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The Sequel Trilogy has an Identity Crisis

Discussion in 'General Sequel Trilogy Discussion' started by DarthSnow, Aug 20, 2020.

  1. DarthSnow

    DarthSnow Master of Coin
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    [​IMG]

    Star Wars
    is about the Skywalkers.

    The prequels had Anakin.
    The OT had Luke & Leia.
    The sequels had Ben.

    2 of those 3 trilogies embraced the Skywalker blood. One of them -- at times -- seemed to happen in spite of it. Why did it feel to me that Ben Solo, a Skywalker by blood, was set aside for someone else -- a scavenger??

    Now, a couple things before anyone starts lighting torches and dusting off the pitchforks. I love Rey, and I do enjoy the ST just as much as the other trilogies, sometimes more. But it still has plenty of flaws, just as the others do. I'm not trying to single it out, but I am going to single out what I feel was the ST's greatest mistake:

    Ben / Kylo Ren should have been front & center for the entire trilogy. It should have been told primarily from his vantage point instead of the dual story lines that we received, skewed in favor of Rey. And again, I love Rey. BUT... Rey should have been the clear supporting role, instead of (what felt like to me) a forced co-lead.

    To circle back to the Prequels, it was clearly all about Anakin. Yes, Obi-Wan and Padme were very huge parts of the story. But it was Anakin's story. Just as much as the OT was Luke & Leia's story, with Han and Chewie and the dynamic droid duo carrying plenty of the weight as well. But to my original point, it's a Skywalker saga, right? So why is Ben getting the shaft?

    Episodes VII - IX should have been custom tailored for the story of Kylo Ren becoming Ben Solo, but instead it felt like a side show to something else. And if we had had that clear lead, the whole story would have flowed much more smoothly. Heck -- flip the screen time for Rey (129 minutes) and Ben (55 minutes) and most "problems" will sort out themselves. While both characters were fantastic in their own way, their stories deserved a different amount of focus. It was too much to tell both in one trilogy.

    **disclaimer: no chatter about Hollywood "politics", assumed Disney agenda, SJW, blah blah bloopity blah, please. As always we are talking about fiction here, and fictitious characters. Let's keep it that way. Thank you.**
     
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  2. Use the Falchion

    Use the Falchion Jedi Contrarian

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    I have a lot of thoughts on how to handle this discussion prompt, but I guess it boils down to: for this to have worked, we would have had to watch Kylo's descent into darkness, not him as a dark character, and lot more would have changed as well.
    From the descent, we'd have to mash up his pre-TFA story along with his TLJ story, and throw in some other things. Rey could be seen as a teetering point, a glimpse into Ben's future. Whatever she is, he would oppose...until they find out about her past, and then it switches to them being Kindred Spirits. And finally, Ben would have to learn to accept his own fate, outside of Rey's. Would this mean she dies and he lives? Would this mean that they both live, and Reylos rejoice? Does that mean something else entirely? I'm not sure.
     
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  3. DarthSnow

    DarthSnow Master of Coin
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    I'm not necessarily sold on that being included in the ST, but yes we definitely need to see it eventually. In the OT Vader was a clear cut baddie from the get go and then for 98% of the story before he came back to the light. Of course we eventually did get his full story in the prequels, and I've really got a hankering for the same treatment for Ben's background.

    They did a great job with humanizing the villain in this trilogy, I will say that. Some of the scenes of the ST that stand out most in my mind are the ones of Kylo dealing with that internal conflict: Talking to his grandfather's mask. Smashing the mask. Hesitating on pulling that trigger. The bridge. There was plenty there to work with, and while I loved what we got I feel like we only scratched the surface of it.

    I don't think the focus should have been another Rebels vs Empire. Keep that in the background, sure. It should have been Ben's family and friends trying to pull him out of the position he is in... which there was, but there was so much more "Nah man that kid's a lost cause, lets just blow stuff up." Yeah that's going to lead to fun lightsaber duels and space battles, but don't just make it an all out assault again (or do, but use that as a distraction) ... the way the Resistance should have won was to win back their fallen son and bring a peace to the galaxy in that manner somehow.

    Even as I write this I am thinking how close we were to that. I do think Rey was used properly, she was the driving force in trying to save Ben Solo. She had that youthful exuberance for making things right that everyone else had lost. She was stellar in that regard. But in the end, instead of Ben's past being reconciled properly, it was all about Rey's journey. Which again I did enjoy... I just wish the same care and consideration had been applied to Ben's character.
     
