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Anakin Skywalker- The Anti-Luke

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Bluestreaking, Apr 7, 2015.

  1. Bluestreaking

    Bluestreaking Imperial Grand Admiral with Bluish skin

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    So as some of you know I'm spending my hermitage at my parent's home rewatching Star Wars, it's enlightening everytime I go through it such as my realization that Kasdan's dialogue is far superior to Lucas's dialogue. Anyway, as I made the transition to the PT I once again cringed at just how whiny Anakin is, so unlike the legendary Darth Vader he becomes. Well I made a realization about what Lucas was probably going for, I'm sure I'm not the only to notice this and it is inspired by comments I have read from other people.

    Anakin was designed to be the polar opposite of Luke. When do you ever hear Luke complain of people "holding him back" he had none of the advantages his father did as a jedi, his first master died a short while into his training and Luke abandoned his second master to save his friends. A great example between Luke and Anakin can be made from their actions in Episode V and Episode II respectively. In Episode V Luke abandons Yoda against Yoda's pleas in order to save his friends, in contrast Anakin meekly agrees with Obi-Wan to abandon Padme in order to continue on their mission to stop Dooku.

    Anakin jumped at the chance provided to him by Qui-Gonn, yes he did ask his mother if he would see her again but he never said he didn't want to go. Luke on the other hand didn't want to abandon his aunt and uncle despite how badly he wanted to get off Tatooine, it took the death of his family and destruction of his home to get him to go.

    Where Luke grows calm and rational, Anakin grew hot-headed and impulsive. Luke has Vader crushed before him but turns away, refusing to kill since it was the Jedi way. Yes it was his father, but his father had also just threatened Luke's sister. In contrast Anakin hesitates before killing Dooku, but his weak will leads to him killing the Sith lord anyway.

    There were many things I think went through Vader's head as he watched the Emperor torture Luke, he thought of Mace's death, he thought of Palpatine's betrayal of Dooku, he thought of Padme's pleas for help as he choked her. But he also saw how Luke had all of his struggles but none of his advantages and instead of blaming others for his shortcomings Luke rose above them to become a greater Jedi then he ever was. It was an enlightening moment seeing just how different his son was from him, and Anakin realized it was time to stop feeling sorry for himself and be the Jedi he was meant to be.

    While the idea is a great one, I think Lucas messed up with the execution. Instead of people seeing how Anakin was the antithesis of Luke, we instead had everyone complaining how whiny Anakin was. Lucas has these brilliant ideas but the PT shows his struggles with actually committing them to paper without help. There are plenty of other examples I can think about, but I wanted to see everyone else's thoughts on the matter.
     
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  2. Stormagadon

    Stormagadon Cantina Court Jester
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    I can't tell you how many people I've ranted something similar that to over the years!

    Easily one of the reasons it's hard to see at first is the poor script, and how it's all assembled and portrayed. That's why I wanted Anakin to be nicer, wiser, smarter, and just an all around better person! That way we can see the depths of his failures, and why we should be disappointed when he falls to the Dark Side. That's something we don't want to happen, and throughout out this trilogy we should be praying every second that Anakin will be rise above it, yet we know how the story goes. Basically, we should be depressed after watching Revenge of the Sith because we loved the character so much, and because the character had so much potential!
    Instead, we get a whiny, spoiled, selfish, rude and arrogant brat for a main character, and we don't connect with him. We don't connect with his complaints, his struggles, or his victories because we don't care about him. By the time he becomes Vader, I was sarcastic and thought "Didn't see that coming!" because there was no other option for this jerk to choose. Why would he want to be a Jedi when everything he has done has been the opposite of what a Jedi does! That's why we are not surprised when he falls.

    That's why if Anakin was more like Luke, we would be more disappointed at the end, and why and the end of Return of the Jedi we should be crying tears of joy: Anakin has been restored.
     
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  3. MarsPhoenix

    MarsPhoenix Sith Psychiatrist

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    I totally agree with you @Bluestreaking

    Even if I enjoyed (I still do) the prequels, it fails the most important aspects it had to cover.

    - Anakin's transformation into Darth Vader
    - Anakin's friendship with Obi Wan
    - Why Luke and Leia were hidden.

    I won't blame Jake Lloyd of Hayden for that, but George Lucas.



    OT: Anakin was the best starpilot ever, a powerful Jedi, a pupil and a good friend to Obi Wan.

