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The Idea of Canon in the new era

Discussion in 'General Movie Discussion' started by Keri Ford, Sep 5, 2019.

  1. Keri Ford

    Keri Ford Clone Commander

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    David Stewart whose Star Wars videos I find always thoughtful even if I disagree with him, posted an interesting vlog stating the thesis that Disney Star Wars is not canon.



    I think he makes some important points and it's worth considering the idea of canon because it actually has quite a strong effect on the way we react to the movies, also Disney Star Wars after they bought the rights to Star Wars changed the status of the EU books and comics to non canon and started issuing new "canonical" books and comics as well as the films.

    I would recommend people before commenting on this thread watch Stewart's video posted above, but I'll try to give the basic arguments as I understand them here.

    Works of art whether it be books, music or film are created by individuals and the quality and inspiration of those individuals count. With a book it's generally pretty obvious, JRR Tolkien created middle earth, he created the characters of Gandalf Frodo Legolas Aragorn et al and canonical stories are those created by him. The Beatles were four people John Paul George and Ringo and they produced two singles after they had broken up and after John had died and the way they gave those legitimacy is that they finished off demo versions of songs that John had started. There are other bands like Yes and the Soft Machine that go through changes where from the start to the finish of the band it has no members that are the same so are they the same band? The band has the legal rights to the name but the nature of the music they are making is very different because it is made by different people and fans of the band may no longer support the band when particular members are no longer in the band because of the specific qualities that member brought to the table. To me it makes no sense to assume you should like a bands music that has no band members in common just because they have the same name as they had before.

    Now with movies the situation is a bit more complex because we have a lot more people involved, but I think the same criteria applies. Now the story of Star Wars comes from George Lucas and the film company Lucas films was named after him, many people have claimed that the OT was so good because George Lucas vision was channeled through Marcia Lucas editing and Empire Strikes Back because of Irvin Kershner's directing and that an essential quality of the Star Wars films is the music of John Williams. I think this is all true and there is a hierarchy of importance, as much as you might need electricians or gofers they aren't going to make a significant difference to the movie as to who you use, whereas who the lead actor is who the director and writer is more strongly effects what the film is like. The entity "Disney" is an abstraction, Disney does not make movies people do.

    So while George Lucas can sell the rights to Star Wars all that really means is that the Disney corporation has the right to sue anybody else who makes products that they call Star Wars.
    So what continuity is there between the original 6 movies and the ST, or for that matter between the OT and the PT. I think it is quite legitimate for people to regard the input of the actors Carrie Fisher, Mark Hamill and Harrison Ford as an essential element. Between the ST and OT we have more cross over of actors than we do between the OT and the PT. But George Lucas oversaw the OT and the PT. If you think Mark Hamill, Harrison Ford Carrie Fisher and John Williams were the key ingredients that make up the greatness of Star Wars and it wasn't the story writing and directing that was the most important then you can make a case for ST being canon, but if directing and story is important you can't.

    The bottom line is that being able to buy a franchise but if you regarded George Lucas as the primary creator, as I do, well Disney did not buy Lucas creativity and infact they decided to reject the Sequel story that Lucas gave them (even though they may have used elements of it) and they rejected the EU which had existed in the Lucas era.

    So what does this mean for us as fans? It doesn't necessarily mean we need to like the PT more than the ST or any one film more than another. But what I think it does mean is that being a Star Wars fan throughout the OT and PT eras does not mean you should be expected to a ST fan. The creative qualities expressed in the Disney era are different because the creators are different.

    I realise that these issues can be contentious among fans, but I think it is better to be aware of them and discuss them sensibly than to have them as unarticulated issues lurking in the backgrounds of discussion, my intention is to provide clarity rather than to sow discontent. I hope it leads to sensible discussion of the arguments. Do you think creator and creation can be entirely separated? Can an abstract entity, or corporation, create works of art?
     
  2. Sithdämon

    Sithdämon Guest

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    strictly only Lucas stuff is canon and to think of TLJ as fanfic is consoling but i accept disney as canon till the day they sell SW and their stuff will be rebranded as legends again.:D
     
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  3. Maximum7

    Maximum7 Clone

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    Very good video
     
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