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Too much Fan Service and not enough Artistry?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens' started by AllHailVader, Dec 6, 2015.

  1. AllHailVader

    AllHailVader Rebel General

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    Screw the fans.

    Before you overreact, let me just explain that further.

    Obviously I don't mean that literally, but figuratively. Because at the end of the day, the fans don't own star wars and should not dictate what is in the film. What made Star Wars amazing was a group of artists coming together to give you something creative. They did not have a check list of thing that would make fans happy, they just tried to make the best story they could.

    In the marketing of this film, Abrams and Kennedy and Disney come across as they are bending over backwards to try and please the fans, and i keep hearing

    "this is for the fans, it's for you guys"

    I don't know about you, but I would rather take a bold film with new ideas and thoughts than mere fan service.

    I want to be shocked and see things that I didn't think about but work well rather than getting that check list.

    Not sure what film this will turn out being but I am taking a step back and looking at the promos, and the lack of a story or plot point to really go off of. And to be honest, the only new brave storytelling device that has me most interested is seeing things through the eyes of a stormtrooper and making them a character.

    Apart from that you have Han back being Han, Leia being Leia, the "chosen" one being out in the desert and having to fulfill a destiny, an empire who are somehow still in charge (first order, i know, but same thing) and the resistance....it all seems pretty similar.

    If they had given us a trailer that BEGAN with luke's lightsaber and this being at the very core of the promotion and this stormtrooper who defected now crossing paths with it, as this weapon is pulling and awakening him, that will peak my interest to make me feel...okay, this is breaking new ground and moving the story forward.

    I don't know...just my six cents....
     
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  2. Bosc

    Bosc Force Attuned

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    Last time someone made a Star Wars movie that propelled the story and didn't service the fans, people hated it. ;)

    Everything JJ and Kasdan have said about their process in writing the story indicates that their priorities were in the right place. I can only speak for myself, of course, but I don't see a cause for worry. If, after seeing the movie, there are things to talk about in that regard then I'm sure we all will... and be able to do so with some authority since we will finally know what the story is.

    Lots of worrying and gnashing teeth before the movie has come out yet. My old mantra on this message board was "words have meaning," but I think my new one needs to be "watch the movie first!" ;)
     
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  3. AllHailVader

    AllHailVader Rebel General

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    I respect Lucas for not making a film to service the fans, but he just didn't make a good film and was more obsessed with technology and effects, rather than story.


    Do you really just want a fan film, and not someone's subjective take on Star Wars with their own new ideas that you wouldn't think of and evolve the franchise?
     
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  4. Bosc

    Bosc Force Attuned

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    Of course not. As my post said, I have no reason to worry about the story at this point and it doesn't discourage me when Kathy Kennedy or JJ says that fans will like it. That's usually seen as a positive thing. We'll see in a couple of weeks.

    (watch the movie first. :) )
     
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  5. TARS

    TARS Clone Commander

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    It'll be 50% call-back, 50% move-forward; 50% old, 50% new. 50% has passed, 50% to come. I think it will all measure out appropriately for the midpoint of the 12-episode story itself.

    But I know what you mean about 'screw the fans' (in the sense of just tell the story that tells itself) but then you're going to only have a small fanbase. Which is cool in the artistic integrity of it all; but Disney is naturally interested in $$$ of a broadest appeal approach. Which unfortunately includes "the fans"
     
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  6. AfroJedi69

    AfroJedi69 Rebel Official

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    YES!!!!:D
     
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  7. dark side of the sauce

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    I stopped reading after 'before you overreact'.
     
    #7 dark side of the sauce, Dec 6, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2015
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  8. Mudbone

    Mudbone Rebel General

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    I'm a first generation fan who wasn't 'alienated' by the Special Editions or the prequels. I think, from what little I've seen of this movie, it does seem that they taking fan service a little too far. Personally, I'd like to see new things, not just more of the same. I'm cautiously optimistic about this movie, since nothing I've seen (so far) has blown me away. Hopefully the movie will be something truly exceptional. After all, there has been nothing but positive buzz coming from this movie.
     
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  9. AllHailVader

    AllHailVader Rebel General

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    Great avatar.

    And yeah, some things look great like the stormtroopers, kylo ren's weapon and some shots.

    But I still don't know the new identity that this film has...or because of the high fee Disney paid for the property...are they playing it too safe?

    I want to wait and see, but yeah...I've not really been hooked by anything new they have done.
     
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  10. Cakewalk25

    Cakewalk25 Rebel Trooper

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    I'm not sure you can say there's that much fan service for fans of the OT. I mean, Luke only appears for 30 seconds, Han and Leia are divorced/separated, and there's no reunion of the Big Three. Also, Luke, Han and Leia all seem to be leading pretty miserable lives the 20 years before TFA starts. I think the only fans of the OT who will be happy are fans of ANH/ESB Han because it seems like JJ Abrams reverted him back to that persona and undid his character development in ROTJ.
     
