Three Classic Planets Will Be Seen Again In The Star Wars Sequel Trilogy

Fine...but can you provide any suggestions for what these new ways could be? I just don't understand the concept.

Again, what though? What new way? The whole message at the end of ROTJ was that love and compassion trumps hate and greed. I think changing that would be a very bad thing. That is what the Jedi represent. It what they have always been about.

I also don't think the balance can be permanently restored. Evil will always rise and sometimes it will win. But as long as the Jedi are around then this evil will be opposed and eventually destroyed, restoring parity. However, I agree that this should/would/could be the end of the Skywalker story. My feeling is that Anakin brought balance but his dark legacy has lived on and its waves (the FO, Kylo Ren) have disrupted the balance again. It may be an idea that Luke, learning of his family origins, realises that the Skywalker power is just too dangerous. Too powerful. If Kylo Ren turns fully bad and is fully powerful, who could stop him? Luke may realise that his family must die and Rey may be the person to do that...

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 23, 2017, Original Post Date: Mar 23, 2017 ---

Love this. Great quote as well.
This "too powerful" concept works on two levels. The Skywalker's were both too physically powerful but also too emotionally powerful.
Lucas himself said of Anakin that he "loveth too much".
I was concerned about the ST being made because I felt the story was done with VI. But when you consider the power of the Skywalker family, if the bloodline continues then eventually someone will come along who will turn bad and if fully bodied and fully powerful, they will be unstoppable. God-like.

You can imagine how Luke has been searching for ways to save his family. Maybe even try and reduce their power?! Would he have even really wanted to train Ben?
I think it would be silly for Luke not to explore this path and from his own experiences, knowledge of his father's life and now Ben's actions, discover that his family is tainted by the inherent power it is born with. This is why I think Rey is unrelated but at the same time connected to the Skywalker family:

She is there to learn from Luke but then destroy the Skywalker family.
(But keep in mind that Anakin destroyed Vader in a peaceful, loving way).

 

Finding balance within oneself. Not against another being or group.

I remember from the TFA novel that Snoke has an interest in Ben, beacuse he has a great pull towars both the light and the dark. Something along those lines.
So that could mean Ben is the one to bring balance, he's the "one in the middle", the third way.

I must say, I like Qui-GON29's reasoning, about the Skywalkers getting to powerful. George Lucas has stated that Luke is the most powerful Jedi, so perhaps he has become too powerful. This idea also incorporates Rey in the overall theory. I do fear that Luke wanting to save his family leans somewhat to close to Anakin in RotS. But it can give a sense of closure in epIX.

On a sidenote, in general I'm more of a lurker, though I do enjoy these types of discussions. Where I'm from there aren't many SW fans (I know, how's it possible) and the people who do like the films are only that, people who like the films. So thanks!

 

Ok, so not bringing balance to the Force per se, but to oneself in a way that protects one further from falling to the Dark Side?
Again for me though, Luke discovered this through the Jedi's teachings. Luke cared deeply for people and resisted the pull of the Dark Side.
Kylo Ren's conflicted approach at the moment is only causes distress and destruction. I could accept the notion of Luke believing that marriage and kids were good for the new Jedi. But that again is because it could help teach Jedi compassion and selflessness. The reasons these were forbidden before was because they made it easier to fall to the Dark Side. Luke of course could believe the pro's outweigh the cons. But again - the whole reasoning is still selflessness vs selfishness. Love vs hate. It's no great move away from the teachings of Yoda and Kenobi.

I don't believe that this quote has anything to do with Snoke believing that a mix of light and dark is the best. Snoke is a master of the Dark Side and he openly talks about how compassion is a weakness. No, for me Snoke says this partly because of what @Qui-GON29 quoted above - the greater the light the bigger the shadow. Essentially, it is easier for Snoke to craft a more powerful and evil being if they have a light in them which he can manipulate. What I mean by that is that, for example, the greater anger and hatred is induced by taking away something or someone that a person loves. Thus by taking away that which Ben Solo loves, by corrupting it and even getting him to kill it himself, it will make him a more evil, powerful and hateful person.

