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What could The Last Jedi do to improve The Force Awakens(for those who disliked TFA, that is)

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Last Jedi' started by BaranDo91, Dec 11, 2017.

  1. BaranDo91

    BaranDo91 Rebelscum

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    Greetings, everyone. As you could probably tell, this is my first post. So, I apologize if this seems scattered or if this was brought up. I also double checked to see if a similar thread like this was brought up and so far nothing. And if there is one, I apologize. So without further ado, let me start.

    With The Last Jedi nearly upon us(hard to believe it has been two years since TFA. Yikes, time flies fast), discussions about The Force Awakens(and the prior films) have surely come up, thus leading to debate, talks etc.

    So it dawned on me: given that The last Jedi is a sequel, what could The Last Jedi do, in terms of plot, characters etc. to improve The Force Awakens. The title above aimed this at individuals, like myself, who weren't so keen on the movie.BUT it isn't reserved for those people, for I am genuinely curious to hear from those who liked TFA. It is the sequel after all.

    For me, beyond just getting answers about Snoke, Rey, Kylo etc. I want to see some extrapolations on themes. What do I mean? Star Wars what makes it so great in my view is that it is a story of modern mythology and aspects condensed into scif-fantasy. And like those myths and stories, there are themes: messages that are built in that relay valuable lessons.

    Many of which are pertinent to real life.

    For the Original trilogy, a cool theme I always loved was the idea of growing up/ adulthood. Think about it? ANH is venturing by yourself upon reaching a specific age; ESB is facing the harsh truths/ realities of the world and one's situation and ROTJ is a coming of age tale; where one is no longer a boy, but a man.

    The PT also did this, but not as well. For the Sequel Trilogy, I want to see something like this thematic throughline and I believe that I found one. I also have one non-thematic idea.


    Identity

    Something I noticed in TFA was that most of the characters struggled with defining who they were. Whether it be Kylo Ren struggling with who he was or even Rey's struggles about who she was; the movie cemented this idea of identity being linked with purpose.That is, who are we and how does that define our roles. The Force Awakens barely touched on this theme, but that could have been deliberate.

    Because, I could easily see this going on during The last Jedi. Namely, with Rey figuring out who she is, Kylo thinking he has figured things out, but ultimately hasn't and even Finn's mission in the movie, perhaps relating back to that element. Really, the point is that The Last Jedi could very well double down on this idea.

    Especially, in the context of Luke Skywalker: this Arthurian legend who was the hero who saved the galaxy and larger than life and how Rey and us see him now. Only, in this movie he's far different.

    To better relate this, I could picture The last Jedi being a lot like Kung Fu Panda 2. Before anyone clicks off of this, hear me out. The first Kung Fu Panda, like The Force Awakens was about Po stepping into a brave new world, and in turn experiencing it, struggling with it and how that experience affected him.

    In short, the heroes journey/ a character arc. The second movie very much upped the ante to where Po thought he knew what he was, but ultimately finds out there is more to him. And that in turn drives the conflict of the story, seeking out who he is.

    While Rey does differ from Po(aside from not being a bear :) )in many ways, I can see The Last Jedi being like this. The core theme is Rey figuring out who she is and in turn is willing to go into dark places to figure that out. But ultimately learning a lesson/ figuring who she is.

    And the reverse could be said about Kylo who believed he knew who he was, especially killing Han. But ultimately finds himself more angry/ confused. To the point to where he faces a big crossroad and has to make another choice, one arguably just as arduous as in TFA with Han.

    And finally, Luke in that he is a changed man since Ben killed his temple and in turn that failure causes him to doubt who he is and question who he is and what is his purpose. But ultimately through the movie, he changes by accepting(or not. who knows?) what has transpired and rationalizes that he isn't the same and will never be the same. And that it is okay, because much like what happened with learning that Vader was his father; Luke can change once again and roll with it.


    This I would appreciate because it goes beyond the simple themes of adulthood. We as people do go through this, trying to figure out who we are and what we stand for. Sometimes in terms of career, but also in terms of social and even economic issues. And how that can cause us to shift radically and also gives us an incentive to change and adapt. And given how Star Wars' success was predicated on simple, yet fulfilling themes that anyone, a child or an adult could grasp: The Last Jedi and the subsequent ST NEED to do this going forward.

    Plus, I think something like this element could lead to some great drama.


    2) other elements

    As for more plot elements in The Force Awakens, I'd like to know why Luke created a map to find himself. I know that may seem trivial, but that just bugged me. And heck, that could easily be explained by a single line. Also, why Starkiller base was built.

    Again, small, but really from The Force Awakens, it seemed like Snoke didn't really give a crap about the base, treating it in an almost flippant way. It would be interesting if we found out that Hux pushed for it and Snoke approved, not really so much as believing in it, but potentially serving as a distraction for the Republic, Resistance etc. for something a lot more sinister.

