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Jabb the Hutt scene in ANH?

Discussion in 'Original Trilogy' started by Kylo Solo, Mar 1, 2019.

  1. Kylo Solo

    Kylo Solo Force Sensitive

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    How do you guys feel about the scene that was added in with Jabba for the later editions of ANH where he encounters Han? I've heard that some people don't like it cuz Jabba is supposed to be this big time gangster dude and he just allows Han to walk all over him (literally) and is too friendly towards him. Honestly, I've never had a problem with Lucasfilm adding it in later. I mean, its Han freakin' Solo. He gets to do whatever the hell he wants. Jabba still remains the big gangster boss

     
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  2. daRinze

    daRinze Rebel Official

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    What bothers me the most is the aspect of Jabba, who looks very different from his other scenes.
    The CGI is way too much visible in this scene, compared to the whole movie.
    Especially the eyes.
     
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  3. NinjaRen

    NinjaRen Supreme Leader

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    I don't really like it mainly because of three reasons:

    1) Bad cgi. As @daRinze already mentioned Jabba looks nothing like the ROTJ Jabba.

    2) It slows done the pacing of the movie. This scene doesn't add anything new. Everything we need to know about Jabba was already told by the Greedo scene. The Jabba scene is just there because it's possible and to have Boba Fett in ANH.

    3) It doesn't fit with Jabba's character. For me Jabba doesn't seem like a guy who would go to debtors in person. No, he sends bounty hunters etc.
     
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  4. Angelman

    Angelman Servant to the Whills & Slave to the Muses
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    I absolutely love that scene, how it informs Han Solo's arc by introducing his nemesis and how it plays up the Space Western thing. It demonstrates Solo's fearlessness and cool, while also underlining his motivations for going on the adventure and establishes the very real threat of his debt to Jabba; it's an effective example of the "show, don't tell" maxim of writing, Jabba's threat (i.e. "show") being MUCH more effective than Solo just expositioning to Chewbacca (i.e. "tell") about how much trouble he's in. The inclusion of this one scene greatly broadens, IMHO, ANH and colors Solo's arc throughout.

    Of course, the CGI execution has not aged well (although it is much better than the original restored version of the scene from back in 1997). I really, really hope LFL releases new versions of all the OT films at some point -- in a boxed sett with the theatrical release and possibly the current BluRay version or something -- with 21st century restorations and CGI, and I wouldn't mind they add or change even more things to enhance the OT films. (I REALLY want to see Biggs Darklighter stuff put back into ANH or better still, the Cassian show).

    That said, while the CGI looks unreal now, I have no more problem with that than the rubber-glove hands of Greedo & Ackbar, or the stick-toppled AT-AT, or the reused Tarkin scene, rubber-puppet Yoda, soles of the Chewbacca-costume shoes, Emperor Palpatine's wonky contact lenses, or the numerous other times that productions bleeds through into Star Wars. I wish we could have pristine versions of the OT films, but it would have to address all the "faults", not just the CGI.
     
    #4 Angelman, Mar 1, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2019
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  5. NinjaRen

    NinjaRen Supreme Leader

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    It's actually not a great example of "show, don't tell", but a bad one. At least IMO. This scene shows that Jabba isn't much of a threat and easily dealt with. Furthermore "show, don't tell" only works without the Greedo scene. With the Greedo scene it's more of a "firs tell, then show" moment.
     
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  6. Messi

    Messi Force Attuned

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    Never had a problem with the scene, even the CGI its ok to me.

    And back in 1997 was cool to see this scenes at the teather. I was 13 and I was amazed with the news scenes of the SE.
     
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  7. Angelman

    Angelman Servant to the Whills & Slave to the Muses
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    Let's agree to disagree.

    Of course Jabba isn't a physical threat; he's a gangster and probably a bit of a coward, which is why he sends bounty hunters to do his bidding. But it is nice to see him getting out of his den to deal with the rogue smuggler in person.
     
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  8. Jaxxon

    Jaxxon Jedi Commander

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    I don't hate the scene, but it definitely subtracts more than it adds.

    1) CGI Jabba simply doesn't look like practical Jabba, even when they improved the animation.
    2) The "stepping on the tail" gag comes at the expense of plot. Jabba is supposed to be a threat. If Han is comfortable stepping on his tail, it really robs some of the looming doom.
    3) the scene is redundant. We learn nothing we don't learn from Greedo. Without it, we had all we needed.
    4) it takes away the strength of the Jabba reveal in ROTJ.

    To me, it's just a perfect example of the main flaw of the special editions: so many of the changes don't add to the story but stand out from the story, like you can feel Lucas showing off the new technology.
     
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  9. SegNerd

    SegNerd Rebel General

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    I like the scene. It introduces the Jabba story arc more clearly instead of just having him be an unknown character who doesn't appear until ROTJ,
     
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  10. deadmanwalkin009

    deadmanwalkin009 Rebel Official

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    I personally wasn't bothered by it (even now) as a kid when the SE came out since I was like 9. One thing that did bother me was the way Jabba reacted when Han stepped on his tail. That always bothered me for some reason. Also, I think George was trying to test the waters for the CGI Jabba that appears in Episode 1. This CGI Jabba looks more in common with it's Episode 1 counter part than ROTJ.
     
