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What If It Was All A Lie... and OB1 Was Really Luke's Father?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens' started by Dark Toilet, May 28, 2015.

  1. Dark Toilet

    Dark Toilet Force Sensitive

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    I know this is not at all likely, but hear me out... after all, this is all just speculation for fun about a "space opera."

    Many of us are probably aware that old drafts of the OT had Darth Vader and Anakin Skywalker being different people, Luke's sister being Nomi and not Leia, Lars Owen and OB1 (or "Ben Owen") being brothers, and so on. Earlier drafts of the PT had a love triangle among OB1, Anakin and Padme.

    What if George Lucas tabled all of those ideas (or decided against actually showing certain elements of them), only to make them part of the biggest surprise reveal of all in the ST? OB1 is Luke and Leia's father! The moral ambiguity quotient for the ST would be turned up to the highest decibels, right? The way this could have played out:

    Anakin was always a creeper with Padme (I thought) and as his behavior became more and more suspect, she turned to OB1. They have a secret tryst resulting in her pregnancy. Makes a lot of the dialogue among them in ROTS take on new and clearer meaning. ("You are with him." [OB1] "You brought him here to kill me.") By then, Palpatine has taken over control of the galaxy. OB1 and Yoda hatch a twisted ("In my view, the Jedi are evil!") plan to protect OB1's children as the next hope against the Empire and to avenge the Jedi... after all, the Empire and Vader are hunting down all Jedi and maybe force-sensitive beings. What better way to protect Luke than to name him after the supreme muscle in the Empire and allow Palpatine and Vader to eventually believe Luke is related to Anakin and not OB1? Meanwhile, OB1 personally watches over his son with the idea to eventually groom him to confront Vader and Palpatine. This makes OB1 and Yoda certainly seem way more morally ambiguous than we have ever been led to believe... And in a way, since the saga is supposedly really all about his fall and redemption, it makes Anakin/Vader an even more sympathetic hero turned anti-hero turned hero again. Perhaps even the entire Sith, who were exterminated by Jedi, both in canon (the Darths) and Legends (the species).

    This provides some motivation for our main bad guys in the ST, Snoke and Kylo Ren, depending of course on who, if anyone, they are really related to. Perhaps Snoke is of the original species of Sith. Maybe Kylo Ren is somehow actually related to Anakin Skywalker (Shmi had previous children?), or as has been speculated just idolizes Darth Vader. If he discovered the REAL truth, he would want to avenge Anakin as the true victim of the Jedi.

    Anyway, I know this is highly unlikely (after all, ghost-Anakin is hanging with ghost-OB1 and ghost-Yoda, unless they are all just figments of Luke's imagination...), but I thought it was an interesting mind teaser if nothing else. It certainly makes the moral ambiguity theme to be explored in the ST percolate. Wouldn't it be the most mind-boggling Star Wars twist yet?
     
    #1 Dark Toilet, May 28, 2015
    Last edited: May 28, 2015
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  2. Duke Groundrunner

    Duke Groundrunner Rebel Official

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    Cool idea. I really hope that the original species of Sith is in these next movies.
     
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  3. TheFettMan

    TheFettMan Rebel Official

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    To me, a spoiled opportunity was made when Lucas & ILM chose not to rewrite ROTS as a love triangle and included Obi Wan as a part of a relationship with Padme. She dies in the climax anyways so it's not a conflict that's unresolved.
    It would explain Anakins rage & jealousy towards the Jedi Order & his master: Obi Wan.
    A few brief scenes or lines of dialogue could have changed the 3rd act & gave ROTS a much better spin.
     
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  4. DarthWalker

    DarthWalker Force Sensitive

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    I agree with you on there should have been a better reason to turn Anakin into the evil Darth Vader. I always hate watching the "dream/nightmare" scenes in the PT of Anakin. It always looks so cheesy. I wish there had been some kind of betrayal or something more personal that sets Anakin on his path, like the Jedi being responsible for Padme's death in a way, like they separated Anakin from her since he broke the Jedi code. Of course, this would need to be after the twins are born, So maybe Anakin in his rage for his dead children and wife come after the Jedi in revenge.