    1 - Ok, Anakin was a great podracer, so was Shebulba. A pilot? We see glimpses of that in ROTS... but was he so extraordinary? Clonetroopers were fighting most of the space battles.
    2 - A Powerful Jedi? Ok, he loses his first battle with Dooku like an amateur, Obi Wan never sees him defeat Dooku... And Anakin loses to Obi Wan in ROTS. The rest of the screen time together, Anakin is an ordinary Jedi with bad temper.
    3 - Pupil to Obi Wan? Never quite established... We never properly see Obi Wan teaching Anakin, much more like lecturing him all the time.
    4 - A good friend? Have you felt any friendship between Anakin and Obi Wan in th PT?

    OT: Vader was seduced by the darkside of the Force.

    1 - Obi Wan never actually questionned Anakin on why he was acting the way he did in ROTS.
    2 - By slaughtering Sand People? It's a little weak no? Why did he turn against Mace Windu like that and jump in Palpatine's boat so easily when two scenes before, he sells him to the Jedi Council as being the Sith Lord they were looking for... a little weak. Why the darkside seduction, when Padme is still alive? It could have worked better if Padme was dead, and Anakin sells his soul to the devil to ressurect her. In any cases... it's a little weak and rushed... and Anakin's fall should have been spreaded over the course of the 3 movies... and driven by his choices, not his personality.

    OT: Luke and Leia were hidden from Vader.

    1 - Rushed in mere minutes scenes at the end of ROTS... no reason given why they hide them like that.
    2 - Why Luke and Leia were seperated? They could both have been raised by Bail Organa.


    Ect ect...

    IMHO... The Prequels were set at the wrong period from Anakin's life. I still don't understand why The Phantom Menace is set with Anakin at such a young age. There is no point for the "council" to sense Anakin as dangerous. By doing it so, then why Obi Wan is talking about being "seduced" by the Darkside if it is something that you can sense very early and just discard youngling with Force sensitive aptitudes that could fall in the future.... Dooku was a Jedi Master and has become a Sith Lord.....Wasn't he on the Jedi Council?

    By the time Revenge of the Sith came out, there was only a movie left to tie the trilogies, and that is why we are left with so many questions unanswered.

    In an ideal PT, Anakin would have been very similar to Luke Skywalker... But making different choices at the end. On screen, they are, indeed, the opposite.
     
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  4. Ziyos

    Ziyos Rebel Trooper

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    Driving a podracer is very difficult.
    In fact, Anakin is the only Human, who can. Sebulba is no Human, he is a Dug.

    Dooku has been a Jedi for decades. He is a strong enemy. In AOTC Obi-Wan can't beat him, too. He can't in ROTS either. While Anakin defeats Dooku. The reason why Obi-Wan defeats Anakin is because of experience. (Anakin is about 25 in ROTS)

    10 years pass from TPM to AOTC.
    It is not shown on screen, because it would be boring. Luke only gets a crash course.[/QUOTE]

    Yes, I have. I felt a deep feeling of friendship and respect.

    Anakin's turning IS throughout the hole PT. Remember in AOTC, when he says, he should me almighty? After the death of his mother. He turns to the dark side to save his wive, who he knows, WILL die. Seeing her death was not a dream, but a vision.

    Who long do you want them to talk about it? The climax of the movie is over, the movie has to to end soon otherwise viewers will start to get bored.

    They are seperated, because if one is discoverd the other has still a chance to survive. And also, who would expect twins?

    If they are too similiar it's boring.
    Of course Anakin gets easy in rage. He will become Vader after all.

    I like Anakin more than Luke. He is the more interesting character.
     
    #4 Ziyos, Apr 7, 2015
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2015
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  5. Bluestreaking

    Bluestreaking Imperial Grand Admiral with Bluish skin

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    I understand the desire to have Anakin be more like Luke to make him more likable but I actually think the Anti-Luke is a good plot device, I just wish it was handled better.

    The point would be to show that Anakin and Luke are inherently different, they got put in the same situations but Luke responds like a true Jedi.
     
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  6. Stormagadon

    Stormagadon Cantina Court Jester
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    So just out of curiosity and to see your reasoning, how does that make him redeemable by the time Return of the Jedi comes around?
     
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  7. Cole

    Cole Force Sensitive

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    He finally makes the choice of a true Jedi...
     
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  8. Stormagadon

    Stormagadon Cantina Court Jester
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    Quite right, but that doesn't mean he is redeemed. There isn't any restoration, just finally acting like a Jedi.
     
