1. Due to the increased amount of spam bots on the forum, we are strengthening our defenses. You may experience a CAPTCHA challenge from time to time.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Notification emails are working properly again. Please check your email spam folder and if you see any emails from the Cantina there, make sure to mark them as "Not Spam". This will help a lot to whitelist the emails and to stop them going to spam.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. IMPORTANT! To be able to create new threads and rate posts, you need to have at least 30 posts in The Cantina.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Before posting a new thread, check the list with similar threads that will appear when you start typing the thread's title.
    Dismiss Notice

The First ORDER...crazy theory?!

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Last Jedi' started by ITG, Jul 19, 2017.

  1. ITG

    ITG Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2015
    Posts:
    1,268
    Likes Received:
    2,152
    Trophy Points:
    10,977
    Credits:
    3,035
    Ratings:
    +4,578 / 336 / -108
    It's been a while since I launched a crazy theory. So here we go.


    First of all, the BTS footage was phenomenal! My excitement levels are through the roof!

    Now let's get to it...


    Ok, Snoke's ship is a huge version of the Empire Star Destroyers. Why so similar to what we've already seen before? It's identical. It's too coincidental.

    Now think....

    The First ORDER. Kylo's random reference to a "clone army" in TFA. Snoke's wealth.

    I put it to you that the FIRST ORDER is a reference to a deal Plagueis (stay with me!) made before the "Army of the Republic" was created. Plagueis' First ORDER was kept secret while he retreated to the Unknown regions after his "death" at the hands of his apprentice. Plagueis, who at this point, has abandoned the Sith and his Darth title, is waiting to strike after the Empire vs Republic war, the fall of the Sith and end of the Jedi. Only Luke survived. The last Jedi.

    Plagueis sat back and watched all this unfold. He knows exactly what transpired. Intimate details. The TFA novel expands on this.

    As he knows that Luke is impossible to turn -after the events of ROTJ - he focuses his attention on Ben Solo. He's the only one who can help destroy the Skywalker's.

    The First Order salvage what they can from the remnants of the Empire and launch their bid for galactic domination. This is why it took so long for Plagueis to return. He's still healing but his army and his apprentice are now ready.

    Plagueis confirmed. Sorry Pablo.
     
    • Original x 6
    • Old News x 5
    • Like x 3
    • Funny x 2
    • Hopeful x 2
    • Great Post x 1
    • Clouded x 1
  2. Pastor Barndog

    Pastor Barndog Force Attuned

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2014
    Posts:
    4,391
    Likes Received:
    5,585
    Trophy Points:
    16,317
    Credits:
    6,765
    Ratings:
    +9,458 / 246 / -104
    You want to go home and rethink your life.(obi-wan 2)
     
    • Funny Funny x 11
    • Like Like x 4
    • Trolling Trolling x 1
  3. DarthFuller22

    DarthFuller22 Rebel Trooper

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2017
    Posts:
    60
    Likes Received:
    142
    Trophy Points:
    167
    Credits:
    530
    Ratings:
    +192 / 2 / -1
    I respect the imagination! My only argument against it, is what would you say Palpatine's role is then? I ask this, because in the Aftermath novels, it is very obvious that Palps has some sort of "contingency" plan set up involving the outer reaches. So do you think he knew what Plagueis was doing out there, or could sense him? I have a feeling that our boy Palps is going to be a lot more involved in this Snoke situation than we thought, even it is just that he "signaled" for this unknown, very force sensitive creature we are calling Snoke.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  4. ITG

    ITG Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2015
    Posts:
    1,268
    Likes Received:
    2,152
    Trophy Points:
    10,977
    Credits:
    3,035
    Ratings:
    +4,578 / 336 / -108
    Maybe he knew Plagueis was up to something suspicious in the unknown regions, but never found out exactly what his old master was planning. To be honest, I don't know. I've had 6 painkillers today...and a beer. About to pop another.
     
    • Informative Informative x 2
  5. DarthPilkington

    DarthPilkington Rebel Official

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2014
    Posts:
    1,289
    Likes Received:
    1,805
    Trophy Points:
    6,937
    Credits:
    4,710
    Ratings:
    +3,237 / 97 / -34
    this theory is less crazy and more Plagueis-y :confused:

    watch out man, mixing barbiturates and alcohol is risky business!
     
    • Funny Funny x 4
    • Wise Wise x 3
  6. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2016
    Posts:
    3,481
    Likes Received:
    3,898
    Trophy Points:
    12,517
    Credits:
    6,786
    Ratings:
    +7,941 / 410 / -137
    While this theory is unlikely I find even this more desirable to be true than "Snoke the Palpatine's Librarian" theories because any Plagueis = Snoke version grants a powerfull Snoke simply because Plagueis appears to be the most powerfull Darksider that ever lived (dead or alive).