It's a pleasure. I appreciate your opinions and debate. Thank you!

 

All good thoughts - I am enjoying this thread more than any others, as it pertains to the overall story of VIII, the ST, and the whole saga.

I personally would love if Luke discovers his family's dark origins (plagueis?) and then goes even further back - remember that the Jedi didn't simply exist for 1,000 years, they existed "for over a thousand generations" - there is much to learn.

Also, the idea that Leia felt Bens darkness in the womb is totally new...I had missed that! I won't turn this into a Rey thread, but if that's possible - it could explain why she was taken/hidden - her destiny was sensed by somebody...

But at any rate, I'm excited to see the Jedi/Force lore explained and explored more in this film.

Great thoughts everybody!

 

Jabba Flowing back on topic...

Will we see Ewoks again?? They have to go back to the original film location too for Endor - that would light my saber

 

Probably worth posting this snippet from a JJ interview that likely links to this thread:

When Han asks Maz Kanata where she got Luke's lightsaber, her response — that it's a good question for another time — sounds a bit like a cop-out on the behalf of the creative team. But don't worry — Abrams says he knows exactly how Maz got that lightsaber, and that the process of it ending up in her basement was originally meant to be seen in the film as a montage. Instead, he decided there were "other ways we could tell that story later".

If we are going to see the path of the lightsaber and if these 3 planets are in "force-backs" then I reckon it could all be part of the same backstory. I personally doubt there will be a load of force-backs. That'd damage the flow of the film. But I could see a Force-back that includes the path of the saber along with other Vader artefacts (from Endor, Mustafa & Tatooine)...

 

@Smullie_1138 @master_shaitan

You don't have to change what GL did. You may add something. And that something can give answers to some questions - it's obvious - people are still talking about.
To me Anakin was the Chosen One as GL said and as meny other things in the SWU confirmed.
So much so, I find hard to believe he was created by someone else but the Force and specifically by the Light Side of the Force itself.
Less than anything/anyone by Plagueis....
Palpatine's words were the words of someone who was trying to decive him.
Since you may be born from a dark user, you're destiny is with me.
That's what he was impling...
And he will do the same with Luke "you're destiny it's the same of your father".
That doesn't mean he said the truth to Anakin. He said what it was more usefull to his goal.

However, since I agree Luke may have discovered something related to his family...
and since as I said I beleive the C.O. prohecy could play a part in this ST, I guess that may be the point:

What if Luke discovered that his father was born by the Light side of the Force to do exactly what he did.
What if Anakin was destined to have 2 child, to turn to dark side and to accomplish the prophecy (in the end) just as he did?

If he wasn't "destineted" to turn, if that was not the Light Side masterplan,
then why when Yoda visited Dagobah, Qui Gon didn't tell him how to prevent Order 66 and the Rise of the Empire?
My guess is the Light Side doesn't allow someone to change the fate, to prevent some events from happening.
But - knowing what's coming on - it may have a masterplan.
And the masterplan was Anakin/Vader as its Trojan Horse next to Palpatine.

Believe me, I can go much more further, adding other potential clues (including an interpretation of the Mortis arc coherent with this idea)
but I don't think that's the place. I will do it in a thread if anyone is interested in.

But just stay with me on this for a moment and pretende that to be true...
If so, what was of Anakin free will?
If so, could Luke be questioning everything he thought he knew?

 

Protocol Droid here dropping in here to steer this thread back to its original topic:

Tatooine: I could see this being the site of the informal “jedi academy” as the OP suggested, but here are two alternate ideas that I haven't seen mentioned (or maybe I missed it):
- Luke dies in ep VIII or IX and Rey buries him on Tatooine
- Rey journeys to Obi-Wan’s old hut to retrieve an artifact of relative importance (this becomes more likely if we end up with Rey Kenobi)

Mustafar: Agreed with those who think Vader’s castle was inserted into Rogue One as a preface to its appearance in Ep VIII, with two potential scenarios:
- Kylo journeys here as part of his training under Snoke
- Kylo already journeyed here after he broke from Luke (i.e. Luke/Ben were questing for Jedi artifacts, then Ben goes off on his own and searches for Sith artifacts) and Vader’s castle is now the HQ for the Knights of Ren.

