SPOILER Obi-Wan Kenobi Ep. 6 Discussion

That pretty much described her character arc.

 

So, I watched that little clip. And yes, while he calls Joseph a mentor and the one that made him question these mythological things, that also doesn’t mean that every little thing is that deep. The clip also doesn’t any thing that wasn’t already known, as we did know that The Hero’s Journey was a core to Star Wars.

for example, you pointed to green lightsaber meaning something in the chakras…. But, iirc, we have quotes that the whole green lightsaber thing started because the blue saber color of the past 2 films wouldn’t show up well against Tatooine’s sky.

these remarks…I’m sorry but they feel a little…condescending? you’re calling us illiterate? That we only wanting to “talk about shiny toys” just because we don’t go as deep into mythology as you do, on things that may or may not be actually intended as myth symbols when the story was being written? Because that’s what these sound like. That just because we don’t talk about things that deeply, that we’re “symbol illiterate,” which also gives the feeling of “these things I’m saying are facts,” when I don’t currently see anything that suggests they are. They’re your reads of these things, which is fine, but they aren’t the only way, which is the vibe I get from these remarks.

mythology is a core of Star Wars, yes, but there is also a point where we have to stop and ask “was this intended by the writer/director, or is this something I’m reading into it because I want to?” I’m a Christian, so there’s a degree to where I look at stuff and try to see things that echo things I believe. Does that mean they were intended that way? Not necessarily.

 

Lucas didn't look to Campbell until Star Wars was just about to begin shooting when George had a crisis of confidence about whether his story ideas and material would have the popular appeal he hoped his movie would achieve.

 

I've never heard that criticism before. What makes you think that?

George did have an education and one of his primary interests is anthropology. Campbell's ideas are very much about the universal human experience so if he hadn't heard of him before, he certainly did by college. But I can't imagine that George thought Campbell was going be the selling point that would promote his movies to the masses. It's not exactly what the kids sit down to read on a Saturday afternoon.

 

So many combat callbacks/nods: the remake of Scene 38, TFU & TFU2 alt ending, KotOR & the Comics.

***

Most of all, I love that Kenobi's lightsaber sounded like the Darksaber in the second part of their duel.


Almost as if the blade was responding to the righteous fury of its creator.



Also:

Those little jabs & stabs that old Ben makes in Star Wars towards Vader's chest plate look WAAAAAAAY better now.

 

It's not a criticism. And i'm not saying that Lucas hadn't heard of Campbell. (He had but apparently didn't have a need to really read him until a certain point. It's just a fact that Lucas only really referred to Campbell when he had more or less finalised the script for Star Wars and he took reassurance from Campbell's description of the tropes and conventions of tales, myths and legends (ones that have "sold" for centuries), at a time when his colleagues and contemporaries were struggling to understand why he was bothering with all this mumbo jumbo. He wouldn't have got there already without his education. But it's just not true that Lucas used Campbell as the basis or a guide for constructing his myth. But Campbell did give him renewed confidence that his instincts were correct. The oft heard critique that "Lucas did x because Campbell said y and z..." is misleading. Maybe there are times when George's intent can be compared with something Campbell observed and related. But it's not a rule of thumb.

 

The premise behind Campbell is that the archetypes and mythologies and symbolism are universal. As humans, we understand and use them instinctively because they're part of who we are. (If you're trying to use them, you're probably not doing it right!)

So maybe, as you say, George was just recognizing that his story did indeed fall into those Jungian/Campbellian structures. I don't think he ever claimed that he sat down with a "Campbell manual" and wrote his stories according to it. He would know perfectly well that's not how the Force archetypes work.

 

Second watching. This scene is the best acting, IMHO, that I have ever seen in Star Wars. A close call-back to the Rebels episode of "Twilight of the Apprentice". The way the voice modulator varies from Vader to Anakin matching the lighting, just amazing and really spoke to me. Absolutely beautiful.
While I enjoyed Reva's redemption, the whole Tatooine/protect Luke scenes just felt slightly corny to me. I once again really wish that Star Wars gave better references to how much time all of these actions take but you can wish in one hand....
And they finally played the "Imperial March". I found it strange they didn't use that score with Vader more often. A mistake in my opinion.

I hope they do more with Reva as a character, possibly joining the Path with a culmination of her facing off against the Inquisitors or Vader. But it felt like they were done with her character, the whole "you are free" bit.

Anyways, in closing my final feelings are:

 

No I don't think he did either. But many have often repeated that claim on his behalf.

 

Campbell was as influential as Flash Gordon. No more, no less.

 

The whole ‘Hero’s Journey/monomyth’ idea is just a metaphor for puberty, guys. It’s about the transition from adolescence into adulthood - growing up and becoming your own person. That’s why it’s so universally relatable. Literally everybody goes through some version of it. Each culture has their own unique spin, but they’re all ultimately talking about the same thing. If you focus too much on the symbolic trees, you might just lose sight of the allegorical forest.

 

Star Wars is literally Corvette Summer & THX 1138 blended together and sprinkled with space wizards, walking carpets, iron lungs and glow sticks.

 

True, but it isn't only about adolescence. It can also be about discovering a new aspect of yourself, such as your heart (Mandalorian) or your faith (Rogue One). It's more universally about growth as as person.

On the other hand, given that it's so often about puberty, no one should be surprised that there's phallic and yonic imagery in Star Wars. (We just don't have to talk about it in detail if the mods nix it. )

 

I totally agree. People don’t just reach a single state of maturity and then stay that way. We’re constantly growing and evolving and transitioning into different identities and personas. So the metaphor always stays relevant. A ‘coming-of-middle-age’ story is just as relatable as a ‘coming-of-age’ story.

I just mean that we should be careful to not let the subjective interpretation of iconography steal the emphasis away from what the parable itself is actually trying to tell us. Sometimes a cigar really is just a cigar.

 

For all those who have complained about inconsistencies created by this series… this is a great point. That was a HUGE plot hole that GL created that he had to smooth over with the “certain point of view” comment. So having to just go with the story line and not think too hard about it has always been part of the deal with being a SW fan (let’s not think too hard about the Leia/Luke kiss).

It’s like we watched these shows as kids, fell in love with the OT and put it up on a pedestal (I’d agree rightfully so) then we grew up took some literature or film making classes and have judged everything that came after on a completely different bar than we were able to enjoy the OT.

I just try to enjoy what’s being put in front of me.

 

The story was set up in such a way that it made rolling with G. Walton's current fancy or, latest whim.... the best of rides. That, and it was the 80's/


Life before the internet was grand. It was totally cool to get kissed by the girl that no one knew was your sister. This includes George Lucas.


A.) - There was no tongue, so it wasn't gross or anything.
And - B.) - We all knew Lucas pulled that crap out of a dead Bantha's ass.

 

I'm surprised they did not digitally de-age Mark Hamill to play 10 year old Luke. Or maybe they did...

 

Meanwhile...I've thought they had some previous encounter since 1983 or at least thought it was possible and since 2005 I've considered it a near certainty.

So it works really well for me.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 19, 2022, Original Post Date: Aug 19, 2022 ---

Direction and dialogue matter and actors hone their skills over the years.

No mystery to unravel there.

 

I never had a problem with Hayden's performance in "AOTC". I was especially impressed by his acting in the scene that featured Shmi's death.