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SPECULATION The Lightsaber Theory is Problematic

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Last Jedi' started by BespinMinersUnion1138, Apr 24, 2017.

  1. BespinMinersUnion1138

    BespinMinersUnion1138 Force Sensitive

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    I recently watched the YouTube video of the The Lightsaber Theory. It's compelling, but I think the theorist has his timeline wrong.

    We know that Rey was dropped off at Jakku roughly a decade before the events of TFA. We also know from Bloodline that Ben and Luke were off together roughly 5-6 years before the events of TFA. Now the theorist seems to think we are seeing the events of the Rain Massacre from Luke's perspective, but I'm not buying what he's selling there.

    I do agree that the lightsaber is the key to everything. And I do like the idea of Luke passing down the lightsaber to Rey's parents. But, as I've mentioned in a previous post, I seem to think Ben was acting out as Kylo long before the events of Bloodline and that it was because of these dips into the darkside at the beckoning of Snoke that forced Leia to push Ben to join Luke as they looked for Jedi relics etc.

    It is my belief that when Ben learns about his bloodline, he gets really angry. I think this is the point at which he burns down the temple and kills the other Jedi students - perhaps in an attempt to get them to follow him a fight breaks out - remember at one point he offers to train Rey in TFA. Perhaps by the time Luke gets there the fight is over and the temple is burned to the ground.

    So my feeling is the Rain Massacre and the Temple Burning are two separate events. I think Rey was at the Rain Massacre as a small child. But she was not at the temple.
     
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  2. Lego Han

    Lego Han Rebel Official

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    It certainly is a well made video. If people haven't seen it I've embedded it below.

     
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  3. Jedi MD

    Jedi MD Jedi Commander

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    I agree the rain scene and the temple burning scene are two different events and while this theory is very well thought out, the timeline is off and does not seem to match up with what we know.
     
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  4. JeffG.

    JeffG. Ewok Hunter
    1030th General **** (Mod)

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    Here is a theory about Rey's vision from the lightsaber's perspective. It doesn't have anything to do with her parents and there are a couple of differences from the video above. Anyway, it's a fun theory.

     
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  5. TheWhiplash

    TheWhiplash Rebel Commander

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    Lets just imagine this trilogy is original one...

    We'll see it all in prequels(epic fail)
     
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  6. Rayjefury

    Rayjefury Force Sensitive

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    Interesting. The idea that the vision was told exclusively through the LS makes a LOT of sense. If this is the truth, and it seems to work for most of the scenes, the hallway and the battle in the snow on SKB we know for certain are places were the LS was. It seems reasonable that it was every other place too, the rain massacre, the temple burning, and Rey being dropped off, the only question is who was in possession of it. I look forward to finding out. Great thread though. Thanks for posting.
     
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  7. BespinMinersUnion1138

    BespinMinersUnion1138 Force Sensitive

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    Another problem is the view of the ship leaving Jakku is from young Rey's perspective - not the sabers. If anything, I think vision is the LS calling out to Rey - or in effect the Force "awakening" in Rey. See what I did there?
     
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  8. Rayjefury

    Rayjefury Force Sensitive

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    Unless the LS was left with Unkar Platt as well
     
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  9. BespinMinersUnion1138

    BespinMinersUnion1138 Force Sensitive

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    I sincerely doubt that. Platt took Rey and his payment for his troubles was taking the Falcon. I think originally the idea of the Force Back WAS from the LS perspective, but that ended when the story stopped being about getting Luke's lightsaber away from Ren and more about finding Luke. This is why I contend Rey was a baby or small child, whom Ben saved. But then he saw a vision that she'd kill him, so he ensured his dad's ship would be stolen and end up with Unkar Platt, and then dropped her off on Jakku with UP. After he finds out his lineage, he goes full batshit anger and kills a whole bunch of Luke's students when they don't follow him.
     
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  10. Rayjefury

    Rayjefury Force Sensitive

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    It's possible but not altogether plausible based on the information we have that the LS was given to UP for sake keeping, I'll grant you that. But it's all speculation at this point I suppose, so I don't see any reason why each of the visions shouldn't have to do with pivotal moments at which the LS was present. I will also say this, one thing each vision also seems to have in common is they center around family. Luke learns who Darth Vader is on Cloud City, Kylo kills his father on SK, we are led to believe that the shuttle that leaves Rey is piloted by family members (speculation I know). It stands to reason that the remaining visions could be about family as well (Luke and the temple, and the Rain Massacre).
     
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  11. BespinMinersUnion1138

    BespinMinersUnion1138 Force Sensitive

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    Originally, the Rain Massacre was Kylo killing a clan to get Anakin's lightsaber. Obviously that's been changed. How that's changed is anyone's guess, but I do think there is a good chance the events of the Forceback are out of order because based on Bloodline, the Jedi school was destroyed AFTER Rey was dropped off on Jakku.
     
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  12. BaranDo91

    BaranDo91 Rebelscum

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    Normally, I am not the biggest fan when it comes to theories like this. I find a lot of them tend to be based on scant evidence and make too many assumptions. That said, I checked this theory out and wow; this is one of the best well-crafted theories I have seen. The presenter's logic and evidence to how he got to the conclusion is by no means circular. And by simply relying on movie evidence, he was able to piece together a fairly good picture.