Endor: Agreed with those who think this might be featured in a Forceback of Kylo retrieving various artifacts (perhaps his visit to Mustafar is part of this montage), including Vader’s helmet. There's really no other reason to go here.

* Generally speaking, I think there may be an emphasis in TLJ on discovering artifacts or questing to find secret knowledge, based on some of the movies RJ has mentioned as influences (such as Treasure of Sierra Madre) and the plausible speculation that Kylo/Rey's training will feature prominently. This lends credence to the OP's speculation, IMHO.

In addition to these planets, I’d really like to see Coruscant featured in the ST. I just wasn’t into how it looked in the PT, it just didn’t feel urban or sophisticated to me, or “real”. It would be great to see someone like Rian Johnson explore this place, especially if it’s fallen into disrepair and has more of a blade runner vibe.

 

This I like very much - the new republic is not there, the FO is not headquartered there either...what would become of the large city planet?

Blade runner vibe would be excellent - and hey, t did house the Jedi and Sith - more could be found buried away...lots of possibilities!

 

2 points. Firstly, I'm not sure Palpatine needed to say that to deceive Anakin. The "cheating death" stuff was enough. In the original script Lucas had Palpatine reveal that he did in fact create Anakin so that dialogue was likely a hangover from that revelation. Secondly, it's not so much about what it meant back in 2005 but what it can be made to mean now. When Lucas finished ROTS that was it. There were no sequels. So he didn't have to answer Anakin's origins. He didn't have to come up with a new villain or threat. But now we have an ST, that is about Vader's legacy first and foremost, this stuff resurfaces. And Anakin's origins are important again. The question is that if Anakin was created by the Force to bring balance, why doesn't that happen every time the Force goes (or is about to go) out of balance? It doesn't quite add up to me. However, the idea that the Sith created Anakin is consistent and makes perfect sense. And it would provide a fantastic way of bringing the Skywalker origins and legacy into this trilogy - whether Plagueis is involved or not.

He didn't tell Anakin he was created by the Sith though. Anakin thought Plagueis was ancient, he didn't know he actually created him. Anakin never spoke about his origins so that is left completely open. But this information for Kylo Ren would be very relevant. It would cement his feeling that his destiny is on the dark path.

That doesn't work though - the prophecy isn't a fateful set of instructions. It's a simple prediction about a possible future that may or may not come true. There was no master plan that controlled Anakin's actions. A destiny was placed before him - his power dictated that he would become involved in galactic affairs and he had to decide whether to follow that or not. He had the chance to bring balance in ROTS but rejected it. He rectified this in ROTJ.

See above. I don't think it works that way at all. People have a destiny but they can accept or reject it.
The Force isn't some sentient, all knowing being - it is all the energy from all living things. The future is always in motion.
There was no masterplan. There was a prediction that a chosen one would be born and would bring balance. This eventually happened but wasn't set in stone.

I think if they take away free will the story becomes vacuous.
The Force provides those that listen with a destiny. They choose whether to follow it or not.
However, if Luke was to discover that his family was created by the Dark Side itself, he might realise that, due to their inherent power, that the pull to the Dark Side is too great and eventually a Skywalker will fall and rule the galaxy forever through the Dark Side.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 23, 2017, Original Post Date: Mar 23, 2017 ---

This was a major problem with the PT for me. They didn't show the impact of war. We spent a lot of time on Coruscant and there was no hint of war or danger - even when the battle raged above it. It would've been better to have ravaged the planet somewhat when we visit it in ROTS so we get a sense of what the clone wars have done to the galaxy and why people would be willing to turn to an Empire.

Take note sequel trilogy creators!

 

I found myself agreeing with every single thing you posted...I like this thread!