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  4. Use the Falchion

    Use the Falchion Jedi Contrarian

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    That's fair! I guess for me, for this to have worked, we'd need to see Ben have a sort of Dark-side Hero's Journey. An inverse of Luke and Anakin's journeys, with the "obligatory plot twist" being that Anakin died as Anakin, not as Darth Vader; this would send Ben into a spiral, and to me, THAT'S where Rey would come in. But I guess I just can't see it with the story is the way it is now. There are too many moving parts, too many characters I'm afraid would be left out. At the very least, this would have to be a parallel story being told, and film isn't always the best structure for that.
    I agree that this latest trilogy should have focused on a Skywalker, but I guess I disagree on who the Skywalker should have been and how they should have been focused on.
    I'm not sure if this is making sense, or if I'm going of on a different tangent lol!
     
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  5. DarthSnow

    DarthSnow Master of Coin
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    This is a very tangential discussion so feel free! I'm assuming you mean Luke as the prime Skywalker? I have some thoughts on that as well, but I need to let it marinate for a bit. But in a nutshell: Rey's mystery background is exchanged for either her being a former student of Luke's, or having a connection to Luke / Ben in some other fashion. And then you swap the viewpoints of Luke and Rey. Luke is still actively trying to redeem Ben, but Rey is in hiding and has given up and wants nothing to do with the Jedi or force in general. But somehow Luke knows he needs her to save Ben.
     
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  6. Use the Falchion

    Use the Falchion Jedi Contrarian

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    It wasn't, but I like this a LOT better than the previous ideas! The idea of Luke, having failed, coming back and asking for his students' help to atone for his failures...there's something utterly human in that. It's brave yet vulnerable (all forgiveness is vulnerable, and it's always harder than people think it is); there's a sense of proactiveness on Luke's side that separates him from his thematic predecessors of Obi-Wan and Yoda. OT fans get their last hurrah, and the theme of handing the baton off can be done with the original gang meeting...yeah, I'm liking this.

    (My original idea was for Finn to be the Skywalker - which I still 100% believe he is/should have been - and Rey to either be the nobody or the Palpatine (I've come around on Rey Palpatine for thematic reasons, even if the narrative bungled the execution). From there it could be about Finn - the man with no past - learning that he does come from somewhere and he does have family out there, but he doesn't need to follow in their footsteps. In the end, it could end in a different conclusion than the OT did. Where Luke tried to save his father, Finn would ultimately decide to kill his cousin. Where Leia discovers that Luke is her brother, she would also discover that Rey and/or Poe is another child to her as well (via adoption/mentoring rather than actual birth). In the end, Kylo dies a villain, Finn forges his own path, and Rey has a family.)
     
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  7. NinjaRen

    NinjaRen Supreme Leader

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    A real brave move would have been the following:
    Kylo Ren as the protagonist. We follow a young Skywalker villain and his journey on the dark side of the force.

    Instead of a light side trio we then have a dark side trio. Maybe Kylo, Hux and Phasma.

    Or we have Kylo as the protagonist on the dark side and Finn as the portagonist on the light side.
    Why not Rey, you may ask? Because she's pretty much a female Luke. We don't need this. Finn would be a better choice, especially because he hast something to do with Kylo's First Order.

    But I'm getting off-topic here- so I agree with you, @DarthSnow, Kylo/Ben should have been the main character of the ST.
     
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  8. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    The ST should have embraced Rey Nobody and stayed on the path of moving beyond special magical bloodlines.
    Making it about "A Skywalker" in the end is a symptom of lack of creativity on the part of Lucasfilm.
     
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  9. DarthSnow

    DarthSnow Master of Coin
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    I think thats more just the natural continuation of things. Luke, Leia, and Han's stories can't continue forever. But we love those characters, so they need to continue somehow. The natural conclusion is to carry it on through their kids, but yes there also needs to be "new blood" too. One of the better story beats of the ST was that of stormtroopers defecting, particularly those strong with the force, all who presumably came from nothing. And it was barely even a thing until 2/3 of the way through the third part of the trilogy, and if you're not paying very close attention you're not even going to catch it. They were just so close to knocking it out of the park on so many things... I still love what we got, but what could have been will always haunt me.
     