    #8 Stormagadon, Apr 8, 2015
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2015
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  9. Bluestreaking

    Bluestreaking Imperial Grand Admiral with Bluish skin

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    His son finally makes him take on the role of the chosen one.

    Anti-Luke or not Anakin was still a hero, TCW actually shows this for example.
     
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  10. Stormagadon

    Stormagadon Cantina Court Jester
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    Okay. Your first point I totally agree with.

    Sure, TCW show it to some extant, but as far as the movies go, we have no reason to like or want to like Anakin. I feel that's important to his character that we should like him, and that's why his fall is so tragic. Things like slaughtering the Sand People, and killing Dooku help show his failures, but those are only two of all the other problems.

    Yes, he should have plenty of problems. We know he was like that because of what Yoda says to Luke in ESB, but we need to see some good in Anakin during the PT. That's why Luke wants to redeem him. There's no point in trying to save him if the only time we've seen him he's out of control, selfish, arrogant and rude. Those are important, and even Luke shows those traits, but we see more in Luke. We see good in Luke, and we should see that in Anakin too.

    In some ways, Anakin is not a hero. He is a circumstantial hero. His actions just so happen to be helpful (killing Dooku), but we never see him actually choose the moral high ground (part of that is the poor philosophy in the PT), but we never see him "Good." He never does anything wise, or selfless for the sake of his friends, it is entirely for his own sake. Which I guess proves your point about him being the Anti-Luke, haha!

    But I hope you see what I'm getting at: If Anakin is fully an anti-Luke, we have no reason to like him, and he has ground to be a hero, which makes his fall predictable, and his redemption a bit empty because he was never redeemed, just corrected.
     
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  11. Bluestreaking

    Bluestreaking Imperial Grand Admiral with Bluish skin

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    Anakin was a different sort of hero than Luke, being different from Luke doesn't really mean you still can't be a hero. By the end of VI Luke was a very white knight sort of hero, pure and honorable. He of course developed into this from a more rash and impulsive hero in V and someone who was controlled by their emotions. In a sense he takes on the best aspects of Obi-Wan and Yoda.

    Anakin in contrast was a blood knight, he knew since a child that he was the chosen one and powerful in the force. He had all the same negative traits Luke had in V but never grew out of his ambition and ego. Mostly he was a troubled Anti-Hero, which like we've said is a contrast to the pure heroism of his son. Media is riddled with tons of well-known and beloved Anti-Heroes but the proper execution was lacking in Star Wars
     
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  12. Talon Karrde

    Talon Karrde Rebel Official

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    I really think there are really three Anakins, PT-wise.

    Anakin Mk.1: AotC, CW: As grating as it is to watch this character, the fundamental issue with this portrayal is not his manchild antics. It is, as Jensaarai1 pointed out, that Anakin Skywalker is a psychopath.
    This leads to whole slew major issues, not the least of which is the question of whether Anakin should be worthy of redemption. I do like the idea of the massacre in that it shows that Anakin had already taken a walk on the dark side before becoming Vader. It also fits well with how real psychotic criminals tend to build up to their most heinous acts. Still, thats the whole problem with this version; there's not really any "good in him" to begin with. The 'good' people saw was really just a sociopath working the systems of power. This Anakin is effectively the PG version of Patrick Bateman (American Psycho).

    Anakin Mk.2: RotS: A significant improvement; Anakin is portrayed more as a man torn between two worlds. Very tolerable, but at the same time very dull; 'manakin skywalker'. I still see the manchild, but it's very suppressed... at least until he becomes Vader. I'll credit that to the rewrite. He's also still a sociopath, but far more subtle.

    Anakin Mk.3: TCW: This one is, IMHO, the best of the three. It's a slightly darker, more brutal(both physically and verbally) version of Luke. Pretty much in line with what I thought It's not 'Anti-Luke' in terms of the common definition, but it is 'Anti-Luke' in terms of the "Other than" defenition of the prefix. The psycho is gone; he's human. Had this version been given to audiences in 2002.. Hayden would likely have had the career George promised him.

    The most fustrating thing of all is that, in the end, his Anti-ness did not lead to his downfall. Now, to George's credit, I will acknowledge that how he originally wrote the second arc of RotS this stuff would have factored in because Anakin would have been the spawn of Palpatine. But by rewriting the second arc, Lucas rendered much of psycho-manchild stuff meaningless. Anakin now falls to the darkside in a desperate attempt to save Padme's life. Your generic hero could have done that.
     
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