 

Great post. Am I alone in wanting to see Luke on Coruscant? So far we've only seen Luke in much more isolated areas/worlds in the films. Matter of fact, we've only seen isolated areas in the OT an ST so far in general..They're cool and all, but mix it up a little, Disney and co!

 

I'd like to see more of this wisdom from you in the Rey origins thread!

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 23, 2017, Original Post Date: Mar 23, 2017 ---

I'd like to see it to the extent that I'd be happy to revisit anything from the past films. But at the same time, there has to be a good reason and visual and story repetition should be minimal. For instance, someone said about a lightsaber battle on Mustafa - that would be a mistake. Luke exploring the ruins of the old Jedi temple? I'd be fine with that!

 

I concur. Apart from the "whether Plagueis is involved or not" part.

#plagueisconfirmed

 

Did you ever think Darth Plagueis created Anakin because he had realized the flaws in both the Sith ways and the Jedi and wanted to wipe them all out which Anakin came pretty close to doing? That's why I still maybe think Snoke is Darth Plagueis because he is not Sith, but has Sith qualities and powers..

 

At first I thought Endor was a weird place to return, but it makes sense.

Tatooine- Where Anakin Skywalker was born
Mustafar- Where Anakin Skywalker was defeated and Vader was truly born
Endor- Where Vader was defeated, Anakin Skywalker returned, and died

Judging by the differences in how Kylo and Luke probably view Vader, this is kind of important. I can see Tatooint being important to both characters, but Mustafar is likely where the KoR castle is- because, as Vader's birthplace, it holds great importance to them.

As an inverse, Endor likely holds great importance to Luke- it is his father's resting place, and the site of a great Rebel victory.

From a perspective of perceived identity, it's like Kylo is standing too close, and only sees the first two locations- why he views Anakin as still being Vader. Easy to do if you ignore Endor, I guess. Perhaps visiting Endor will give Kylo more perspective.

 

@master_shaitan

Yes, Palpatine didn't tell him "you were born by Plageius". So, why are you guys so sure he was?
Becouse Palpatine insinueted that in that scene for the audience to know but not Anakin?
Really?
Did Anakin not know he was a midichlorians"miracle"?
Really?
Was he so stupid to not understand where those words were leading?
Do you find any connection between what Palp did with him and what he will do with Luke?

Finally, if there was a specific line in the script, still that does not mean Palpatine was saying the truth...

That's why I believe Anakin was not Plagueis experiment.
And more over, I fing hard to believe the chosen one, came from a dark user experiment.
Of course I may be wrong... but that's honestly what I feel, regardless all the rest I was speculating.

About thatm not that I 100% sold on it, but...
Can you explain why, during TCW - between ep. 2 and 3 - the Ghost of Qui Gon made Yoda see Order 66 and the Rise of the Empire, before telling him the Force has chosen a few Jedi to lern how to comunicate after death, but he did not teach Yoda (not even try) to prevent those events?
And he didn't with Anakin... strangely enough, if he was the chosen one.

I guess this is an interesting point, in any case. Something we have to think about more than we do.

However, we can 100% say the light side had a masterplan. At least the Force Ghosts.
The question is only them or them with a specfic task... which was what we saw them doing in the OT?

And to clarify what I'm thinking about Anakin being destineted to do exactly what he did:

Do you think - making a comparison - that Judah had free will?
I believe so - as the Christian religion told Christian to do - but still betraying Jesus he did what it was supposed to happen... to let the prophecy comes true...
What if Anakin played the part of both Jesus and Judah?
That's the idea...

 

I'd argue that those teachings didn't help me redeem his father. Obi Wan and Yoda wre motivated in teaching Luke cause they saw someone who could defeat his father. I'm sure they were happy he found another way but I don't think there's much room for debate in saying he was taught to redeem his father

 

Edit: I've just thought... there's another implication I haven't noticed before in Twin Suns...
Before the episode aired we were not sure what Kenobi really thought about the prophecy.
Was Anakin the C. O., but he faild? Was the prophecy misinterpreted, meaningless or what?
I mean, the only thing we knew for sure was that he thought Luke was the Jedi last hope.
But we don't hear him say a word - of course - in the OT about the prophecy.

