Weaponizing the haters

That's pretty obvious without extensive studies. At least half of all the internet discussions around TLJ are about women, casting choices, SJWs, white men etc. Last Jedi is frequently mentioned in videos about feminists ruining franchises (usually together with Doctor Who and STiscovery).

 

And before this, the counter to all that was just more YouTube videos.
Now, this is actually a peer reviewed study that backs up the argument that the backlash isn't as big or as founded as some claim.

 

And more importantly, a lot of it is not about the movie itself, but what's been going on in the American society in general. Still, no amount of studies would convince the other side, but it is the internet and people will just repeat the same arguments again and again, while ignoring the other side (like that "manbabies" thing).

 

I don't know... I see your point, but to me the fact that it's an academic paper doesn't mean anything as long as the study offers nothing more than what a lot of people concluded based on common sense. I think it's better to focus on the content and its merit rather than who wrote it. If a YT video or a fansite article brought up the same data and conclusions - that's as valuable to me.

Additionally, maybe it's just me, but going all "according to actual scientists, TLJ backlash blah, blah, blah..." is... I don't know... It's like a whole new level of ridiculousness in this endless debate. "Majority of people like TLJ - trust me, I'm a PhD." It all sounds like a joke, to be honest. Really? We need that? I don't think so. Now we have this scientific paper used in the fan discourse and the main thing it accomplished is the epidemic of the stupid "Russian trolls" narrative, which provides more reasons for certain vocal haters to martyrize themselves. Papers like this are written by academics for academics. It's a different world. I don't think the buzz it created in the fandom/film community did much good.

OK, but if it's meant to be about the sociopolitical phenomenon, then I'd say the scope of the research is too narrow. As a result, it doesn't seem like a comprehensive study of the issue. I think it is evident that it was meant to be about TLJ situation first and foremost. That's my impression.

 

A lot of things that are thought of to be common sense can be often found factually wrong.
"Common sense" doesn't always mean correct.

See, that's the problem, if a YT channel or fansite did this it would lack the actual integrity of being peer reviewed and therefore free from the scrutiny of showing methodology or a bias. This is what separates a random claim like "Anyone who didn't like TLJ also hates puppies!" from being accurate and makes what the article states accurate.

The article really isn't about how many people liked TLJ. It's about how social media (twitter specifically) was used to firebrand something that wasn't THAT divisive (at least not much more than usual new Star Wars entries) and making it a political talking point rather than a discussion of a movie. TLJ is a vehicle to get to this point. Anything that is "divisive" is now weaponized and politicized.
Don't like Ghostbusters? Misogyny!
Not a Kanye fan? Racist!
Kanye fan? Bigot!
(see, that's a fun little jab at Kanye being somewhat insane...)

There was little to no misogyny in the original backlash for Ghostbusters. It was just a terrible unfunny trailer attached to an iconic IP.
But then it just started like a proliferated tear. And they made anyone who hated Ghostbusters into "anti-women." It was a real movement and actual misogynists used that as a jumping on point to attack Ghostbusters regardless of how they felt. Do I have evidence of this? No, just what I observed from my corner of the internet.

But with TLJ, we now see it again taking shape and have peer reviewed evidence to support the notion that yes, there are people who hate TLJ and have valid reasons to do so. However, there's a sizable portion of the visible online hate that is fabricated for a political narrative.

It's a narrow scope because these types of things usually are. It doesn't take long to see the broad scope of these things in action either. Go on Twitter and type MAGA or Trump and you will be hit by bots/provocateurs almost instantly. Or James Gunn. For awhile there if you tweeted the name James Gunn you'd be hit by a dozen replies in minutes of people who found you solely by searching the phrase James Gunn.

Hell, just post a Tweet about Robert Pattinson (the actor) you get a dozen bot likes in a few minutes if you want to see a harmless version of this.

