SPECULATION The Third Order, The Knights of Ren?

Did anyone else notice one of the Knights has a blue or purple saber? If that's true what does it mean?

 

These are amazing to me--

 

I see darthlazarus already mentioned the Spear of Destiny. I was going to bring it up for both the Anakin/Luke saber and Kylo's own saber.

Since seeing the Celebration prop, I've thought about it as a possible SOD reference. The ridges on the pommel remind me very much of nails used as relics of the "true cross" and there is a nail wired to the SOD. The SOD was cobbled together from various relics and was added to and repaired over the years. It makes me wonder if Kylo's saber is made from salvaged relics that were crudely bashed together to try and make a functioning saber. I could see the crossguard sections being added on as a way to "vent" the unstable blade, adding to the crude look. It looks like the exposed wire was a quick fix after the initial design failed, which reminds me of the wires holding on pieces of the SOD.

 

I had to catch up on a lot in this thread. Here are a few things that I wondered while reading.

Why should we think of the Knights of Ren anything other than what Ren calls his specialized operatives. I mean why are these not just the SS of the 1st Order whom Kylo Ren runs? I see no ancient connection to them. If anything a new order or third order that is resurgent or has always been there but we don't know about it seems to be very left field and a distraction from the story of Jedi, 1st Order and Resistance that seems to be building. Too me it changes too much of the established universe.

If Kylo is the leader of a whole group of light sabre wielders and all of them have a sabre. Why are we holding onto the idea that his is a poorly made model he cobbled together in his garage. Granit it might be a relic which seems like a cool idea. But sadly I am seeing the more likely and lamer idea that the new sabre has a cross bar and we are ignoring how that would cut off peoples arms who use it.

The more I read the more links seem to be connecting to some of the EU stories. Like they dropped the EU in a blender and changed some names.

One Sith=1st Order
Imp Knights=Knights of Ren
Darth Kryat=Snoke
Darth Ruyn=Kylo Ren
Fel Empire=New Republic

I think overall that the "7" must have been the code for the Knights of Ren. Or the group that becomes the Knights of Ren.

 

Kylo Ren is no older than 30, leading many to suspect that he is the youngest of the Knights of Ren not the oldest. He may have even been taken from this Jedi Academy we have heard rumors of at a young age. I don't think he is a leader of anybody important and clearly there is someone teaching him something (Snoke).

 

so Knights of Ren who or what is Ren? Is it just thier calling card?
And what do they all look like ? Any possibility they all dress like kylo and we have seen them all but just keep referring to it as him?
Will there be more of them in the movie or do we just know of them?

 

We know from Abrams that he was given the name Kylo Ren when he became part of their order, so he wasn't the originator. “He is a character who came to the name Kylo Ren when he joined a group called the Knights of Ren.”
I agree that it is odd that his saber would be so junked together if they were all using sabers, though that could be explained a bit by my idea that he made it from scavenged relics and had to make it work with what he had. One thing to keep in mind is that those KOR concept pieces were likely Kylo designs that were possibly turned into KOR designs. One of the helmet designs seems to have been used for the First Order "ground crew" helmets.

Spoilers for Aftermath:

Spoiler

If the "Acolytes of the Beyond" are associated with the KOR, the KOR could be a militarized wing that only recently took up sabers. The Acolytes want Vader's saber so they can destroy it as a way of returning it to its owner in death. They say they are not violent... "yet."

 

Thanks I had not heard the bit from JJ about him getting the name from his position.

This of course puts the speculation of his actual name could be anything; Byron Skywalker, Sylvester Dukoo, Herman Solo.

 

Just want to share one of my entries to the Art Awakens Contest. The funny thing is I was just doing these for fun until I saw them post about the contest. I know Eli is a site fav, but would appreciate any support. Hope you enjoy my concept for The Knights of Ren

 

Currently, I'm attracted to the idea that the Knights of Ren are associated with the Acolytes of the Beyond (mentioned in Aftermath), whose theory of the dark side is that it originates outside the known SW universe (outside the Galaxy?). I wonder if the Knights/Acolytes themselves are from this "beyond" or can trace their lineage to it. This is a really intriguing idea to me -- an order that predates the Sith (perhaps the Sith are a watered down or bastardized version of the Acolytes), and has moved into the power vacuum created by the Sith's demise.