    In other words, a big Red Herring. One, that he was willing to throw away numerous amounts of resources towards(which that should be shocking) for something that he deemed would be a lot more successful and effective... :)


    But that's all I got. I look forward to all your discussions, and May the Force be with You. :)

    P.S: Please, no spoilers for TLJ. You can post them, but I'm not going to read them. Also, no pissing contests/ discussions on The Force Awakens quality, and ego- stroking contests. Let this be a discussion about The Last Jedi and how it can shape the prior movie with its own narrative, themes, characters etc.
     
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  2. GotTheSilver

    GotTheSilver Rebel Official

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    Personally, I love TFA. Still, I think there are things that any sequel can do to make its predecessor better or more meaningful.

    I think JJ put a lot of things into TFA that could be built upon in TLJ. If TLJ can show that something small from TFA has greater importance, I think that would give TFA greater depth and meaning. The obvious example is to build upon things seen in the forceback, such as the Knights of Ren. But even smaller, less obvious things could be referenced, such as the X-wing pilot helmet that Rey wears early in the movie, or the doll of the X-wing pilot that she made. Why the interest in X-wing pilots? Was her mom or dad an X- wing pilot?
    --- Double Post Merged, Dec 11, 2017, Original Post Date: Dec 11, 2017 ---
     
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  3. B99

    B99 Rebel General

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    I'm just hoping it answers some of the questions TFA left us with.
     
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  4. Benjamin Lewis

    Benjamin Lewis Rebel Official

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    TLJ could also improve on TFA for people who enjoy TFA.

    Answer questions. Continue to flesh out characters and give them interesting arcs, etc.
     
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  5. ElectricPinnaple

    ElectricPinnaple Rebel Trooper

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    For me, the biggest thing that TLJ could "fix" (although I hesitate to use that word because I don't think it really needs fixing) is the political climate of the galaxy.

    The Resistance, the New Republic, and The First Order, all make up a much more complicated political situation than the OT, which were as simple as The Empire fighting a small group of rebels. And then in the PT, which was also quite complex, the movies spent significant amounts of time explaining and dealing with the political situation. But, in TFA, there is no explanation.

    For example, the New Republic is said to be the new government of the galaxy, but the entire movie is spent in parts of the galaxy which are under they control of The First Order. Why does the New Republic allow The First Order to exist, and why do they seem to tolerate each other? Are there supporters of both, or is The First Order universally considered to be "bad"? There are undertones of a truly interesting conflict in the galaxy at large, and while keeping TFA grounded in the smaller character moments allowed them to tell an amazing story, it left the audience with questions as to why there is even fighting in the first place.

    If there is one thing that TLJ can do to make TFA better, it would be to explain what is happening in the galaxy, and why the audience should (or should not) be hoping for The First Order's defeat.
     
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  6. Darth Basin The Greatest

    Darth Basin The Greatest Rebel Official

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    (I'm not reading any spoilers)

    I think TLJ will end w/ us asking more ?s Then answers. Where did the KoR go? Why have Rey be random, yet have an over abudance of Anakin & Luke similarities? (Once again no spoilers). Why did you not change the ending? Now everbody expects Leia in 9. ( i could be wrong)
     
  7. Ghost of Obi Wan Kenobi

    Ghost of Obi Wan Kenobi Rebel Official

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    What could TLJ to to improve TFA?
    It could:
    1) give us a really strong and satisfying answer to Rey’s parentage.
    2) explain why the lightsaber was “talking” to Rey
    3) explain Knights of Ren
    4) explain Snoke’s origins
     
  8. baesy ridley

    baesy ridley Rebelscum

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    1. Im pretty sure we all knew we weren't going to get a straight up answer to this question in TLJ. Even though they kinda did (although this could be a misdirect). In that Rey is just a nobody, which i was very satisfied with.
    2. I hate to say it but i guess you could say in a sense Rey is this trilogy's "chosen one". The force is a character in and of itself, and it spoke to Rey through Anakin's saber.
    3. Agree
    4. Agree to an extent. Would have liked a little info on him, but was not expecting him to be just 'killed' off like that.
     
  9. Snazel

    Snazel Force Sensitive

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    TFA > TLJ

    The Force Awakens is a patient, sweet film that inspired thousands of young women to love Star Wars, because Rey is so beautifully crafted and rendered in the film.

    TLJ is a cacophony of characters and plot threads, it's fun, I liked it, but it doesn't have the craft of TFA.
     
  10. IlhamKamaruddin

    IlhamKamaruddin Rebel Commander

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    Agreed completely! I didn't feel the craft that was put in TLJ, and that was all I needed! I am fine with the movie as long as it was crafted on par with other SW films. It was an amazing film by its own but a really mediocre sequel to a movie that set it up for 2 hours straight. RJ was there when they were filming TFA, he had a even bigger opportunity to make both movies connect properly but it didn't happen. No offence but TFA was not a rehash of ANH, the goal was always to find Luke. TLJ didn't seem right, we needed more screen time with the characters to really dive into them. I would have preferred a time jump in the movie and spread the movie into a longer time span.
     
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