    And again, this is kind of my soap box on what could have been in the prequels...such a missed opportunity! I believe the reason the OT was so much better was because Lucas had people around him to stop him from making bad ideas and reigning him in a bit. But, with the prequels, they let George loose and anything goes, so we got the crazy, out of context mess that we ended up with. The prequel storyline could have been so great...but he just thought every idea he had was a great one and everyone around him agreed. They never should have started Anakin so young, more like a teenager like Luke was, around 18. And Episode 3 should have had Vader from the beginning showing us WHY he was so feared and powerful in Episode 4 when it begins!
     
    #4 DarthWalker, May 29, 2015
    Last edited: May 29, 2015
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  5. Greg Kirby

    Greg Kirby Rebel Official

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    Funny you should say, George and anything goes... Song in Temple of doom was Anything Goes!
     
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  6. darrenkitlor

    darrenkitlor Rebelscum

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    I really like the Obi Wan reveal as the father. Anakin's creepiness us suddenly confusion and disillusionment.

    Whereas Anakin was possessive of Padme, he was selfless with Luke.
     
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  7. ButtersBZ

    ButtersBZ Clone

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    I watched Ep. III last night. Two things stood out that reminded me of this thread;

    - Obi Wan asks Padme "Anakin is the father, isn't he? I'm so sorry..." Padme never really says it.

    - Padme does sure wonder about Obi Wan quite a lot. "What about Obi Wan? Where's Obi Wan? Do you think Obi Wan can help us?"

    Obi Wan in ANH says Vader betrayed and murdered Luke's father, which actually could be true by the time Vader says "I am your father" in ESB. A bit of a stretch, i know, but fun to think about.
     
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  8. ChrisI

    ChrisI Force Sensitive

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    Sounds like a job for...
    upload_2015-5-29_12-12-51.jpeg
     
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  9. Darth Horn Rollo

    Darth Horn Rollo Rebelscum

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    If this actually came to pass, I would cease to be a Star Wars fan. Here's what this would mean, from a story standpoint:

    - All notions of right and wrong within the Star Wars universe would be totally invalidated. While the Jedi were a little arrogant and pretty short-sighted in the PT, they were not downright evil. If Yoda and Obi-Wan actually colluded to deceive Luke (in Obi-Wan's case, twice) and in doing so led Luke to wrongly believe that one of the most evil beings in the galaxy was his father just so Obi-Wan could cover his indiscretions, that would make Anakin's declaration in ROTS about the Jedi being evil correct.

    - This would also mean that Padme Amidala ceases to be a sympathetic, noble figure. There is NO indication AT ALL in the PT that Obi-Wan and Padme were in any kind of romantic relationship. And speculating based on a line reading from the PT is a really flimsy foundation for this kind of theory.

    - This is would also make the OT a massive sham, including many things that Lucas has said about the saga up to this point: "This is Anakin's story..." Making Obi-Wan Luke and Leia's father makes Anakin's story one of pathetic failure, not of a tragic figure who was ultimately redeemed.

    I once replied to a post on another board about what would make me get up and walk out of the theater, saying that I couldn't really thing of anything. However, this would do the trick...
     
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  10. Trevor

    Trevor Rebellion Arms Supplier
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    Well Duke, it's refreshing to know/see that someone has mentioned that our Sith were originally a species/race of people....and regarding your statement: That WOULD be cool!! I think most casual fans don't realize that bit of trivia, and most would be pretty confused to hear it without an explanation.
     
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  11. Duke Groundrunner

    Duke Groundrunner Rebel Official

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    It would really get me hyped up if i saw a Sith (species) villain show up in a Star Wars movie boasting that how he is the true Sith and that the others that showed up were in his eyes inferior imposter.
     