    If he still lives, he is bad , he is mad, he is powerfull and wise over the charts, and galaxy is in Big Dudu.....
     
    #6 McDiarmid, Jul 20, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2017
    • Like Like x 1
    • Wise Wise x 1
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  7. semiote

    semiote Rebel General

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2015
    Posts:
    290
    Likes Received:
    535
    Trophy Points:
    4,272
    Credits:
    1,258
    Ratings:
    +939 / 12 / -3
    You said the First Order is a deal, but who did he make the deal with, and what did they receive in return? Why does he retreat to the Unknown Regions in the first place? I think maybe your explanation is incomplete...
     
    • Like Like x 3
  8. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2016
    Posts:
    3,481
    Likes Received:
    3,898
    Trophy Points:
    12,517
    Credits:
    6,786
    Ratings:
    +7,941 / 410 / -137
    Money?Capitalists always have interest in arming and rearming.Snoke obviously has links with large Galactic capital and polithicians.It is said that main arms suppliers for the Republic have formed"sister companies"which operate in the unknown regions and supply arms for the First Order, bypassing law that forbids selling arms to the FO.
    Plagueis had links with banking clans and large capital,at least in now decanonized material.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  9. Pastor Barndog

    Pastor Barndog Force Attuned

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2014
    Posts:
    4,391
    Likes Received:
    5,585
    Trophy Points:
    16,317
    Credits:
    6,765
    Ratings:
    +9,458 / 246 / -104
    Plagueis is sooooooo amazing his aprentice killed him and then he hid for 60. He renounces the Sith you because loop hole problems. 30 years after the aprentice died he finally manages to come out.

    The idea that people have learned unique powers through the force doesn't necessarily make them more powerful. Kylo is the first FS we see hitting people with paralysis, and freezing blaster bolts.

    He has different powers because he deficated the time to learn. DP learned to keep others alive. Great power. Is that more powerful than reading minds? More powerful than surpressing the force abilities of thousands of Jedi so they have diminished prediction ability.

    DP is off the table anyway.

    Snoke is very possibly a real threat. But the idea that he is so unbelievably powerful is only an assumption. If he is soooo ridiculously powerful he needs no apprentice, no 1st Order, no SKB.

    You can strawman argue Snoke "the librarian" all you want but your DESIRE and SPECULATION aren't evidence.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Great Post Great Post x 1
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  10. DarthFuller22

    DarthFuller22 Rebel Trooper

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2017
    Posts:
    60
    Likes Received:
    142
    Trophy Points:
    167
    Credits:
    530
    Ratings:
    +192 / 2 / -1
    My other thing with the whole Plagueis being Snoke thing, is what that does to Palpatine. It has been our belief this whole time that Palpatine is basically the strongest dark side user we have seen. He manipulated an entire galaxy to his will, and clouded the entire Jedi Order to his existence. But, if you then tell us that Plagueis has actually just been chillin and watching everything go down, then I feel like that undermines everything that Palpatine has done, and makes him look lesser of a dark side user.

    @Pastor Barndog makes a good point in saying that it is simply an assumption that Snoke is unbelievably powerful. I just feel like from a franchise standpoint, Star Wars needs to almost one-up the previous villain, which is not going to be easy.

    So basically I'm conflicted and no matter what they do, I know Kathleen Kennedy will make sure it's done right.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Great Post Great Post x 1
  11. Pastor Barndog

    Pastor Barndog Force Attuned

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2014
    Posts:
    4,391
    Likes Received:
    5,585
    Trophy Points:
    16,317
    Credits:
    6,765
    Ratings:
    +9,458 / 246 / -104
    Put a gun to my head and I think that Snoke is a powerful darksider. More sorcerer than sabre twirling. He is like different but similar in threat to past villains. IF he is the true BBEG. Kylo already by the start of TFA is the one responsible for destruction of all the happy endings for the OT heroes and the one who took out Han whom both ST leads had developed strong ties. I don't think its impossible that we will see Snoke killed and displaced by his student.

    Power is just spectacle. Villians are about the emotion they bring to the story.

    Joker in the Dark Knight couldn't take Bats in a straight fight. But he was a much better villain than Doomsday in BvS.