 

Unlike how Ghostbusters fell flat, i personally enjoyed Oceans 8 and felt it was a proper way to have an all female cast that work well to a series that was male dominated. Ocean 8 actually added more depth to the Oceans movies and it felt like it was a sequel rather than reboot like Ghostbusters was. I like Oceans 8 better than Oceans 12 but not nearly as good as Oceans 11 and 13

 

I think Ocean's 8 was fine. But I'd watch Cate Blanchett watch paint dry and find it at least compelling.
It probably would have benefited better not using the Ocean's title but that's why Steve McQueen is blessing us with Widows!

I'd probably agree with you on the Ocean's ranking.

 

No one really knows how many people loved or hated "TLJ". Not really. Why would you make such a statement in the first place?

 

I don't have a problem with a fansite telling me the same thing if the data and decent track record are there. Academics happen to be prone to bias too and some are straight-up morons. This study wasn't revealing. It confirms stuff easy to conclude and at the end of the day the content matters the most. If someone feels this is something significant - OK, you have your scientific proof for whatever thesis you feel passionate about. To me it doesn't matter.

It stirred unnecessary drama as a result of being irresponsibly interpreted by the media. Yes, I hear your point about it being technically about a broader sociopolitical issue, but it's clear that this isn't a study that only happens to be using TLJ as the research material. You can tell it was tailored to fit into the debate around TLJ.

 

This does not make any sense. There is no way in the world any poll can determine how many people liked or disliked "The Last Jedi". "Controlled sample"? And are you claiming that the only reasonable people in regard to "The Last Jedi" are those who share your views? Why do human beings think that label, control or categorized everything? Why do they still wallow in this illusion that their opinions in movies are facts?

"Real data"? Are you kidding? This is an illusion and nothing else. Why can't moviegoers simply consider the possibility that not everyone in the world or not that many people in the world share their views on any particular movie? Why do they insist upon using any excuse to pretend that their opinion of a film is a fact?

 

This country has always operated like that. It keeps people separated, and constantly at each other's throats. One category will always believe it is better than the other. Plus it also means they will probably never see eye to eye.

 

Yes it confirms in the most non-biased way possible. Is it fool proof? No. Nothing is.
Scientific confirmation is important. I don't know what else except to say agree to disagree.

 

Yes, we have to accept the difference in our views.

 

For some reason which remains a mystery to me, there is a certain segment of people who liked TLJ obsessed with trying to show how everyone liked it and there's been no negative consequences whatsoever. You have to completely ignore Solo's abysmal box office numbers and the rapidly declining merchandise sales to maintain this illusion, but to each his own.

Some people just can't handle the fact that TLJ is not a popular movie and has done a lot of damage to the Star Wars brand. My sincere hope is that JJ Abrams reverses course.

 

What real data?

I don't think I would say that TLJ was not a popular movie. But I won't say that it was a popular movie. The opinions directed toward the film struck me as divisive. But that's just me.

 

This.

I dislike(d) (not hate(d)) The Last Jedi. I'm not Russian, nor bot. I went into the theater excited to see a new Star Wars movie. I left utterly heartbroken.

While I have a twitter account, I have not participated in the s--- flinging on this topic there. I came to a Star Wars forum to discuss the issues presented in that movie, because it seems like the proper forum for such a conversation. Unfortunately, there is no real discussion to be had b/c the most vocal among those who liked TLJ disregard all criticism as racist/misogynist. There is no way to actually have a productive conversation with anyone in that sort of head space. As such, I have tried to remain quietly optimistic that, one day, we will be able to have an honest discussion without the name calling.

Controlled by whom?

Beyond that, though, why is the idea of the majority opinion so interesting? It has zero impact on my own experience and is therefore not a topic I find very interesting. I have chosen to respond to this assertion here simply to offer myself as an example of an individual who has a severe distaste for the version of TGFFA described in TLJ which has zero to do with anyone's gender or genetic makeup. Is it not acceptable for those who disliked the movie to openly discuss their feelings? Do those who share similar feelings really need to justify themselves to this perceived majority?