Having said that, I wanted to bring up an alternate idea, which has possibly been discussed before. If so, my apologies. But perhaps "Ren" is short for Revan, or a character history for Ren has replaced the history of Revan. People have commented that Kylo's mask resembles Revan's. Maybe it literally is Revan's mask, which Kylo recovered during his artifact hunting and wears as a way of usurping control over the Knights. As people mentioned, he's probably a young member of the order, so this would be an audacious move for someone strong in the dark side of the force (similar to Stephen Dorf's vampire in Blade wrestling control from the elder, more conservative vampires). Or perhaps the leader of this group always wears this mask, and Kylo killed the leader and took control. I'm not that familiar with the EU, but has Revan been mentioned in canonical works or is he still relegated to "Legends" status?

 

I haven't read most of the thread so apologies if I'm retredding old ground but could 'Ren' be the 2000 year old founder of the Sith from Mizzlewump's post originally called Ruin?

That guy was right about so many things way before everyone else, I'm willing to bet the 'knights of Ren' are a cult fanatical about that ancient Sith and maybe that's who Kylo's mask originally belonged to?

Ruin to Ren is just as similar as Ren and Revan and he said the apprentice also takes that name...which he has as we now know Kylo Ren is an alias.

If they have gone down this route it is interesting that they're called the 'knights of Ren' ...could their ultimate goal be to resurrect him? I mean if they were going to invent a cult that's fanatical about a dead Sith surely the 'knights of Vader' would have been more logical, but as I doubt anyone at Lucasfilm is stupid enough to resurrect Vader I could see why they possibly chose to have the original dark sider as this story's 'Voldermort'

Obviously i'm running with my own unfounded conclusions here but it is interesting.

 

This is amazing

 

I agree with this logic -- seems likely that The Knights of Ren are adherents of the first Sith (Ruin) or of whatever predates the Sith (Aftermath's reference to the Acolytes of the Beyond and the dark side originating beyond the known galaxy). In any case, they would be picking up a lineage and attempting to course correct the errors of Sidious that led to his downfall.

Personally, I think it would be interesting for them to view the Sith as a failed dark side institution, and their goal is to establish a new dark side power with a more authentic legacy that predates the Sith.

 

Pure speculation, but here's another possibility that avoids the KoR being an unrelated "outside group"; one that's just been twiddling their thumbs, eating popcorn, watching the galaxy spiral into chaos...

*The Aftermath novel suggests that once the New Republic was established, a group of Imperial loyalists retreated deep into unknown space, in search of what Palpatine referred to as "the source of the dark side". Presumably, these are the Imperialists that become The First Order.

*The retreating Imperialists/FO encounter the Knights of Ren on an unknown remote planet. The Knights appear ancient and technologically primitive (they can't seem to create a lightsaber that doesn't spit plasma everywhere). If the Knights do not have hyperdrive technology, they could have been stuck out in the shadows, away from the conflict, without a choice. Perhaps this is why the Knights need to join up with the First Order - they need their technology, because...

*The Knights of Ren are very concerned about these "awakenings". They do not want any Force users existing outside of their cult. What if the Knights Of Ren were the original cult of Force users? Perhaps the first Jedi was a Knight Of Ren who rejected the dark side and managed to escape. Hence, the Knights Of Ren are obsessed with finding, absorbing, or destroying all other force users, especially Jedi. Once the First Order provided the Knights with hyperdrive capabilities - their first mission would be to wipe out Luke's school, because...

*The Jedi Way involved schooling 1000's of Force users, training them to passively serve the powerless. This idea is hugely offensive to both The Sith and the Knights Of Ren. They believe that the weak should serve the strong, not the other way around. They do not want their prominence in the Force diminished by 1000's of tepid Jedi tapping into it. This explains why the KoR would want to eliminate Luke, but also why they might revere Vader. If the KoR are aware of "Force awakenings", then certainly they sensed when Anakin was born. A child conceived by the Force grew up to lead the slaughter of the Jedi; to the KoR, this vindicates their philosophy - the Force doesn't want to be manipulated by 1000's of Jedi who simply serve the weak. In the recent EW article, JJ or Kasdan points out that no one else knows that Vader sacrificed himself to kill Palpatine and save Luke. The galaxy at large does not know the full picture - they're going to have a skewed point of view. It will be interesting how the Knights Of Ren may differ from the Sith - just like it will be interesting to see how Luke's philosophy may differ from the Jedi of the Republic era.

 

Thank you!

 

Teen Goat I love some parts of the Idea
they are the balance and for too long they have allowed the force outside of their group
it grew and became many different groups
what they are doing is not "evil" in their eyes, they are just trying to restore the force
they don't see it as light against dark..."I am immune to the light"
they see the jedi and the sith as the same