lol

    I've probably watch 4, 5, and 6 like a hundred times. I never got bored.
     
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  19. Niamor

    Niamor Rebel Official

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    Kylo is a Skywalker/Solo, it's clear he will be redeemed and will not die as a "bad guy" in Episode 9, and Rey is the reason he will leave the dark side and change, we have a lot of hints:

    [​IMG]

    the compassion line from the canon novelization:


    Kylo is manipulated by Snoke since birth, still from the canon novelization:

    "No. It was Snoke." Han drew back slightly. "Snoke?"

    She nodded. "He knew our child would be strong with the Force. That he was born with equal potential for good or evil."

    "You knew this from the beginning? Why didn't you tell me?"

    She sighed. "Many reasons. I was hoping that I was wrong, that it wasn't true. I hoped I could sway him, turn him away from the dark side, without having to involve you."

    He had trouble believing what he was hearing. "So Snoke was watching our son."

    "Always," she told him. "From the shadows, in the beginning, even before I realized what was happening, he was manipulating everything, pulling our son toward the dark side."


    and he's almost convinced by Han to leave the dark side, and he immediately regrets the murder of his father, JJ Abrams in his commentary of the movie:

    "People have asked me if I think that Kylo Ren was just playing with him the whole time, if he meant to kill him from the beginning. And the truth is, I think that Kylo Ren in this moment is actually being convinced to walk away from this. Snoke is, as Han says, using him. And I think that somewhere Ben knows this. But I think that he can’t accept it deep down. He has gone too far.

    But then, the idea was that in this moment, where he’s taking the lightsaber and offering it to him as a gesture, the sun finally is drained from the sky. And you see the light go away. And now they’re in this darkness. And darkness takes over. And as if this moment isn’t disturbing enough, he pushes the saber further in and says these terrifying two words. “Thank You.” In Kylo’s mind, what he has just done seals the deal. It’s the ultimate proof to Snoke that he is to be trusted, that he will not be seduced by the light. And I think, the instant that he’s done it, he regrets it."

    From the official Star Wars databank:

    "But he was intrigued when he captured Rey, a Jakku scavenger whose Force abilities were raw but very powerful. A mysterious connection seemed to link the two.

    But this shocking act of patricide didn’t make the former Ben Solo feel stronger – somehow he felt weaker. Kylo Ren had hoped to end the conflicts that caused him so such pain, but found he remained at war with himself, more lost than ever. "

    http://www.starwars.com/databank/kylo-ren

    now the good question is: it will be "familial compassion" (and Rey is the daughter of Luke or Leia/Han, a rehash of the original trilogy and the relation Luke/Vader) or love/romance (and Rey is not the daughter of Luke or Leia/Han, and we will have something new in the saga, a redemption through love/romance similar to Darth Revan and the female Jedi Bastila in KOTOR) that will bring back Kylo to the light?
     
    #379 Niamor, Mar 23, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2017
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  20. Moral Hazard

    Moral Hazard Force Sensitive

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    Thanks for sharing the clip - I hadn't noticed the soundtrack repetition before! I'm not sure about the commentary theory as the characters may not have had a Force bond with each other until after the sabre-calling scene? My first impression was that it was just a mysterious Force theme - an audio that cue something Forcey and disconcerting was happening that some viewers may otherwise miss.
    Warning bells should certainly ring when someone's pursuit to change, "save", or ease the pain of a ”villain” becomes harmful, self-destructive, or leads toward dis-empowerment.

    But attempts to help someone who's ill or in a dark place is generally considered an admirable quality. I think that where power lies and whether repetition and a cycle of abuse exist are fundamental to discerning whether the situation is healthy or unhealthy.

    Regardless of opinions, narratives like B&TB can be a great way to foster (basic school-yard bully type) discussions with younger people that explore the tension around when helping "baddies" might be appropriate or not.
    At least you don't need to worry about Rey being portrayed as a weak woman!

    The Devil Whispers.gif
    You cannot withstand the storm.gif
    The warrior replies.gif
    I am the storm.gif
    source
    Luckily, almost no-one is advocating or expecting any such narrative regarding Rey! ;) (Especially those in The Cantina partial to Reylo being explored providing Kylo makes a heel-faced turn.)
     
    #380 Moral Hazard, Mar 24, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2017
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