1. Due to the increased amount of spam bots on the forum, we are strengthening our defenses. You may experience a CAPTCHA challenge from time to time.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Notification emails are working properly again. Please check your email spam folder and if you see any emails from the Cantina there, make sure to mark them as "Not Spam". This will help a lot to whitelist the emails and to stop them going to spam.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. IMPORTANT! To be able to create new threads and rate posts, you need to have at least 30 posts in The Cantina.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Before posting a new thread, check the list with similar threads that will appear when you start typing the thread's title.
    Dismiss Notice

TLJ and the "New Coke"

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Last Jedi' started by Shadowblade, Jun 5, 2018.

?

Did TLJ make you more or less enthusiastic for SW in general?

  1. Less enthusiastic for SW

    31 vote(s)
    50.0%
  2. More enthusiastic for SW

    19 vote(s)
    30.6%
  3. No change

    12 vote(s)
    19.4%
  1. Sargon

    Sargon Rebelscum

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2018
    Posts:
    131
    Likes Received:
    238
    Trophy Points:
    607
    Credits:
    532
    Ratings:
    +364 / 12 / -0
    Well that's kind of exactly what I meant, there will always be New Coke that you have to learn to either accept or ignore. A lot of people who saw and liked Star Wars in 1977 aren't necessarily "Star Wars fans" of the trilogy, then there was the Special Editions in 1997, then the prequels in 1999, (then the Special Editions again in 2004 and 2011), and a lot of EU along the way, now there is the Disney era. From my experience, most Star Wars fans grow up loving the series but then reach this threshold where they realize they aren't crazy about what's being currently released, and the natural reaction is to freak out about it like people did in 1999 and this is sort of the original New Coke analogy, but all of those people learned to either get over the prequels or just ignore them in part or in whole (because the New Coke analogy isn't real, to get back to the original topic).
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Mosley909

    Mosley909 Rebel Official

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2015
    Posts:
    726
    Likes Received:
    1,174
    Trophy Points:
    7,367
    Credits:
    2,646
    Ratings:
    +1,674 / 37 / -2
    I get your point, but I was more saying it’s possibke to do action type story lines with older actors, and certintly would of been with Mark Hamill

    But I understand the point you were making.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. Shadowblade

    Shadowblade Clone Commander

    Joined:
    May 27, 2018
    Posts:
    171
    Likes Received:
    187
    Trophy Points:
    457
    Credits:
    852
    Ratings:
    +314 / 39 / -8
    Perhaps it would have felt better if had done a decent job with both the execution, I agree the concepts are interesting. The film as it stands makes Luke unrecognisable to me...and I really hate movies that break with internal Logic. I did not get the SW «feel» while watching it. In hindsight, TFA was too unimaginative setting up the central conflict. Basically resetting the empire and the rebellion. But I got that «SW» feel you know....


    (Still, it could have worked if it’s sequel followed suit and expanded. But, apparently there was just 9 planets in the new Republic, and nobody else in the galaxy cared about building working military ships for 30 years after empire’s end. Sigh. The lazy plot/devices sickens me)
    --- Double Post Merged, Jun 9, 2018, Original Post Date: Jun 9, 2018 ---
    That is keenly observed, and yes, there are differences. And yeah, some of this will be because of how people deal with change differently.

    The case illustrates that resistance towards change can be very marked when it involves a brand that for some is part of their childhood.

    It was never about the taste you see...they were selling an experience, an american way of life, and perhaps a link back to fond memories. For some the idea of coca cola was a part of thenselves. Most could not evne tell the difference in taste! If you want to see people’s reasoning, click on the documentary link. It is really quite interesting.

    We did actually learn how well «new Coke» did compared to the original, they kept both products. Over the years nobody bought new new Coke anymore, and it was discontinued. In retrospect they admitted to jumping on a trend (sweeter taste) that turned out to not so enduring.

    Sure, we can watch the OT. But, knowing ROTJ was basically for nothing...death stars had no point as you could just hyperspace ram them...and that Luke ends up as a grumpy sad hermit who dies a shitty death alone does take away from the experience. We can’t unwatch that stuff. And the EU has been non-canonized and replaced...not unlike how they decided to remove original Coke completely.

    I would have much preferred if they did their experimental bits away from the original characters. But, as you said, they might have thought «old coke» would cast a shadow over the new....same with the new and old characters. So they destroyed the old one, and in Luke’s case, they had to do worse by him to clear the way for Rey.
     
    #83 Shadowblade, Jun 9, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2018
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Darth Garth

    Darth Garth Rebel General

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2015
    Posts:
    539
    Likes Received:
    843
    Trophy Points:
    4,517
    Credits:
    1,615
    Ratings:
    +1,292 / 79 / -28
    thinking about what would interest fans would be a step in the right direction I think.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  5. Fearghas_Ajax

    Fearghas_Ajax Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2015
    Posts:
    1,427
    Likes Received:
    2,644
    Trophy Points:
    10,967
    Credits:
    4,030
    Ratings:
    +4,146 / 27 / -18
    Like I said, I dont work there so I would just be making a guess! Do you work there?

