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The Darkside cave on Dagobah

Discussion in 'Original Trilogy' started by Ceruleanlord, Sep 8, 2014.

  1. Ceruleanlord

    Ceruleanlord Rebel General

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    This is one of the biggest mysteries in the original Trilogy.
    What was it?
    Why was it strong in the darkside?
    Is it the reason Yoda hid there?
    Will this ever be explained in the new canon or will it remain something we will never understand?
    Will it be in the sequel trilogy?
    If anyone has theories I'd like to know.

    Watching the scene when Luke enters the cave there seems to be edges of walls or doorways,
    I find it hard to believe it was a cave, but more like ruins, or a downed ship.
     
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  2. Djas Puhr

    Djas Puhr Clone Commander

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    This was one of the things I had hoped the Prequel Trilogy would address.
     
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  3. Voltar

    Voltar Rebel Trooper

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    Qui Gon says that Dagobah's one of the purest places in the galaxy and that's why force is strong there. Yoda only tells Luke that the cave itself is strong in the darkside. He was planting the idea so Luke would confront his fears. Qui Gon tells Yoda to give power to that which he fears and it will reveal itself to him.
     
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  4. Darth Pimp

    Darth Pimp Rebel Trooper

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    I think Dagobah will be re-visited in the ST and some decently defining exposition will finally answer the cave question ;)
     
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  5. Vegeta Fett

    Vegeta Fett Rebelscum

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    Yeah there was the Qui gon (qui-gon) episode in clone wars. I think it was old Sith (darth) or Jedi Ruins (ben). I am wondering what old ruins an secrets Luke will find in his future adventures,(x-wing) There are a lot of spots like this in KOTOR and I think there are just places in the galaxy were the force is stronger
     
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  6. Ben_Kenobi

    Ben_Kenobi Rebel General

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    I think it does the whole mystery of the force a disservice by assigning any properties to any particular planet or even distances between two people. Since childhood I interpreted the scene as an esoteric, supernatural experience, almost like a shaman's vision of what may be. In my fantasy it still has nothing to do with the planet, but Luke's understanding of the force.
     
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  7. SunnyD

    SunnyD Rebelscum

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    Personally, I don't think it really needs to be addressed or explained. It wasn't a crucial part of the movie; it was just technically a macguffin to show the audience Luke is not prepared to face what is to come, in a clever bit of foreshadowing. It feels mystical, unnatural, and it just a smaller part of a larger metaphor.

    Now, watch me get flamed for this - it's kind of like explaining how the Force works through midichlorians. There was no need to explain them through science - the fantastical mysticism of such a power need not be pored over in excruciating detail - let the viewer's imagination take hold.
     
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  8. Shawshank

    Shawshank Rebel General

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    Midichlorians don't make the force "not magical."

    So tired of this.

    All it did was explain why some people are strong in the Force and others are not (along with showing how ridiculously powerful Anakin could be).

    Some of you are so touchy about this crap. Knowing a little more about something doesn't "ruin it."

    Gee, I wish we never knew that Vader was Luke's dad...that makes it soooo less mysterious!

    Give me a break.
     
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  9. SunnyD

    SunnyD Rebelscum

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    My prediction comes true. You've missed my point entirely whilst whining about an unrelated issue. I was just comparing two things that, in my opinion didn't NEED to be explained. Not that they shouldn't, or George Lucas ruined my childhood or anything of the matter, all I said is that Midichlorians, like in-canon explanations of the Dagobah Cave, are not technically needed.

    You can take them or leave them. They don't technically add anything, neither do they necessarily detract. Just because you CAN put something in the film doesn't mean you always should. That is all. There was no need to go and spam this topic.

    Did I, for the record, say that "Midichlorians ruined Star Wars" as you imply?


    I also like how you claim "Some of you are so touchy about this crap."

    Shall I add your name to that list as well, seeing as you absolutely pounced on the opportunity to complain about how much you dislike people that dislike a certain thing?
     
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  10. SKYWATER

    SKYWATER 1030th Lieutenant (Jr Mod)

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    I have no opinion in the "midichlorian" issue. But it is interesting to read (it could have been in star wars insider mag.) that George had the idea of the midichlorians already in the 70s , but you just don't get to hear about it in the OT

    He also says about the force: "anyone can learn it, it's like learning Yoga or Karate, but some people/species have a better preposition for in their cells" ...But i don't know if that idea still applies in George's vision
     
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  11. Vegeta Fett

    Vegeta Fett Rebelscum

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    Either way it seemed like a comparison to me. I think there should be a separate topic for midichlorian as it seems to be a hot subject for discussion As for the cave on Dagobah I am sure they will go back to this in the future movies. Luke didn't know very many places like that and i am sure with the Jedi archives being destroyed he would have to go to such places to learn more about the force
     
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  12. Djas Puhr

    Djas Puhr Clone Commander

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    Just remember, the Midi-Chlorians are not the Force, anymore than Luke Skywalker is the Force.