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  10. RockyRoadHux

    RockyRoadHux Ginger General

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    Rey and Ben souls and their stories are bonded by the force. He’s the other half of her, therefore she just had to take his name. He gave her his life. But making her a Palpatine wasn't needed.
     
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  11. Messi

    Messi G.O.A.T.

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    Agree.

    The story were doing great until the release of TROS. I just think they complicated too much revealing that Rey was a Palpatine and daughter of a clone of Palpatine :confused:!!!
     
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  12. Veronica

    Veronica Rebel Commander

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    I disagree. I do agree that Ben should have gotten a bit more screen time at least in TROS. But what you stated above sounds like a generic cliched story about an angry young man coming back to find himself. Yes that happened in this film. But Ben came around on his own and yes on his own.

    I only think that Rey helped him,in so much that he was smitten with her and she served as an example that you can go through lousy circumstances and yet still comport yourself with dignity and fight to be your better self. But she didn't persuade Ben to do anything Ben was not already prepared to do.

    Even your point about Rey being some disgruntled former student/ex-employee has been done adnauseum. The track done in TLJ and TROS was a bit more fresh and more original and made use good storytelling. Since apparently they took Lucas idea about Anakin's grandchildren and even what they had originally had planned out and twisted that on it's head. I find it far more interesting-- and more original story than a re-tread of Luke's origins.

    And it even adds a layer of spice to it, to have Rey be a Palpatine, the granddaughter of the villains' long time nemesis and decide to side with the opposing side.

    I can see why given the SW fandom (bizarre in my opinion) view. That SW can /only be about the main trio or the Skywalkers. But I take no issue with it.

    Because to go back to the theme of the TLJ anyone can be a Skywalker (ie. a hero). It doesn't need to be by inherantance. It can and should be by character. I am a massive Rey fan girl, and this is not by accident. She is naturally the kind of heroine/hero I gravitate to. Rey was orphaned as a child. She spent 14 years going through a hellish existance . Yet she fought and she persevered and she made most of her time. She never gave into anger and despair. Contrast that with Ben. What happened to him? His Mommy and Daddy didn't spend enough time with him, his grumpy Uncle dismissed him and as a result Snoke/Palpy filled his head with poison. But so what? No one gave Rey pep talks. All she had in her head was the memory of her father telling her he would be back for her one day. Something she must have understood after the passage of time would not happen. Yet she still pressed on and did what she had to. I honestly think that part of the reason that Rey never joined Ren in TLJ was that she wanted no part of TFO, she understood quite well what it was like to suffer under the hands of bullies and she wasn't about to join them.

    I still continue to shake my head at the angry fans who are resentful that Disney allowed Ben to die (I am sure he will be back). There was no way that LF could allow Ben to walk off into the sunset with his girlfriend considering all the things he did. Along with the fact that there are characters who experienced much worse than him, yet did not prey on others.


    --- Double Post Merged, Aug 21, 2020, Original Post Date: Aug 21, 2020 ---

    The use of the ST deserters was absolutely brilliant because it was a more effective use than what was apparently in the Trevorrow's script. It made much better use of Finn's leadership and showed that he could strategize (ie. think with his head). Than have him standing before a legion of ST blaster in hand screaming 'Down with the man!' like Che Guevara. :).
     
    #12 Veronica, Aug 21, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2020
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  13. oldbert

    oldbert Guardian of Coffee Breaks

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    In one - bitter - way the Episodes as a whole were quite consistent. All of the Skywalkers put their love interest and/or their family on the first place on the very end, even with dying as last consequence. They all died for loving someone more than themselves.
    A bitter sweet family drama.
    In my personal opinion, I would have hoped for a better ending of Ben Solo.
    His whole life was nearly as horrible as Anakins.
    Another theme they played with. How one ancestor going full into the darkness overshadows the life of the generations that follow.
    SW 1 - 9 tell us, that the Skywalkers had to die one after another to save the light.
    Let's hope that not everyone has to pay this price to do the right thing.
     
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  14. Jedi77-83

    Jedi77-83 Force Sensitive

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    While I have certain gripes with the ST, I’m glad that the Trilogy was essentially about Rey instead of Ben/Kylo. Call me old fashioned, but I still enjoy to watch a story about the good guy (Luke OT) over a conflicted/eventual bad guy (Anakin PT). I like the PT for its macro story and world building but I just never gravitated to Anakin. While I feel the lack of world building hurt the ST, the character of Rey resonated with me so I cared about her for 3 movies.
     