However, we are now 100% sure Obi Wan thought all the time (between ep 3 and 4 - not sure he thought the same after he died)
that Luke was not just their last hope, but the Chosen One himself.
The strange thing is... he never tells him.
I mean - beside the fact that this could also explain why he didn't tell Luke about Vader=Anakin (becouse he thought the chosen one had to kill the Sith etc... ) - there are lots of chances that Luke heard about the prophecy only later on... maybe lomg after.
So did Ben.... but how did they react?

 

The more I see of Rebels the more I dislike it.
There is absolutely no reason for Obi Wan to think that Luke could be the chosen one.
The prophecy of the chosen one, as Kenobi viewed it up to this point, was false.
The being who was created by the Force and was predicted to bring balance had, to Kenobi, fallen to the Dark Side.
Luke has nothing to do with the prophecy. He wasn't created by the Force. There wasn't a vergence around him.
And all a prophecy is, is a prediction. For Kenobi, surely it just indicates that this prediction was wrong. He was wrong.

But now we're being told that Obi-Wan thinks that Luke is the chosen one?
I don't buy it. And is Kenobi forgetting Leia? What is the difference between her and Luke?
You could argue that Luke is Kenobi's chosen one, just not the actual chosen one.

What I find really odd about this whole thing though is that Filoni has said in interviews that he believes the Jedi actually wanted Luke to redeem his father. That they didn't actually believe Anakin couldn't be redeemed or that Luke should kill him. Yet now he is saying that, to Kenobi, Luke was the chosen one? It's bizarre. And confusing. Why can't it be that Luke was, to Kenobi, (alongside Leia) the only beings who would be able to match Vader and the Emperor in terms of power?

I have to say though, I've been thinking more and more recently along the lines of the Jedi believing that Luke could redeem his father. I know the dialogue in the OT weighs heavily against that but if you dare look at it from another point of view, it strikes me that telling Luke to kill his father could be more about ensuring he is prepared to let go of his attachments than it is to simply have this one option. What I mean is that after Vader's revelation in TESB, Luke obviously had it in his mind to redeem his father. He felt the good in him there and then. From then on his was all set on redeeming him. But as much as the Jedi ay have wanted Luke to do this as well, at the same time they know that it is dangerous for Luke to be absolute on this. He has to be prepared to kill his father if the situation calls for it. At the very least, he has to be prepared to put the galaxy ahead of his own dreams of saving his father. And considering the lack of combat training Luke and Leia had, would it not make more sense that the Jedi thought Anakin's offspring would be vital to defeating the Sith not because of their power but because of the chance of inspiring the love deep within Anakin/Vader?

Lucas did say:

"The part I am working on now is mostly about Darth Vader, who he is, where he came from, how he became Luke and Leia's father, what his relationship to Ben is. In Jedi, the film is really about the Redemption of this fallen angel. Ben is the fitting good angel, and Vader is the bad angel who started off good. All these years Ben has been waiting for Luke to come of age so that he can become a Jedi and redeem his father. That's what Ben has been doing, but you don't know this in the first film."

Rant over.
But in answer to your question (!), I would say that this information (Anakin's origins) would be of massive significance to both Luke and Ben.
For Luke, it would be a realisation that the Skywalker family has immense power and depending on how he think his father was created, could be a very dangerous thing. Yet for Kylo, it would be justification for turning to the Dark Side and for attempting to rule the galaxy. It would add weight to his concept that his family are above all others and that his destiny is to finish that what Vader started. I feel this all makes sense when you consider how Ben was with Luke and they were searching for ancient Jedi lore. To then come across this information together and the events that followed seems to add up:

Luke exiles himself at the first Jedi temple and Ben turns into Kylo Ren, destroys the Jedi and tries to rule the galaxy (or whatever it is he is doing).