    Good stories are compelling because they risk and frustrate the heroes.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  12. master_shaitan

    master_shaitan Jedi General

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2015
    Posts:
    7,119
    Likes Received:
    10,295
    Trophy Points:
    144,192
    Credits:
    15,738
    Ratings:
    +19,243 / 799 / -292
    But Plagueis provides the perfect solution to this problem.
    He is "one up" on Palpatine in that he "cheated death" and has a different connection to the Skywalker family but at the same time, Palpatine legitimately "defeated him" and was the only one able to take over the galaxy the way the Sith did in the PT.

    Plagueis is a different villain, more powerful in some ways, for this new trilogy - whilst maintaining a strong and direct connection to the Skywalker family.
    A newbie Snoke simply makes Palpatine be the lesser villain and is shoe horned into the saga.

    Having said that, @ITG's latest theory is as clumsy at it is stupid. :p
     
  13. DarthFuller22

    DarthFuller22 Rebel Trooper

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2017
    Posts:
    60
    Likes Received:
    142
    Trophy Points:
    167
    Credits:
    530
    Ratings:
    +192 / 2 / -1
    You make really good points! I guess perosnally, I have just always been against the Plageuis is Snoke thing. I don't really have any reasons, but ever sine that theory came out I have been skeptical of it. But, as I said before, I will support whatever Kathleen Kennedy and the rest of the folks over there at Lucasfilms decide to do, because I think they have done a great job so far!
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  14. cawatrooper

    cawatrooper Dungeon Master

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2016
    Posts:
    4,818
    Likes Received:
    21,980
    Trophy Points:
    149,167
    Credits:
    19,951
    Ratings:
    +26,705 / 65 / -37
    Not sure about Plagueis, but how have I never considered that THE FIRST ORDER could be Order 1 from the series that contained Order 66? It seems so obvious, and I'm sure many fans have already made that connection. I feel like an idiot. :p
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Wise Wise x 1
  15. Qui Gons Gin

    Qui Gons Gin Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2017
    Posts:
    184
    Likes Received:
    2,842
    Trophy Points:
    10,817
    Credits:
    3,411
    Ratings:
    +3,014 / 5 / -1
    I'm OK with Snoke being Plagueis and personally I love the crazy theory. I wouldn't be mad at all if this is how his arc went. They could make it work with some wiggle here and a jiggle there. I also like the idea of a thread of an underlying story element that has been present albeit in the back ground throughout the whole series, popping up to pull everything together in a neat package. If these last three are suppose to wrap you the three trilogy saga, why not use Plagueis as the vehicle to achieve that? He has been in the shadows the entire time anyway (providing he really did survive the Palp beating)
    --- Double Post Merged, Jul 20, 2017, Original Post Date: Jul 20, 2017 ---
    Dont feel like an id10t! I didn't make that connection till now myself when I read your post!
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 2
  16. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2015
    Posts:
    16,794
    Likes Received:
    15,181
    Trophy Points:
    149,777
    Credits:
    20,163
    Ratings:
    +26,536 / 845 / -253
    To be fair, manipulating people isn't a power...anyone can do it if they know what to say
     
    • Like Like x 4
  17. DarthFuller22

    DarthFuller22 Rebel Trooper

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2017
    Posts:
    60
    Likes Received:
    142
    Trophy Points:
    167
    Credits:
    530
    Ratings:
    +192 / 2 / -1
    Truth. I mean look at our current Sith Emper... I mean president
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  18. ITG

    ITG Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2015
    Posts:
    1,268
    Likes Received:
    2,152
    Trophy Points:
    10,977
    Credits:
    3,035
    Ratings:
    +4,578 / 336 / -108
    • Funny Funny x 2
    • Hopeful Hopeful x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    • Wise Wise x 1
  19. Fearghas_Ajax

    Fearghas_Ajax Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2015
    Posts:
    1,427
    Likes Received:
    2,644
    Trophy Points:
    10,967
    Credits:
    4,118
    Ratings:
    +4,146 / 27 / -18
    Bahahaha.... think that sums up the Snoke=Plaguies in one word! lol

    I honestly Snoke has to be all that powerful himself to cause too much turmoil in these times. In 30 years, the Republic still isn't together. Didn't even think the FO was a threat. Had a spllinter cell (the resistance) to break off to combat the threat of the FO. The FO has been in disarray hiding in the unkown regions. The Last Jedi has even had a tough time and has been absent from the scene for a while. Wouldn't take much power to rise and lead the FO. Messa things Snoke could just as easily be the offspring of Jar Jar Binks. Its a crazy galaxy. lol
     
  20. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2015
    Posts:
    16,794
    Likes Received:
    15,181
    Trophy Points:
    149,777
    Credits:
    20,163
    Ratings:
    +26,536 / 845 / -253
    TRUM---#DARTHPLAGEUISCONFIRMED
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
Loading...

Share This Page