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  15. DarthSnow

    DarthSnow Master of Coin
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    There is no greater sacrifice. Very well said @oldbert, really puts the tragedy of the Skywalker story into perspective.

    I very much agree. If he was going to be redeemed, it had to be on his own. But that still doesn't mean that those who care about him shouldn't stop trying. Which I know you're not saying

    I guess I quite literally said that, although I didn't mean it can only be about the Skywalkers. I would love for the story to branch off and continue elsewhere, and heck it has to at this point.

    But the central themes of Star Wars -- finding and believing in yourself, fighting for what and who you love, never giving up and "its never too late" -- all of that to me screams of a story about family and friends. So to see the focus straying from the Skywalkers, the most (in)famous family in the galaxy as far as we know, it just felt a little awkward. If that makes sense? And I guess it was always going to be a little awkward as the powers that be had to find a way to pass the torch from one generation to the next, maybe I just wasn't ready for it.

    At the same time, I loved the "new family" themes and seeing Rey, Finn, Poe, Rose, Jannah, etc all banding together and fighting for each other. Saving the ones they love. And there were few lines in TRoS as powerful as this one:
    [​IMG]

    Overall I am so torn on the ST. I love it because of all the things they did right, but at the same time there were a couple big misses IMHO.

    And this was one of those big misses. No one wanted him to get away with his past misgivings without consequence. But that doesn't mean the only other option is death. These movies are all about hope and redemption, or they are supposed to be... and then Ben is suddenly gone. And then I'm supposed to be happy because Rey lives on, which yes does provide hope, but... can you see why I'm so torn? Haha.

    The only thing I can keep coming back to is that it was all too much for one trilogy. And if Disney was braver or more ambitious, they should have stretched this story into 4 movies (at least) instead of 3. Just get away from the trilogy format for starters. Its neat and tidy, but when you start cramming this many storylines into it it does more harm than good. I love the stories they are telling, I just feel that there could be a different focus on them.

    Well. How about a story about two good guys? One in good guy clothes, one in bad guy clothes.
    :D
     
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  16. The Hero With No Fear

    The Hero With No Fear Resident Sand Hater

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    Having rewatched the ST recently (and then TROS again the other night), I really think the biggest problems are that they tried to focus on way too many characters.

    In this trilogy, we had Maz, Rose, DJ, Holdo, Zorii, Jannah, Allegiant General Pryde, and Captain Phasma as important secondary characters. It really felt like JJ and Rian would constantly just cast out the side characters from the previous film and introduce a bunch of new ones in the next one. I’d argue that most of these characters didn’t need to exist: in fact, I would’ve kept Rose and Phasma and just given Connix and Snap Wexley bigger roles.

    And while I understand why Rian Johnson split Finn and Poe up for TLJ, I feel like splitting all three of the main characters apart in the middle chapter of the trilogy was a big misstep. I really liked both of their characters, especially Poe, but I feel like they both could’ve been utilized in the story a lot better.

    Lastly, Rey and Kylo. Their relationship was the most interesting part of this trilogy for me and I wish we could’ve seen more of it. (I believe Kylo Ren only has like twenty minutes of screen time in each movie, which I think is a MAJOR mistake.) I would’ve also introduced the concept of their dyad in the Force an entire movie earlier and made it a bigger deal than it ended up being.

    Outside of character related issues, I wish that this trilogy kept the usual three years between each film OR had an Episode 10 planned for 2021. That way you get three films for the Sequel Trilogy and then you can have an Episode 10 conclude the Skywalker Saga as a whole.

    All in all though, I did like the Sequel Trilogy and all three films that comprised it. I just wish they were more interconnected and less sloppy. Fortunately, I’ve got a feeling that Lucasfilm’s learned their lesson here and will use it to make the next series of films even better!
     
    #16 The Hero With No Fear, Aug 25, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2020
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  17. Jedi77-83

    Jedi77-83 Force Sensitive

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    After TLJ and playing up the angle of balance, I was hoping for more of that plot point in TROS. I think it would have been an interesting theme of the ST about balance/dyad.

    The PT was about the darkside

    The OT was about the lightside

    The ST was about Balance.
     