    #11 Duke Groundrunner, May 29, 2015
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  12. Rufus2fist

    Rufus2fist Rebelscum

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    yes to this using an old canon but in a NEW way
    shoe something that hasn't even been discussed in the films
    and show what true evil is
     
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  13. Dark Toilet

    Dark Toilet Force Sensitive

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    No question OB1 as Luke's father would turn most of everything we know about Star Wars on its head, especially making the sages and mentors for the original heroes look quite fallible. However, I don't necessarily think that it would completely invalidate all notions of right and wrong in the Star Wars universe or mean that the Jedi, more specifically OB1 and Yoda, were truly the "evil ones." Moral ambiguity and notions of right and wrong are frequently quite complex. After all, Yoda and OB1 knew the Sith had just taken over the Republic and it was their darkest hour. Maybe they were doing what they thought best in the long term to be able to combat the evil Empire, as misguided as they may have been.

    This kind of twist no doubt would change our perspective on Anakin and perhaps Padme, but all people have faults and weaknesses, even the Jedi and certainly politicians. Perhaps Anakin seems more of a "pathetic failure" after the PT, but now he would have motivation for everything he does in the OT. The thing I like is that this twist would in some ways redeem the PT (I am admittedly an OT enthusiast) because so much in the PT would make much better sense if OB1 and Padme had in fact betrayed Anakin. (Maybe GL was even more genius than we give him credit for... and he has been taking it on the chin ever since the PT because we could not see it?)

    Having thought about it further, another implication that I like is this: Force users, both the Sith and the Jedi, who have been in conflict for ages, are responsible for the state of the galaxy, all at the expense of the "normal" inhabitants of the galaxy. Yoda and OB1 admittedly made mistakes. Perhaps some horrible and some well intentioned. There is a cost for wielding supernatural powers and perhaps the ST will be further exploring that. Han Solo is a bit of an everyman hero and I think many more people related to him in the OT than the supernatural Jedi or Sith. Of the "legacy" characters, he is the most prominent in Episode VII and I might enjoy seeing some push-back by non-Force users against Force-users. Not sure yet.

    Kind of like the mortals vs. their Gods in ancient Greek and Roman mythology. The Gods did terrible things to the mortals (frequently involving infidelity or getting some mortal pregnant), but not without consequence, and not without the mortals fighting back from time to time. There was a sense of that in ANH that we have not really seen since then. I particularly liked the idea that a simple farm boy, a scoundrel, and a princess could together change their fate and that of the galaxy. I'm not sure about this mortals-taking-on-the-Gods angle in the ST, but it could be interesting to see again. Showing the true fallibility of the force-users from the PT and OT, through an OB1-betrayed-Anakin story and its implications on the galaxy as a whole, could be fun.
     
    #13 Dark Toilet, May 29, 2015
    Last edited: May 29, 2015
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  14. Bluemilk

    Bluemilk I AM the Senate

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    Having Obi Wan as Luke's father would have been boring compared to Vader being his father. Luke grew and became a great hero knowing who his father was and by confronting and defeating him.
     
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  15. ChrisI

    ChrisI Force Sensitive

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    possibly redeeming him as well, no?
     
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  16. Bluemilk

    Bluemilk I AM the Senate

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    Yes that too.
     
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  17. ChrisI

    ChrisI Force Sensitive

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    I actually think redemption is a big part of the whole series. Sons redeeming fathers. Students redeeming teachers. Family redeeming family. Hopefully, this thread is in the new trilogy. :)
     
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  18. Bluemilk

    Bluemilk I AM the Senate

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    I totally agree. Not sure what TFA is about as of yet but hopefully those themes will be present in this new trilogy.
     
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  19. Pastor Barndog

    Pastor Barndog Force Attuned

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    "Luke, Obi-Wan never told you about your father."

    "He told me enough, he told me you killed him."

    "Seriously first he bones my girl while I am out saving the republic he tells me I can't trust the Chancellor what nerve. Then he schemes with your mom to have me blamed as dad so I get kicked from the jedi instead of him. Then after the girl dies and he leaves me burn, and dismembered get you and your sister he still dumps you both on someone else. Seriously. But hey at least I am not the father."

    "Hi welcome back the Maury Povich. Darth Vader has just told Luke Skywalker that he is not his father but rather Obi-Wan Kenobi is lets see the reaction."
     
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  20. ThePurloinedFowl

    ThePurloinedFowl Rebel Commander

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    What if?! Riots. In the streets. And I would never see another Star Wars film again.
     
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