The truth about Snoke (Attention: TLJ Spoilers)

Can't believe I missed this either... the pieces of the puzzle are coming together...

 

Would be cool to find the Dwarti reference in the Plagueis book. I’ll have to look for it when I get home from work.

 

MAUL was sliced in half too, so yeah I agree.

 

It'll be a redux of their TLJ fight if it happens. Reminding them that they work really good together.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 15, 2017, Original Post Date: Dec 15, 2017 ---

Oh yeah I agree he's still being a little darkish. Especially with his words in the offer scene in the throne room, only his please really comes from the heart. Everything else said in that scene is manipulation or him being too angry at harsh with Rey when he yells at her to let go of the past, he wants her to see things his way. Force bond scenes before are more true. I made a really good post in the Kylo thread analysing the throne scene, can link it if you want.

Kylo just really hasn't had any healthy relationships, of any type, in his life before. He doesn't know how to be supportive or how to act to Rey. And he's damn selfish.

Snoke is Snook. Then.

 

So what? Yeah, he obscures himself and is unreachable because we only saw his guards, Kylo and Hux meeting him. He's not the "I need palace and servants and banquets etc. stuff" guy. And in TFA he typically (actually ONLY) projected his form as a giant hologram.

There's nothing here that can't be explained without any reference to Plagueis. You're just grasping at straws.

 

I'm big on Plagueis too, such a good character if played the same as he is in the novel. This is the exact kind of switcharoo filmmakers have to go with these days if they're to surprise and shock what are generally very intelligent film audiences. I think it's very likely that this theory or something close to it is correct. As you pointed out, it would be odd that the climax of this trilogy would be Kylo and Hux versus Rey and Poe, basically. I don't think it would or should be that straightforward. I know it's clichéd, but Kylo has to redeemed at some point, the constant conflict in him etc, I don't think they'd set all that up just for him to stay on the dark side.

I can genuinely only see it ending up being Kylo and Rey teaming up to fight whoever Snoke really is (hopefully Plagueis) by the end of the trilogy. They may throw in a twist like Rey being the one to sacrifice herself instead of Kylo to win the day etc, but it'll be something along those lines. And that kind of a reveal about Snoke would also change a lot of people's perception about the last jedi itself as a movie. Would turn their thoughts about it on its head in fact. It's one of the few ways they could redeem what to me is at the moment a story very poorly told.

On the other hand, if none of that happens, it'll compound Snoke being such a wasted character and a lost opportunity, and we can congratulate the creator of this thread for coming up with a better storyline than the writers who are paid millions could.

 

Spoiler: Snoke

Jar Jar binks has more development than Snoke ...

 

Nope. Snoke is dead. I think the biggest giveaway that he is - in fact - gone is in the larger context of the movie.

The Force Awakens was about rhyming with the past. It was about the old being made new again and paying tribute to the classic formula of A New Hope

The Last Jedi is about breaking Star Wars convention and formula. That's why the 4-word naming pattern was broken and we got a red title font. This movie is essentially a sinister laugh in the face of the Star Wars formula.

Nothing happens the way Star Wars has trained us to expect:

The disguise/infiltration trick is thwarted easily -Rose and Finn fail. Poe Dameron doesn't solve the war by being a dashing rogue - he fails. No, we don't find out that Rey is a secret Skywalker or has a special destiny or is Jedi Jesus 2 or that there's anything special about her parents at all. And no, this wasn't all building to some predictable final sword fight with the Big Bad. Like all the other major Star Wars tropes, Snoke - the robe wearing, thesaurus speaking, disfigured bad guy - is discarded mercilessly. He too, and all the outdated tropes he represents - fails

This is what the saga needed. An injection of freshness and unpredictability. Not to keep feeding us the same thing we've seen over and over and over again.

LONG LIVE SUPREME LEADER KYLO!

Search your feelings, you know it to be true

 

Wow, i mean this is very interesting, the only thing for me that does not work that much is the fact that the "body" was there all the time after the cut, but yet again as you said he is ancient and therefore he is a master on projecting himself even faking his own dead body for a while.

 

You know - PLAGUEIS' DECEPTION.



Or just unwillingness to accept the fact that Snoke is dead and never been Plagueis in the first place.

 

How has ReyLo been confirmed?

 

Not the fully fledged romance version but that there was a romantic connection/attraction:

She shirtless scene and Hamill’s comment that it was a romance for explicit confirmation.

 

Snoke is Snoke, a Dark Side acolyte from the Unknown Regions who tries to fill the void left by the Emperor. I'm sure there's an origin story, a background, but ultimately it doesn't matter. He's not so much a character as a device.

We expect him to be the puppet master because we've seen that character so many times in literally the majority of movies like this. He's Satan. He's Sauron. Whoever. And in THIS movie, in THIS story, his only role is to set the wheels in motion, to bring Ben and Rey together and establish that bond, and to allow Ben the means of ascending (or descending, depending on how you look at it).

I think we're just so conditioned to always expect the puppet master to have another cunning plan to realize that it doesn't matter. He was a bad guy, who like Luke, aided in Ben's eventual fall completely to the Dark Side.

I LOVE the notion that Ben and Rey are so connected, that her power was always there and it's only a matter of recognising that fact (which I think is what the dark side cave vision meant, including the fact that she really knew the truth about her parents, but had just locked it inside her mind) that allows her to use the Force with such control.

This movie is only going to get better with repeated viewings. Its got MANY layers, and once we stop focusing ont he wrong things I think they'll be more apparent.

 

I totally agree with your Snoke take. He was the push/catalyst Ren needed. Nothing more.

 

Snoke was powerful in the Force, he saw the future and how bad his treatment will be, he just moved the lightsaber himself.

Kylo didn't do anything, that was a suicide to get out this trilogy.

 

He meant romance as in, shakesperean.

 

Of course he did. You’re right. She’s probably his sister and just wanted him to put his shirt on because it was cold.