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  18. Use the Falchion

    Use the Falchion Jedi Contrarian

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    I agree with you here. There is another alternative, however. They could have taken the entire Dyad thing out of the movie. In TLJ, Snoke gloats about how he bridged the minds of Kylo and Rey. There was nothing inherently mystical (outside of the Force and all) about it. It was one man/monster's doing, and everyone fell for his trick. At the end of the movie Rey closes the door to the Falcon and on her and Ben's relationship. To me, that was the end. She had bested him twice now (once in combat, and again by letting him live), and all he did was respond with threats, demands, and lies.
    Bringing in the Dyad thing negated everything TLJ set up and used IMO. But yeah, had they used it/brought it up earlier by having Snoke gloat about how he now has a Dyad at his will instead of how he himself made the connection, then it'd be fine. Or maybe they could have pulled a Plagueis, where Snoke THINKS that he created the Dyad, but in reality he was just unveiling what was already there. But the amount of work to do that within a movie would be enormous.

    Agreed, but I also don't think there was a giant way around it either. Someone needed to go on that adventure. To me the biggest misstep was on who they chose for what storyline. I always said Finn should have stayed with the fleet and Poe should have gone on the mission. That way we don't have a Finn vs Phasma 2: Electric (Staff) Boogaloo. Instead we see a new character face-off (and Poe completes his trifecta of trolling each major villain). Meanwhile Holdo now has a "reason" to not tell anyone her plans - she doesn't trust Finn, since he's a defector from the F.O. and not really in league with the Resistance. They could have had him explore the differences between the F.O. and the Resistance, and eventually come to terms that fighting for Rey isn't a bad thing, because it's not always about fighting for some nebulous goal, but about fighting for a loved one, be it your brother-in-blood or your brother-in-arms. It would also allow Finn to still be slightly injured from his battle with Kylo.

    Honestly, with the stories they were telling, there was very little room for all of our heroes to be in the room at the same time. I don't think that's a bad thing - the time all of our heroes spend together in the OT is about one act per movie, with a little more in ROTJ.* But since the timeframe of the ST is so short, our characters didn't really feel like they bonded as a trio that much off screen, and there were so few meaningful interactions between all three, it hits a lot harder. Maybe it's also that when the Jedi went off to do Jedi things, the other two at least had an arc together. In the PT, Anakin and Padme had a romance, while Obi-Wan & Anakin had their master-apprentice relationship. In the OT, Luke & Han and a bromance while Han & Leia had a romance. In the ST Finn and Rey have...something? But then Rey's off on her stuff, and Poe's either thought dead or on a mission.

    I'm not trying to justify it, I'm just trying to break it down and figure out how it could have been reconstructed better.

    Act II for ANH as they escape the Death Star and head to Yavin IV. After that, Han leaves, Leia's on base, and Luke's doing the trench run.
    Act I in ESB and very briefly in Act III. After Hoth, Luke is on Dagoba while Han and Leia are trying to escape. They all meet briefly on Bespin, but then Han is taken, leaving Luke & Leia.
    Acts I & II in ROTJ, and then everyone comes back for the denouement. Luke saves everyone on Tatooine, they meet again to plan out their mission to Endor. The first day of the mission happens, and then Luke heads to confront the emperor.
     
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  19. Veronica

    Veronica Rebel Commander

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    The problem is this. Having Ben don some robes like some disgraced Samurai who dons Budhist robes and roam the galaxy paying penitence doesn't bring a satisfying end and it just seems out of character for Ben. And having him be put on trial and in jail...well still doesn't bring a satisfying end to it either. I honestly think they went with the best option in the film.

    I've been recently educated that on how the WBW works so that 's a no. But I guess they can find some way to bring him back. Sort of like a Christ figure, who died and paid for his 'sins' and is brought back.



    I agree with you that Disney should have split it into 2 films. But I just got the impression that they just wanted to put this to bed and move on. I guess they had no idea how beloved Rey and Ben would be and how much story there really should be to tell--not to mention the damper that COVID put on the whole future film thing. So who knows? I am just keeping my fingers crossed.
     
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  20. Use the Falchion

    Use the Falchion Jedi Contrarian

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    It's only out of character because we've only seen one side of his character.
    I think it could have worked. It's worked in other shows and series before, particularly with Iroh's past - he went from being the Fire Nation's most prestigious general to an advisory role to a banished prince.* His sphere of influence was smaller, but through that sphere he impacted people in better ways than before.