    Sorry, just not in the camp that TLJ had a lot to do with Solo.... There is a list of problems Solo had, TLJ could have been just one out of the others and would have played a small part if any at all. I think we will find out things will be kinda like the EU now that they are releasing movies regularly. Some books I was interested in, some I wasn't and didn't read. Just because it is Star Wars isn't going to automatically make it a large draw now. Now that we are having SW regularly, there will be some movies that the majority of the General Audience and fans are just not going to be interested in outside of the original saga stories.

    Haha, I have to disagree. 3 movies to cross the billion dollar line would be a homerun to me.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  6. Jack_Forest

    Jack_Forest Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2018
    Posts:
    899
    Likes Received:
    5,664
    Trophy Points:
    14,117
    Credits:
    4,453
    Ratings:
    +6,578 / 30 / -16
    Which fans exactly? Fans that love the ST and want Reylo to happen? Fans that hate the ST and want super badass Luke fight Darth Plaguis? Fans who love the new canon and want to see it expended? Fans who hate the new canon and want the old EU back? Fans who love the Prequels and want to see more from that era? Fans who hate the PT and hope to never see it again? Fans who love the more diverse casting? Fans who hate the SJW agenda? Fans who want the Old Republic? Fans who want the timeline to move forward?
     
    • Like Like x 5
    • Wise Wise x 1
  7. Fearghas_Ajax

    Fearghas_Ajax Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2015
    Posts:
    1,427
    Likes Received:
    2,644
    Trophy Points:
    10,967
    Credits:
    4,030
    Ratings:
    +4,146 / 27 / -18
    They alwyas could probably do more. But there are millions of fans with different opinions, which do you listen too? Not everyone likes the same things. TLJ has shown us this is true. Definitely not an easy task, especially since they are deviating on topics and characters away from the main saga.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Too Gon Onbourbon

    Too Gon Onbourbon Rebel General

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2018
    Posts:
    352
    Likes Received:
    608
    Trophy Points:
    4,072
    Credits:
    1,057
    Ratings:
    +803 / 7 / -9
    Give them some time and support and what looks to be in the pipeline is a lot of yes to a lot of those various sorts of projects.

    One can probably get their cup of Star Wars tea or close but it can't just be theirs and no others.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Darth Garth

    Darth Garth Rebel General

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2015
    Posts:
    539
    Likes Received:
    843
    Trophy Points:
    4,517
    Credits:
    1,615
    Ratings:
    +1,292 / 79 / -28
    It limits what we can have as fans when Lucasfilm makes an effort to actively give us what we never asked for, it should work, but it hasn't. When do you change your strategy? I'm not saying cater to everything all fans want, but a majority , I would say, and the numbers back things up never wanted a Solo film; that would be a place to start; giving us something we might be interested in paying money to see.
     
  10. Jack_Forest

    Jack_Forest Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2018
    Posts:
    899
    Likes Received:
    5,664
    Trophy Points:
    14,117
    Credits:
    4,453
    Ratings:
    +6,578 / 30 / -16
    "Never wanted a Solo film" is primarily a result of bad PR and marketing. Did anybody ever want a movie about stealing the Death Star plans? Did anybody want an animated series about the Clone Wars? Or about a random group of rebels from a backwater planet? Besides, it's not the "fans" who didn't show up to see Solo, it's the general audiences for the reasons already discussed elsewhere.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  11. Jedi MD

    Jedi MD Jedi Commander

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2014
    Posts:
    3,569
    Likes Received:
    7,849
    Trophy Points:
    88,637
    Credits:
    19,676
    Ratings:
    +11,142 / 60 / -6
    I think the biggest similarity of the Coke/New Coke and TLJ analogy is the proof that the vocal minority can be loud. In the case of Coke/New Coke, the Coca Cola company made changes. It remains to be seen what changes if any Lucasfilm makes because of the vocal minority.

    The TLJ backlash did have an affect in Solo but only a small one. Poor marketing and the timing of the movie played the biggest part in Solo’s underperformance. This compounded with a movie a lot of people already weren’t looking forward to plus the production problems and you have the perfect storm.

    The general audience will likely come back to IX as they will want to see how the story ends. I also think that after the Solo debacle that the marketing of IX May change this increasing the interest of the general audience. Most of the hardcore fans will turnout for IX as well. There will be a relatively small group of those who disliked TLJ enough to give up on IX but I don’t think there will be a huge impact.

    The ST has suffered from an overall lack of vision and planning. While I have enjoyed the ST so far I do think it could have been even better with a cohesive story put in place from the beginning. I think we will get that in the future

    The irony of those who are so anti-RJ right now is that his upcoming trilogy will be prethought out and more cohesive. There is a possibility that he may not direct all of the movies but he is going to have control over the stories

    Benioff and Weiss will have there series as well which they will likely have a plstory that is outlined out creating a cohesive story through the movies.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. Darth Chewie

    Darth Chewie Rebel Official

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2015
    Posts:
    240
    Likes Received:
    678
    Trophy Points:
    6,617
    Credits:
    1,781
    Ratings:
    +978 / 14 / -0
    I would really like you to expand on that thought. I loved TLJ. But I agree there were stylistic, visual, or camera angles, that seemed off for me from the perspective of a typical SW movie. It was nothing that took me out the movie, but I definitely noticed them. The super close ups are one example.
     

Share This Page