    #10 deadmanwalkin009, Mar 1, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2019
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  11. Trevor

    Trevor Protector of the Jedi
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    I actually enjoyed the scene being added for what it was, because it put a face on Jabba.

    I remember watching ANH in theaters and on VHS and CED, and always wondering who Jabba was, so it's addition at least gave us an intro to him right away without having to wait.

    Now the poorly aged CGI is another thing, but like you said, it's really no worse that rubber hands and mask of Greedo or Ackbar.

    And YES....I'd really would love the Biggs/Luke scene at Tosche Station inserted into ANH, because (like the Jabba scene), I've always felt like it would've lent a little background and depth.
     
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  12. Daddy_Stardust

    Daddy_Stardust Rebel Commander

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    Totally agree for the EXACT same reasons you've posted, except I do absolutely hate it.

    The biggest issues are the last two; namely the redundancy of it and ESPECIALLY the fact it spoils his reveal in ROTJ.

    We hear about him for two movies, we have no idea what he looks like but know he's a massive threat in Han's life. We've seen plenty of aliens by the end of ESB, but all have been largely humanoid man-in-a-mask affairs. To finally come face to face with the vile gangster and discover he's a morbidly obese and monstrously cruel giant slug who enjoys baroque, toads and opium was a wonderful reveal that I expect audiences weren't expecting (I can't remember seeing it for the first time, was watching the OT so many times on video as a kid that it all become just a solid memory of always knowing 'Star Wars').

    The same goes for the Emperor; we get the tiny little intro in ESB (originally by another actor... and an ape) then we get our big reveal in ROTJ and he's far beyond are expectations of what the emperor really was after being spoken about for so long.

    ROTJ was our big reveals for the ultimate threat to the rebellion and the ultimate threat to selfish old Han... having the Jabba scene in ANH totally flatlines that and it serves NO purpose whatsoever after the Greedo scene. It also weakens him as Greedo was there to kill him, whilst Han himself can walk on Jabba's tail and have no repercussions.

    Also why in the ANH:SE scene the word "boy" is spoken as "boogie" in Huttese and yet in ROTJ it was "ye". That's always annoyed me... :confused:

    On another matter, it also spoils the pacing of Luke and Ben being followed by Garindan...
     
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  13. eeprom

    eeprom Force Sensitive

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    Wow, hot take.

    There’s so many reasons why this addition is atrocious, but I’ll just focus on one: "We're a little rushed, so if you'll hurry aboard we'll get out of here." They're “a little rushed” because Han just killed one of Jabba’s goons and found out there’s a huge price on his head. He has to get the hell out of there and quick.

    The premise adds weight and urgency to the Han character’s motivations. He NEEDS that money or he’s a dead man. Those are the stakes. So when he later willfully delays paying his debt in order to help Luke and the Rebellion, we have a deeper understanding of what a noble gesture that actually is. He’s placing the safety of others above his own.

    The amicable parting of ways he has with that horrifically animated CG Jabba (in which he dictates terms for some reason) negates all that. They reached an understanding. He’s no longer in eminent danger. It needlessly diminishes those elements for no actual benefit to the story. I have oh so many more complaints, but I’ll leave it at that. Make sense?
     
    #13 eeprom, Mar 1, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2019
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  14. Obi5Kenobi

    Obi5Kenobi Rebel General

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    Wow. I had never thought of the line about being pressed for time in relation to the encounter with Greedo. It's amazing how there are still new things to discover about Star Wars. Thanks!

    I don't like the scene because Han is way too bold with Jabba. The conversation worked better with the human stand in. With the CGI Jabba, which is still terrible, it doesn't work. The ONLY reason I can think of to explain Han's boldness is that, at this time, Jabba isn't as big a player as he is when ROTJ comes around. If Jabba was small time in the ANH period, maybe it would work, maybe.

    Also, Jabba's reveal in ROTJ was huge, as others have said. This ruins it.

    Finally, I wonder if we need to reconsider how Star Wars is watched now. Many of the things that were huge reveals to me in 1980 and 1983 may already be common knowledge to my kids (or even a few adults who have told me they haven't seen any Star Wars) when they are old enough to see Empire and Jedi. Star Wars is so prevalent that I suspect that someone watching Empire for the first time will already know that Darth Vader is Luke's father. Someone watching Star Wars for the first time today will likely already know what Jabba looks like, if they follow a little bit of pop culture. Maybe we need to look at Star Wars as a whole instead of how we grew up with it, even though that makes me a little sad.
     
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  15. daRinze

    daRinze Rebel Official

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    Yes.



    Of course, the line "I am your father" is very known outside SW.
    Even my daughter knew it before she ever saw a single movie.
    But the fact is that line is known, but not its context. The line is certainly a reveal, no doubt, but the biggest reveal remains what it does change in Luke's mind (and in our mind, also).
     
  16. Rodney-2187

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    Why would anyone add anything to a movie that won an Oscar for editing?
     
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