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  11. Darth Garth

    Darth Garth Rebel General

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    I've read somewhere that Rian Johnson's film is going to be way different then TFA. Rogue One is supposedly more like Saving Private Ryan in the tone. I wouldn't put all my eggs in one basket and bet the farm on this first film; there will be plenty of time and money for experimentation.
     
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  12. Bluemilk

    Bluemilk I AM the Senate

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    This movie is the set up for the rest of the trilogy, so of course it may have some fan service but the preconceived notions for TFA is off the charts and is undeserving
     
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  13. ChrisI

    ChrisI Force Sensitive

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    I'm all for originality but it's a tough balance with trying to win fans back, start a new trilogy and pay homage to what made us love Star Wars in the first place. I think Rian Johnson will be the "original" storyteller on this new trilogy.

    I'd like to add that I'm not concerned with a familiar story. I'm concerned more with good filmmaking, dialogue and acting.
     
    #13 ChrisI, Dec 6, 2015
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  14. FeniX-Minerva

    FeniX-Minerva Rebelscum

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    I don't know, man. The prequels also had a bunch of fan-service, like Chewbacca and an army of Boba Fetts.
     
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  15. Darth Horn Rollo

    Darth Horn Rollo Rebelscum

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    The truth of the matter is that none of us have seen enough of this movie to make judgments like this. If you're basing your critique on the trailers/tv spots, you're complaint is still invalid, in my opinion. The trailers/tv spots are high in fan service by design. In all honesty, we know next to nothing about this movie (which is a huge change from the build up to the prequels).

    And if you listen to JJ's AOL interview, he clearly says that he was NOT checking off boxes of what had to be in the movie. He firmly shoots down the idea that TFA is fan service. Call backs and echoes? I'm sure that those will be there - symmetry and rhyming, etc. But I think that TFA will be pushing Star Wars into new directions, setting up where things are going for the foreseeable future.
     
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  16. Ree Yees

    Ree Yees Rebel Official

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    It's not fan service. It's keeping to the spirit of the classic trilogy which happens to be the trilogy 98% of the fans hold dearest.

    And why shouldn't fans have some input, even if but a slight influence? Of course it doesn't help with 80 million different opinions but ask anyone who is not zealous about SW and you'll hear that the prequels you know kind of suck.

    Trying to return to form - for that is what The Force Awakens ultimately is - is artistry in itself, though we do not know yet how well it will be achieved. Dogfights and character-driven lightsaber duels are back; that's what basically everyone likes about SW.

    They are going out of their way to repair the damage done by the PT by simply trying the other alternative, that is, creating a film that aligns closely with the general audience's hopes for a new SW flick. Oh it feels good to be on the side of a new SW movie.

    That being said, the plot itself sounds very weak to my ears, and could ruin the experience - if it's just another loud, soulless Hollywood spectacle.

    At least, in contrast to the PT, we now get good acting, fun new background character designs, action and humor, real-looking stuff, a solid writer of dialogue, great camerawork etc. It's like it fires on all cylinders except the plot (until proven otherwise, hopefully).

    I'd probably try to write a story that didn't echo the classics so much if I had the chance but I think it was an infinitely wise move to keep the tone and atmosphere of the originals. That is, not too derivative but also not too far out.
     
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  17. iluvkoalas

    iluvkoalas Rebelscum

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    I liked your post, but I'm not sure about pleasing the fans thing yet. We'll have to see the movie first. As I've said before...

    Yes, agreed. And this applies to me very much, too. :)

    Regarding "fan service" that people have mentioned above, I have to reiterate this point. This are only "fan service" to others when it's not something that they want. If they want it, they don't consider it to be "fan service."
     
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  18. Old Biff from the Future

    Old Biff from the Future Dune Sea Hermit

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    --- Double Post Merged, Dec 7, 2015, Original Post Date: Dec 7, 2015 ---
    [​IMG]
     

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  19. Jedi77-83

    Jedi77-83 Force Sensitive

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    Fanservice is such a broad word because what I like and what you like and what someone else likes about SW could all be different. Someone here maybe happy they are using practical effects, another person here maybe happy they're making them in the spirit of the OT.

    I'm focused on the characters and their story arc. I'm intruiged by Rey cause she is related to either Luke or Han/Leia and I want to see her arc? I'm interested in Finn and what made him turn to be a good guy? And of course where the hell is Luke and why is he being held back in the Marketing?

    I think theyre giving fan service on practical effects and maybe the stort, but I honestly don't know where they are going with any characters as that will make or break the movie.
     
    #19 Jedi77-83, Dec 7, 2015
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  20. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

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    Servicing the fans could be great or fail
    Mkserably on a scale that is so much greater than The PT .
     
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