    Heck, the manga/anime/live action trilogy Rurouni Kenshin is all about this. Himura Kenshin was an assassin, and then became the most famed killer in-world during a bloodbath of a war; but after the war he put down his blood-soaked sword and picked up a sword that couldn't kill, and vowed to protect those within his sight. His sins are hardly forgotten or washed over in the series - in fact, his greatest challenges are the direct fallout of his choices in the past. Had they done something like this with Ben, I think it could have worked.

    They could have had Ben wander around, trying to help out in little ways while pieces of his past haunt him at every turn. He meets a nice family who simply need an extra farmhand for the season? First Order remnants come and nearly massacre them and burn their land. He meets a Force Sensitive youth he may want to train? Former Jedi apprentices who survived pop out of the woodwork and convince the youth not to train under him.** Have survivors of the Sith Eternal try and raise him up as their new Emperor. Have Poe hunt him down. Have the new Jedi Rey are training refuse to accept and integrate him, despite Rey's forgiveness. Show how hard it is to atone and how hard it is to forgive. Show how much harder it is to work to make a difference than dying in a grand gesture.*** And in the end, they could have let Ben settle down with a small Jedi order (and potentially a family!) somewhere else, showing that he's protected those around him, redeemed those who have fallen because of him, and accepted what can and cannot be. Doing this would also erase on of the faults of the Jedi before him - the Jedi of his grandfather and of his namesake's era were too tied to the government; they were too centralized as an organization. Allowing for small pockets of Jedi schools to come up would ultimately negate that. It also could have allowed for different schools of thoughts about the Jedi to arise, based on their teaching.****

    But instead Star Wars went back to what was familiar (a particular trend with JJ honestly), and Ben died after doing one redeeming act, leaving behind a mess of a world he doesn't have to worry about fixing.

    No thank you. Ben isn't really a messianic figure - Luke, Rey, Obi-Wan, and Anakin fall into that trope far more. Honestly, that feels like more of a Karma Houdini thing than him surviving and trying to help out in small ways.
    What would Ben do, after being brought back? Would he try to atone? If so, then why kill him off in the first place? Would he become a villain again? Great, we have another villain that won't stay dead; and considering Lucasfilm's 50/50 track record so far, I'm not sure which way it would tip. Would he be praised as a hero?

    Besides, IIRC, the WBW only works for characters whose dead wouldn't really mess up anything at the time of their death. There was no time, place, or way to bring him back while keeping Rey alive. Please fact check me if I'm wrong though!

    Honestly, Ben is a bit of a tainted product going forward. Because of how he was used/mishandled, you can't use the character in live action, since Adam Driver doesn't really want to play him anymore; you can't use him in animation going forward outside of being a Force Ghost, because he's dead; and you can't bring him back, because the WBW doesn't work like that; and you can't use the Knights of Ren anymore, because they're no longer threatening or cool. (I mean, rebuilding the KoR could still be a cool storyline, but it'd have to be VERY well done.)


    *Of course there's more to Iroh, but this is the part I'm focusing on right now.
    **If one wanted to go really dark, have the youth slip to the Dark Side, and Ben has to kill the youth in order to save someone else - In my head, the people Ben would have to save would have been the Youth's bullies. Ben was going to train the kid on more...proactive yet peaceful ways to avoid bullying, but in the end, the Jedi coming out would have ruined it. No one wins, all because of Ben's actions previously (although from there we could explore the theme of how much of our action can be blamed on the pain we have suffered, and how much can be blamed on our own free will. If Ben, in a moment of clarity, recognizes this, he could have a moment of empathy for the Lost Jedi, and in turn, that could work into a redemption arc for all of them...hmm...))
    ***In the words of Hamilton's George Washington, "dying is easy, young man. Living is harder." Or in the words of one Lan Mandragoran from the Wheel of Time series, "death is as light as a feather, but duty is heavier than a mountain."
    ****While I stand by this idea, I do understand it's a potential minefield. Jedi are more of a school of philosophy or religious sect in a way. They have rules, laws, practices, and doctrines they hold to that separate them from other Force Sensitive groups. To allow for those doctrines and philosophies to differ may mean the end of the unified view of Jedi. Treating them like a particular art school philosophy, where there can be different ideas with the same outcome would be seen as untrue to who and what they are by some. Then again, that may not be a bad thing...
     
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