    Does it have problems with the time line? Of course. But really, I see a good chunk of this theory, if not, all of it making sense. Why?

    1) It fits JJ's MO:
    As much as I cannot stand Mystery Box storytelling(TV shows it is okay, but I find ti lazy), the revelation would work in the context of TFA in that it explains most of what that vision was. It also explains why Kylo Ren doesn't recognize her. And would give legimacy to why he is pissed off and so irritable.

    2) Fitting in the context of the movies:
    LucasFilm made it very clear that they wanted to have the New Canon tie with the movies, but that the movies were what they focused on. What the theorist presents works well within the context of the movie. And as he said, is simple enough to be understood by casual and hardcore movie fans. As for the New Canon, I can easily see the canon fleshing this out completely. But it is a concept that by itself without any periphery material, works.

    3) It makes it about the next generation:
    I know a lot of people want Rey to be a Kenobi or a Skywalker or even a Palpatine(that would be balsy if LucasFilm does that. Man). But I'm sorry that takes so much away from Rey.

    And would shrink the Universe which sucks. The important part I feel that this ST needs to do is stand on its legs. By having Rey(or even most of the new trinity) be related to anyone I argue undemrines that. It would be like if the Avatar the Last Airbender sequel was focused on Aang's child rather than a new character.

    Let Rey be her own character. Let her share similiarities to Luke's journey, but let her forge her own path. It is no far stretch that there can be other powerful Force Sensitives other than the Skywalkers. Legends provded this with characters, like Revan, Nomi Sunrider and even Erin Leenir. I want Rey to stand alongside those characters and be cool/unique because of who she is. Not because of who she was related to.

    Overall, I do see a lot of merit in the Lightsaber theory. Do I think LucasFilm actually followed through on this? Tough to say. But I wouldn't doubt if a good chunk of it was true.
     
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  13. Paul Resendes

    Paul Resendes Rebel General

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    I think this theory is a very interesting one. Unfortunately I think we need to dismiss the part about Rey's parents for the simple fact that we know the massacre takes place 5 yrs before TFA and we know Rey is left on Jakku yrs before the massacre.
    That said this has my brain thinking overtime. Especially the part about the force back and the lightsaber. Just had a million thoughts go through my head and I want to touch base on my thoughts. But first there's some things I need to refresh my memory on. Need to go back to some of the original rumors on TFA, because some things take hindsigh. Also need to rewatch the force back scene in TFA tonight. Also there's an episode of The Clone Wars that I think is important that I need to rewatch that has a connection to this very theory. Wow very interesting stuff. Gonna look into some of these things and spit out some ideas.
     
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  14. CTownDrama

    CTownDrama Clone Commander

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    Yeah i have trouble piecing this together with the lightsaber theory. Like you said Paul Resendes, Rey was left before the Massacre so i'm not sure how that will fit in with this theory.
     
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  15. Rayjefury

    Rayjefury Force Sensitive

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    Very good point
     
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  16. Darth Basin The Greatest

    Darth Basin The Greatest Rebel Official

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    Guys, look, we can talk all about Rey This or Rey That but we need to look at the bigger picture.

    Han is dead, Carrie is gone ( R.I.P.), I don't think Luke will survive this trilogy. Now I'm not going to go into a rambling on if we need a 4th Trilogy or not but we're getting 15 more years of SW. If the Skywalker Bloodline is going to go on we just have 2 realistic options.

    Rey & Ren/Ben.

    Now the $64,000 question in which I think is a bigger plot then Rey's lineage. Is KR going to survive. I'm 75% sure he will not survive. Unless before Han met Leia, he had a.........whoops gotta keep it PG. So that's it. No more Solos. That is the end of a legendary family.

    So who we down 2 in a potential Episode X? Just Rey. Oh now I'm sure we'll get FG Luke. Maybe we'll get a vision of KR in Force Hell. Gotta make every trilogy darker, right? Now if she is just "Rey" then that's that. The end of the Skywalkers. Forever a family cursed.

    Rey Palpatine doesn't do it 4 me & nether does Rey Kenobi. Let old Ben have his own movie instead. Also the concept of Adult Adoption is 4 generation Snowflake.

    And Reylo......



    NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! (vader)


    So please, Disney 4 the sake of this loyal fan who's went through the dark times (circa 1989) & the good times (TCW 4 the win!) give me Rey Skywalker!




    Or Rey Solo!

    Or even Rey clone outta left field!
     
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  17. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

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    To add to your belief, or maybe even help refine it, maybe the other students find out and tried to expel Ben from the academy. Only Luke was on his side. As a result, the other students turn on them and Ben uses the dark side and Snoke's influences to get the better of all of them and ends up massacring the entire temple. Luke loves his nephew too much to kill him so he banishes Ben and he goes off to find the origins of the jedi in order to carry out the true teachings of the jedi order to rpevent something like this from happening again. Ben killed Rey's parents in his haste but she was too young to remember and always looked to Luke as a sort of father figure/uncle so he dropped her off on Jakku.

    In regards to the rain massacre, that might have been the first physical attempt at infiltrating the new jedi order by Snoke to retrieve the important artifacts from the OT era that have to do with vader which is why Luke gave the saber to Maz and why I personally think that the millenium falcon ending up on jakku was really Luke manipulating things behind the scenes.
    .
     
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