    They are merely micro-organisms that can use the Force just as macro-organisms can.
     
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  13. Vegeta Fett

    Vegeta Fett Rebelscum

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  14. Shawshank

    Shawshank Rebel General

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    Pretty sure I didn't even read your post, or quote you. It was a general statement (in case you didn't notice) that stemmed from the many posts that repeat the "mysterious" mantra.

    Sounds like someone wanted to get "flamed."
     
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  15. Rebo

    Rebo Nearsighted Whill Guardian
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    Putting aside midichlorian battles, many new age religions/belief systems (of which I’d say jedi-ism qualifies) have a concept of energy and auras being created by living things. The older the living thing, the larger its aura. SO, seeing as the force (a variation on select eastern religious concepts much like many new age religions)is drawn from living things, it would stand to reason (even without prequel explanations) that an old and pure planet filled with plant and animal life, undisturbed by advanced civilization would be strong with the force.

    Just as someone may choose to meditate in the woods by a stream, in Star Wars logic, it would make sense that you may be able to draw more power from the force on Dagobah. This overabundance of force energy would likely shield yoda from the perception of others as well.

    As far as the cave goes, if we accept that there is a light side of the force and a dark side as Yoda teaches, then Dagobah would be as overrun with dark force energy as it is light. Perhaps the dark force is drawn to the cave for some reason. Perhaps some sort of elephant graveyard for an indigenous species. Maybe Yoda’s presence and power with the light side caused an imbalance forcing the displaced dark force to collect in one spot as a way to balance his presence. Who knows?

    But I don’t think you need to accept midichlorians to believe that Dagobah could be strong with the force. It is an organism in the universe just like any Jedi.
     
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  16. SunnyD

    SunnyD Rebelscum

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    Considering my post was the first in this thread to contain the word 'midichlorians,' with your off-topic rant following right after, I don't think it was illogical to assume you just glanced over my post, saw the word 'midichlorians' and decided you were just going to spout whatever you wanted, whenever you wanted.

    No, I didn't want to get flamed, I was just making a metaphorical comparison that was likely going to rustle somebody's jimmies, no matter what I said. I probably should have said something along the lines of "Now watch me get flamed and trolled for this..." because that's the vibe I'm getting from you right now.

    Let's cut this short, and just agree to disagree. We're getting off topic.
     
  17. Shawshank

    Shawshank Rebel General

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    True: you were the first to "say" Midichlorians.

    But you were not the first to bring up his the force was demystified and what not.

    Unless you're new to Star Wars related conversations, you should be able to easily read between the lines any time that sort of thing is brought up.

    Like I said. I don't recall reading your post. But if you insist on it, and it makes you feel better, fine, I flamed you. Hooray. I'm a liar and you get what ever badge of recognition you're searching for. After all, you DID ask for it...from a certain point of view.
     
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  18. Ben_Kenobi

    Ben_Kenobi Rebel General

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    @Shawshank @SunnyD Hey guys, thanks for your thoughts. It's nice to see these things matter to you. I made a reply on the midichlorians thread, please let me know what you think. I'd like your ideas.
     
  19. DEKKA129

    DEKKA129 Professional Slinger of Balderdash

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    Personally, I don't think it's always the best idea to over-explain everything.

    The cave on Dagobah has always been one of those fun things to ponder and discuss. Having watched ESB countless times over the years, I can tell you that the scene where Luke goes into that cave has meant subtly different things to me at different times. Not unlike a good song lyric, really.

    To me, that kind of experience is far more valuable and enjoyable than a hard and fast explanation that "it is precisely this..." would be.

    I think that this may be where we come up against comparisons between the Dagobah cave and the dreaded "m-word." Concrete explanations are all well and good, but part of the fun of the whole concept of the Force and various aspects like these has always been that open-endedness that allows for interpretation.

    (Your mileage may vary...)
     
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  20. Ben_Kenobi

    Ben_Kenobi Rebel General

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    @DEKKA129 I agree! Just like an interesting short story or a book keeps the world intriguing when it's up to the reader to fill in the gaps.
     
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